Saving Christmas, Take Two

[Autumnleaf]

Who does he think he is telling women to be joyous as they take care of their homes during the holidays? I'm with you. Women should definitely be peevish as they grudgingly go about what they have to do for others during the holidays. Same with men. We should all be honest about how we really don't like it and we're just going through the motions of what is expected of us.

 

[seeingeyes]

Who does he think he is telling women to be joyous as they take care of their homes during the holidays? I'm with you. Women should definitely be peevish as they grudgingly go about what they have to do for others during the holidays. Same with men. We should all be honest about how we really don't like it and we're just going through the motions of what is expected of us.

Honest question: When is the last time that you told someone to be joyous, and how did that work out?

 

[RedPonyDriver]

Who does he think he is telling women to be joyous as they take care of their homes during the holidays? I'm with you. Women should definitely be peevish as they grudgingly go about what they have to do for others during the holidays. Same with men. We should all be honest about how we really don't like it and we're just going through the motions of what is expected of us.

Its funny...I read through some of these posts and all I can think is that there are a bunch of very unhappy men floating around. There is a lot of derision over the term "feminist", there is a lot of talk that women don't go through the battles over equal wages and opportunities and that women would be much happier if we all stayed home, became SAHM/SAHW and sit back and let the men run everything.

Some folks watched way too much "Leave it to Beaver" and "Father Knows Best" when they were growing up. They can't understand that those shows were an idealized look at life.

 

[DZoolander]

It must be pretty much a generational/geographic thing.

When I was growing up in the 70's and 80's in Los Angeles - it was pretty much understood that women had the freedom to decide whatever they wanted to do. Some women aspired to careers - some women aspired to stay home - whatever.

As a result - the idea of a woman being in the workforce and/or doing whatever she wants the same as a man strikes me as being about as unusal/controversial as the idea that water is wet.

 

[seeingeyes]

...as unusal/controversial as the idea that water is wet.

Hold the phone. What's this?

 

[DZoolander]

Consider your mind blown

 

[seeingeyes]

Consider your mind blown

I'm calling 911. Somebody's gotta hear about this.

 

[Annessa3]

Who does he think he is telling women to be joyous as they take care of their homes during the holidays? I'm with you. Women should definitely be peevish as they grudgingly go about what they have to do for others during the holidays. Same with men. We should all be honest about how we really don't like it and we're just going through the motions of what is expected of us.

Yep, and that honesty is why I quit making any effort at holiday decorating a few years ago. I would have been doing it alone, and been mad about it. So I just didn't.

This year, I will happily pull out the old decorations and make myself happy

 

[Hetta]

All of this is true, but I can't even reach that point of the argument. I can't get past the question, "Why should I, a mother of 16 years, take advice on motherhood from a has-been teen idol who make terrible movies for a living?"

I just don't get the draw. Why would anyone allow this guy to have even a modicum of authority in their lives is beyond me.

Because Kirk Cameron. Duh.

 

[DZoolander]

Isn't the answer to that question painfully obvious? lol

People love their pharisees

 

[RedPonyDriver]

Isn't the answer to that question painfully obvious? lol

People love their pharisees

I wish I could remember the quote in French...but something to the effect of the more things change the more things stay the same.

 

[Inkachu]

I will say that I LOVE Christmas. It was pure magic for me as a kid, and I still feel the bittersweet nostalgia around this time of year. However, the older I get, the more I want to savor the reality of what Christmas IS rather than the bazillion expectations that come cascading down on us sometime around Thanksgiving. All those gotta's. Gotta have a tree, gotta bake, gotta decorate, gotta shop, gotta give gifts, gotta send cards, gotta go caroling, yadda yadda yadda. Sucks the joy and the sacred beauty right out of what the actual EVENT is all about. I stopped giving cards a while ago. Last year, I didn't do a big tree (just a little table tree). This year, we're not doing gifts at all. I plan to do more "adopt a family" events, where I can use the money I'll be saving to buy gifts for needy families; a thousand times more rewarding, btw! And it's not that we're going to observe Christmas LESS... we're actually going to be able to enjoy it MORE, because we'll have so much more TIME and energy to spend together, just enjoying the season. We can still enjoy the beautiful carols and decorate if we want to, and watch Christmas movies with hot chocolate. We're just scaling wayyyy back on the "you MUST do this or it's just NOT Christmas!" mentality. Christmas is a remembrance. It's not a series of items on a checklist.

 

[NothingIsImpossible]

I can't stand Kirk but I do agree about Christmas is far to much about other things then it is Jesus. Especially in our country. As with holidays like Halloween Christians tend to make excuses for how they celebrate it. And I notice in most cases the people who get into the non-Jesus end of it have kids. As parents to many give into what their child wants. Santa, costumes, candy, presents...etc.

Long ago our nation used to be full of parents who acted like parents. Now parents are taught to be 100% friend to your child instead. Which is why the generations below me seem to be going nowhere. They are more worldly then I have ever seen.

As for Kirks comment about "Wife doing...etc". While likely he did mean it as a "This is your job women...", I also feel people often become hyper-sensitive about this stuff. We read every word someone says looking for any way to complain about them. If I say "I love that one meal my wife cooks for Christmas!", am I saying women should only cook? Of course not. I cook also. But instead we judge by what little we know about someone.

I tend to say this in a lot of posts but the problem is America I think. Gives me an idea for a quote.

 

[Inkachu]

I don't think my reaction is 'hyper sensitive'. A man telling a woman how to be a woman is preposterous. Like I'd sit here and say "Ok fellas, this is how you need to act in order to be a good husband and father..." Who am I to tell you how to be a man? If he wanted to say "This is what MY wife does at Christmas, and it makes our home joyous" that's one thing. That's not what he said. Not even close. He made it a statement to ALL wives, to ALL mothers. Open mouth, insert foot.

 

[DZoolander]

I can't stand Kirk but I do agree about Christmas is far to much about other things then it is Jesus. Especially in our country. As with holidays like Halloween Christians tend to make excuses for how they celebrate it. And I notice in most cases the people who get into the non-Jesus end of it have kids. As parents to many give into what their child wants. Santa, costumes, candy, presents...etc.

Were you raised by the Grinch or something, where there was no Santa, no gifts, etc?

My dad would be 90 years old this upcoming year if he was still around - and his folks raised him with Santa, presents, etc. I was raised with Santa, presents, etc. It certainly didn't make my dad a non-productive leech on society, nor did it me.

The truth is - since time immemorial the elder generation talks about how decadent the newer generations are and how they are just "missing something". Heck - I remember reading some quote found by one of the Greek poets bemoaning the worthlessness of the generation(s) following his.

Future generations will be just fine, and they'll be bemoaning the lack of work ethic by their kids as well.

 

[DZoolander]

...and as a side thought...the part about "Especially in our country" leaves me wondering.

What countries that celebrate Christmas have it more about Jesus than we do? We're probably one of the most Christian countries around. Most are a good deal more secular than we are - and those that aren't secular - usually ain't Christian.

 

[Hetta]

I wish I could remember the quote in French...but something to the effect of the more things change the more things stay the same.

Plus ça change, plus c'est la même chose.

 

[RedPonyDriver]

Plus ça change, plus c'est la même chose.

Thank you!

 

[NothingIsImpossible]

I don't think my reaction is 'hyper sensitive'. A man telling a woman how to be a woman is preposterous. Like I'd sit here and say "Ok fellas, this is how you need to act in order to be a good husband and father..." Who am I to tell you how to be a man? If he wanted to say "This is what MY wife does at Christmas, and it makes our home joyous" that's one thing. That's not what he said. Not even close. He made it a statement to ALL wives, to ALL mothers. Open mouth, insert foot.

Oh no, I agree with you. His past comments show hes basically telling wives "This is your role, do it!".

Were you raised by the Grinch or something, where there was no Santa, no gifts, etc?

We had a tree and gifts. But Santa early on I was taught is not a christian thing to take part of. Eventually we got rid of a tree too. We don't really do gifts anymore just because money is tight. For me the holiday has always been commercialized to much. We may know its about Jesus, but more often we look more forward to the christmas songs (not related to Jesus), santa, christmas trees...etc.

...and as a side thought...the part about "Especially in our country" leaves me wondering.

What countries that celebrate Christmas have it more about Jesus than we do? We're probably one of the most Christian countries around. Most are a good deal more secular than we are - and those that aren't secular - usually ain't Christian.

I mean to say that Christianity in this country has changed allot. We are more accepting of things that we used to call worldly. And polls show more and more are either turning away from their Christianity. I think its due to the fact that as a christian surrounded by me worldly stuff, people can't take the hassle of being harassed by others who don't like we have "outdated views".

Curious.. when did you become a deist? I thought your icon was different a few months back?

 

[RedPonyDriver]

I don't think my reaction is 'hyper sensitive'. A man telling a woman how to be a woman is preposterous. Like I'd sit here and say "Ok fellas, this is how you need to act in order to be a good husband and father..." Who am I to tell you how to be a man? If he wanted to say "This is what MY wife does at Christmas, and it makes our home joyous" that's one thing. That's not what he said. Not even close. He made it a statement to ALL wives, to ALL mothers. Open mouth, insert foot.

I never took anyone's advice on how to be female anyway....I sure as heck wouldn't take the advice of some washed up has-been.