Scripture and Creation.

Doubting Thomas · Jan 17, 2003

Jiminey Cricket: May I suggest a few good reading assignments? For a decent historical overview of evolutionary theory that was written with the "novice" in mind, I heartily recommend Blueprints: Solving the Mystery of Evolution by Maitland Edey with contributions by Donald Johanson (the discoverer of "Lucy").

After that, go to the source: Darwin's Origin of Species. There were some things, like the mechanism of heredity, that Darwin got wrong, but the book holds up surprisingly well after over 150 years. No one explains natural selection more clearly than the man himself.

Then read as much of the material at the talkorigins website as your schedule will allow.

Once you have these under your belt, read a good college-level textbook on evolutionary biology.

Jerry Smith is right. You have a wonderful journey ahead of you. Enjoy!

Freodin · Jan 17, 2003

Why is the Ego such an important thing that it must exist eternally?

I really don´t like the thought that I won´t be here very much - but I see a lot of reasons that this is so, and no reasons for the opposite.

Lanakila · Jan 17, 2003

AS well as reading the pro-evolution things check out Behe, trueorigins.com, answers in genesis, icr.org ect, for the balanced view.

Sinai · Jan 17, 2003

Originally posted by Micaiah:
Assuming this English text accurately reflects Scripture, give a summary of the clear assertions of these verses in your own words? Focus on the physical aspects of creation that have scientific implications.

The scriptures posted by Micaiah (from NKJV):
) 1 In the beginning God created the heavens and the earth. 2The earth was without form, and void; and darkness was on the face of the deep. And the Spirit of God was hovering over the face of the waters.
3Then God said, "Let there be light"; and there was light. 4And God saw the light, that it was good; and God divided the light from the darkness. 5God called the light Day, and the darkness He called Night. So the evening and the morning were the first day.

The first verse is an especially profound statement, since it begins by asserting:
A. There was a beginning (of time, of all matter and of the physical universe);
B. But even at that beginning point God [Hebrew elohim] already existed;
C. God created out of nothing [Hebrew bara]
D. "the heavens and the earth" (English translation). It should be noted that although this is a correct translation, it is equally correct to translate the phrase as "the universe", since "heavens and the earth" is the Hebrew equivalent of the English word "universe."

The second verse tells us that the earth was formless, void and empty--but you are likely to get different interpretations as to what that means. It could mean that the earth was created but was without any form or substance, and was devoid of the necessary building blocks to support life. But it could just as easily mean that the earth was not created in the beginning, but that it was formed some time after the initial act that created the universe.

The second verse also says that darkness was over the surface of the deep; We are later told in verses 3 and 4 that the major development occurring on yom one (other than the initial creative act) was that light separated from the darkness. And the verse tells of the weruach elohim (Spirit of God or Wind of God) hovering over the surface of hammayim, which is most commonly translated as the waters, but can also mean the chaotic mixture or blend. It might be noted that approximately 800 years ago--well before modern scientific discoveries--noted Jewish Hebrew scholar Maimonides said this phrase may mean the building blocks of the universe--that chaotic mixture from which all the stars were formed.

Hector Medina · Jan 17, 2003

Never use Talk Origins as a source.

Its filled with tons of rumors.
Quite possibly worse than over here.

In Christ,

Hector

lithium. · Jan 18, 2003

Originally posted by Hector Medina
Never use Talk Origins as a source.

Its filled with tons of rumors.
Quite possibly worse than over here.

In Christ,

Hector

LOL did you say rumors? Yep you did, and guess what you are completely wrong. The worst site on the Inet is AIG there is no facts there at all. But if someone wants to use a flawed and illogical, and plain wrong source it's fine with me.

LiveFreeOrDie · Jan 18, 2003

Originally posted by Hector Medina
Never use Talk Origins as a source.

Its filled with tons of rumors.

Provide one example, please.

RufusAtticus · Jan 18, 2003

Originally posted by Lanakila
AS well as reading the pro-evolution things check out Behe, trueorigins.com, answers in genesis, icr.org ect, for the balanced view.

Don't forget fixedearth.com for an entirely balanced view.

Chris H · Jan 18, 2003

Originally posted by Hector Medina
PLEASE NOTE:

The definition did not apply to Micro-evolution which does occur:
Diffrent Breeds of Dogs,Cats,etc......

Changes within kinds which is really variation and is scientific.

God Bless,

Hector

How then do you explain the Miacids which are a reasonable common ancestor for both Cats and Dogs?

Chris

Chris H · Jan 18, 2003

By the way, it was through reading ICR, AIG, True Origins, Etc. that I gave up my belief in creationism. Once I realized how little substance creationism had, I was willing to look seriously at evolution. Having seen the evidence for evolution, I don't ever see myself going back to being a creationist.

Chris

JohnR7 · Jan 18, 2003

Originally posted by Freodin
Why is the Ego such an important thing that it must exist eternally? 

Ego and pride are things we do away with as christians.

Douglaangu · Jan 18, 2003

John, in the past on this board, havn't you refused to admit your mistakes and errors, even when shown many, many times that you were wrong?

Could this not be considered prideful behavior?

lithium. · Jan 19, 2003

webboffin · Jan 19, 2003

JohnR7, I think that is a bit unrealistic in the real world.

sulphur · Jan 19, 2003

To R7,you have no pride in your work or your children???

Freodin · Jan 19, 2003

Originally posted by JohnR7
Ego and pride are things we do away with as christians.

That´s why I have heard also.

So why is it that the continuation of the Ego is the single most important thing for Christians?

Hector Medina · Jan 19, 2003

Live Free Or Die,
Here:

It is recommended, but not required, that you do not use information from the Talk Origins Archive, or Answers In Genesis as the main support for sources, nor the main source for the start of threads. The joy of thinking for yourself includes the joy of researching answers on your own apart from these two clashing source points, though they provide a good starting point to find other information. The reason we discourage the use of these sources is that many times the debate is an ongoing process between these two behemouths anyways, and people taking one side or the other will simply copy verbatim the other side's arguments and post them here. There are other venues to engage directly with Talk.Origins or Answers In Genesis; Christian Forums is not one.

I will admit that,I do use info from websites but never AIG or Talk Origins.

In Christ,

Hector

sulphur · Jan 19, 2003

I refer again to pride in your work and your children. If you have neither are you are true christian man

webboffin · Jan 20, 2003

I think JohnR7 meant pride in a different meaning

Douglaangu · Jan 20, 2003

Like being too proud to admit when you're wrong?

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