Santorum Calls for End of Public Education...

[Nurbz]

Except that he doesn't what to do away with public schools altogether. Why is it so many seem to have such a hard time distinguishing from FEDERAL government involvement in something and all government involvement in something? He's calling for an end to, or a very drastic reduction in FEDERAL government control and involvement in public education.

Federal standards for education as well as money need to go towards education one way or another because not everyone can afford elementary education. It was pretty involved back in the days people reminisce about when they things like "taking their country back", and it wasn't demonized by politicians looking to funnel money into private contractors pockets in exchange for kickbacks and vast amounts of campaign contributions

 

[Ernst Junger]

very few atheists are comfortable with evolution when it applies to humans. Particularly when it applies to humans above the neck.

 

[chaz345]

what does it matter if the federal government is in charge of it? How would state control be better?

Because at a state level an individual or group of individuals without a huge organization and huge financial backing can actually have an influence on how things are done. You know parents actually having an effect on how their own kids are actually taught.

 

[chaz345]

No they don't. I think our schools can do better, but I don't think they're doing amiserable job.

When you've got students in a college science lab class who can't do basic algebra, solving for a single variable, yes they are doing a miserable job. When you've got kids graduating high school who can't read at a 6th grade level, yes they are doing a miserable job.

 

[Prayer Circle]

Has anyone else noticed that the more confident Santorum gets in the polls the, um shall we say, stranger his political point of view, enlightening the observer as to what kind of leader he'd make, becomes?

31 Rick Santorum Quotes That Prove He Would Be A Destructive President

29. “I think we should send a very clear message that if you are scientist from Russia or North Korea or from Iran, and you are going to work on a nuclear program to develop a nuclear bomb for Iran, you are not safe.” ~Rick Santorum, stating his intentions to kill Russian, North Korean, and Iranian citizens which would be an act of war.

30. “I would be saying to the Iranians, you either open those facilities, begin to dismantle them and make them available to inspectors or we will degrade those facilities though air strikes. And make it very public that we are doing that. Iran would not get a nuclear weapon under my watch.” ~Rick Santorum, threatening war with Iran.

I've said it before but I can't help it in light of those quotes, in yet again thinking of "The Dead Zone" and Santorum so easily likened unto Martin Sheen's character Politician/Presidential hopeful Greg Stillso, when Conservatives now condemn Obama for keeping us in Iraq and Afghanistan.

And all this after Bush43 sent us there. As if a Republican in the oval would change the war propensity seemingly inherent in the "liberal message".

The Dead Zone (Christopher Walken) - President Martin Sheen starts a nuclear war - YouTube




On The Issues:
Every Political Leader On Every Issue

Rick Santorum on Education
Click here for 27 full quotes on Education OR other candidates on Education OR background on Education.

I should not have voted for No Child Left Behind. (Jan 2012)
Our education system doesn't serve the customer. (Sep 2011)
One-time $500 contribution to every low-income child. (Apr 2006)
Rich people already have school choice; give it to the poor. (Apr 2006)
1990s: School uniforms happen to be a good idea. (Apr 2006)
Family, religion, and schools: most fundamental institutions. (Apr 2006)
Comprehensive sex ed has no impact on pregnancy or STD rates. (Apr 2006)
Home-schooled six children with wife Karen. (Apr 2006)
Multiculturalism insists we teach about comic books. (Apr 2006)
Expose kids to legitimate debate of evolution & creationism. (Mar 2005)
Teach about disagreements in biological evolution theories. (Jun 2001)
Kids are trapped without choice in the public schools. (Jun 2001)
More teachers & more funding just means more of the same. (Apr 1998)
Voted NO on $52M for "21st century community learning centers". (Oct 2005)
Voted NO on $5B for grants to local educational agencies. (Oct 2005)
Voted NO on shifting $11B from corporate tax loopholes to education. (Mar 2005)
Voted NO on funding smaller classes instead of private tutors. (May 2001)
Voted NO on funding student testing instead of private tutors. (May 2001)
Voted NO on spending $448B of tax cut on education & debt reduction. (Apr 2001)
Voted YES on Educational Savings Accounts. (Mar 2000)
Voted YES on allowing more flexibility in federal school rules. (Mar 1999)
Voted YES on education savings accounts. (Jun 1998)
Voted YES on school vouchers in DC. (Sep 1997)
Voted YES on $75M for abstinence education. (Jul 1996)
Voted YES on giving federal aid only to schools allowing voluntary prayer. (Mar 1994)
Rated 27% by the NEA, indicating anti-public education votes. (Dec 2003)
Make employee educational assistance tax-deductible. (Jan 1993)



RELATED ARTICLE:
Santorum Opposes Early Childhood Education
by Kristina Chew
August 5, 2011 (Link)

(Quote/Excerpt from Link)(sic)"...“Obviously, socialists love children, just like they love people in groups of one million or more.”

Santorum, who was a US Senator for 12 years before being defeated in 2006, has said that he and his wife, Karen, are or will be home-schooling their seven children through the eighth grade."


Santorum: Public Education Is “Anachronistic”
by Jessica Pieklo
February 19, 2012 (Link)


Dear God my Father,
Save us from Santorum's vision for America. He was ousted in a landslide from the Senate by a landslide in 2006. Please Father, don't let him achieve a higher seat in 2012.

 

[mpok1519]

Because at a state level an individual or group of individuals without a huge organization and huge financial backing can actually have an influence on how things are done. You know parents actually having an effect on how their own kids are actually taught.

How does that improve the quality of education? What does it matter if parents are influencing what their kids are taught? why does everyone automatically assume parents know whats best for their kids when its blatantly obvious that parents make horrible decisions for their children everyday?

 

[mpok1519]

When you've got students in a college science lab class who can't do basic algebra, solving for a single variable, yes they are doing a miserable job. When you've got kids graduating high school who can't read at a 6th grade level, yes they are doing a miserable job.

I'm sure there will always be bad students. This is usually because a kid's parents aren't too bright. I don't know if we can blame schools for genetics. A school can't unbrainwash a kid who has been brainwashed to be an idiot by their parents their whole lives.

If a college student can't do basic algebra, then how did they even get to that level? In my highschool you had to pass algebra just to move up a grade. If a kid can't read at a 6th grade level, why were they passed on up to 7th if they couldn't complete the requirements for the preceding grade?

 

[chaz345]

How does that improve the quality of education? What does it matter if parents are influencing what their kids are taught? why does everyone automatically assume parents know whats best for their kids when its blatantly obvious that parents make horrible decisions for their children everyday?

Why does everyone assume that the government knows what's best when it's blatantly obvious that the government as a whole and the individuals involved make horrible decisions every day?

 

[chaz345]

If a college student can't do basic algebra, then how did they even get to that level? In my highschool you had to pass algebra just to move up a grade. If a kid can't read at a 6th grade level, why were they passed on up to 7th if they couldn't complete the requirements for the preceding grade?

EXACTLY my point. The schools are passing students through when they are plainly not meeting the requirements. Any guess as to why? Because if too many fail, the federal government steps in and takes money away.

 

[Theofane]

@Edwin Miller

I am 100% behind abolishing the department of education and eliminating every federal involvement in public education. The federal government has no business - and certainly no constitutional authority - for being involved in this nation's public schools. None.

Who would run and pay for the public schools if not the US federal government?

 

[mpok1519]

Why does everyone assume that the government knows what's best when it's blatantly obvious that the government as a whole and the individuals involved make horrible decisions every day?

Why assume parents know whats best?

 

[mpok1519]

EXACTLY my point. The schools are passing students through when they are plainly not meeting the requirements. Any guess as to why? Because if too many fail, the federal government steps in and takes money away.

and no child left behind was a conservative championed bill. So go fig.

 

[Nurbz]

Why does everyone assume that the government knows what's best when it's blatantly obvious that the government as a whole and the individuals involved make horrible decisions every day?

Parents don't have groups of educators and advisors from all fields of study to give them information on what would be better in terms of what things a child might learn best and in what order.

Besides, have you seen some parents? They have their kids on leashes and have fist fights at their kids' sports games, those people shouldn't be teaching children anything. Take a look around wal-mart and ask yourself if they seem fit to be an educator.

Most modern countries see education as an investment.

 

[EdwinWillers]

What would it be if it were ran by state tax dollars only? It would still be public.

...which is why I made the distinction between states and the federal government.

Except for the general welfare clause that says the federal government can levy moneys for the general welfare of the country. Education would be considered a factor of the country's general welfare.

< Heavy Sigh > You know, anyone who gives this argument the slightest thought would realize it's use is reason sufficient for its invalidity inasmuch as any appeal to it amounts to an "unlimited commission to exercise every power which may be alleged to be necessary for the common defense or general welfare" (Federalist 41). And you've just proven your argument invalid on that basis.

If you want to know to what "common defense" and "general welfare" refer, all you need to do is go to Article 1, Section 8 of the US Constitution and you will see it enumerated there, quite concisely and unambiguously.

...unless of course one WANTS an unlimited commission to exercise every power which may be alleged to be necessary for the general welfare.

The problem with that is a city or county can suddenly decide that creationism is scientific. Sure, the federal government can to, but, well, won't.

Well, so what if a city or county or state "suddenly decides" to teach that creationism is scientific? First, I doubt such a decision would be "sudden" but regardless, what business is that of yours or mine, or anyone else's who doesn't live in that city, or county, or state? It's NONE of your business or mine, which is PRECISELY why the federal government has no jurisdiction in these matters.

And seriously... think about it - with that statement you just promoted the argument FOR a precedent that would prohibit anyone teaching that, parents, churches, etc. Good grief - do you realize just how dangerous that is?

Oh, that article. Yeah, the school didn't take away the kid's lunch, the school simply supplimented another lunch to complete nutrition standards and then charged the parents a buck and some change. How does this at all warrant a comparison to nazis? Giving the kid some food and charging less than what some toll booths charge is on keel with trying to take over europe, genocide of the jews and chemical warfare? I think you're over exagerrating.

I don't think I'm over exaggerating one bit. And yes, they did take away the kid's lunch - sheesh! And it's irrelevant how much they charged the kid's parents - the whole point is that THEY DID. Good grief; do you not see the importance of that?

So, if a state wanted to get rid of the laws that say children must be educated, they should be allowed to do that, regardless of the detriment it would cause?

Yes. However your premise is fatally flawed. Do you really think a state would do that? C'mon. Besides, again, it's none of your business or mine what another state, or county, or city decides if we don't live there.

The problem with locally ran education is within the decided curiculumn; local officials can suddenly decide what is not scientific to be apart of the curiculumn. Thats just one of my worries. Here in Kansas some years back, the state board of education declared it would not teach evolution. Luckily enough people voted out those folks in the next election. Yet, not every state, county or city can be as lucky.

Well again with the "sudden" decisions. And again, you just cited the proper recourse a civilized society can, and will take to determine what is in their best interest, and that by their own definition, not by some "outsider's" definition of what constitutes their best interest.

You need to think this stuff through because your arguments are on par with setting very dangerous precedents (or entrenching ones that already exist) that themselves are far more "detrimental" to a society's best interests than what some group might "suddenly" concoct.

Frankly, you should be more worried about what some unknown entity suddenly concocts "for your best interest" whom you cannot stop via the democratic process. Such is the insidious nature of federal bureaucracies, manned by un-elected, un-named, faceless people with near unlimited power to dictate to you and me what is or isn't "detrimental" to our best interests - people whose definitions of "general welfare" are purely their own, and frequently (their frequency being irrelevant) exercise their power against what we would otherwise do in our best interests.

Who do you want dictating your best interests? You, or some faceless bureaucrat you don't even know, who doesn't even know you?

 

[blueapplepaste]

Kill the DoE and return power to the states. I know there'd be less indoctrination but I think the higher test sccores would be worth it. Don't you?

The whole indoctrination thing is silly. But I agree that local governments should have more say. But I still think there should be some national minimum requirements met.

However, the biggest problem in our schools, IMO, is lack of parental involvement.

 

[heymikey80]

Why does everyone assume that the government knows what's best when it's blatantly obvious that the government as a whole and the individuals involved make horrible decisions every day?

Because government is the poorly-controlled accumulation of the decisions of uninvolved individuals.

Wasn't it John Jay who wrote that an inefficient government was to be desired because then it could not be so oppressive against human rights?

And what person desires that any abuses of government control extend uniformly to every child of the nation? Any such abuse of power, once limited to a family, would be magnified by tens of millions of times when the federal government regulates with abuse.

I'm up for people again controlling the decisions they have rights to control over against the government, according to numerous Federal court cases.

I count it this way: public educational facilities may be mandated and provided in the event the family and then the education system of the state or local government makes no decision about the private education of their children. The family could be provided with the means of deducting educational costs directly from their income, or provided vouchers when their net income falls below a certain value.

 

[Paulos23]

However, the biggest problem in our schools, IMO, is lack of parental involvement.

I have to agree. Schools get treated as day care where the parent assumes that their kid is being taught their values, and are outraged when they find out they are not. If you want your kid to learn and have your values, you need to have a hand in the process and teach your kid know they are going to be exposed to different values.

That was one of the best lessons I had from my folks.

 

[JustMeSee]

Really? When exactly did Rick Santorum "call for the end of public education"? Can you tell me the date, time, and location at which Rick Santourm "called for the end of public education"? Better yet, can you post a video of Rick Santorum "calling for the end of public education"? And if not, is there any reason why I shouldn't classify your claim as a blatant lie?

Rick Santorum Wants to End State Public Education - YouTube

 

[AtheistVet]

Yeah, but did he say the words, "I call for the end of public education?"

Checkmate!!!!!1111one!

 

[jgarden]

How Corporations Have Mastered the Art of Not Paying Their Fair Share of Taxes

If they paid taxes proportionate to the benefits they get from government, US citizens would finally get the tax break they so desperately seek.

February 21, 2011

Corporate profits financed politicians' campaigns and lobbies to make sure that income tax receipts from individuals rose faster than those from corporations and that tax cuts were larger for corporations than for individuals. By the 1980s, individual income taxes regularly yielded four times more than taxes on corporations' profits.

Since the second world war, corporations have shifted much of the federal tax burden from themselves to the public &#8211; and especially onto the middle-income members of the public. No wonder a tax "revolt" developed, yet it did not push to stop or reverse that shift. Corporations had focused public anger elsewhere, against government expenditures as "wasteful" and against public employees as inefficient.

http://www.alternet.org/economy/149..._art_of_not_paying_their_fair_share_of_taxes/

If you like the rise of healthcare costs under the private sector, you'll love what will happen when they get total control of education in America.