Sanctification : How to be sanctified.

Sidon · Jul 4, 2021

Brightfame52 said:
Gave His Son not offered Him. Now Christ offered Himself to God as a sacrifice !

""But JESUS, after he had offered a one sacrifice for sins for ever, sat down on the right hand of God"

Thats the CROSS of CHRIST.

That's the Blood Atonement.

Brightfame52 · Jul 4, 2021

navair 2

4) " He that is of God heareth God’s words: ye therefore hear them not, because ye are not of God." ( John 8:47 ). <---- Why do some willingly listen to God's words and those words "sink in", having an affect on a person's conscience and spirit? This is answered right here.

Also I believe Jesus is declaring who it is that hears [spiritually] the word of God, He that is of God !

I understand that to mean being born of God, So I understand it, He that is born of God heareth Gods words. This coincides with what John taught in 1 Jn 5:1

Whosoever believeth that Jesus is the Christ is born of God: and every one that loveth him that begat loveth him also that is begotten of him.

You have to first hear to believe right ?

Brightfame52 · Jul 4, 2021

Sidon said:
""But JESUS, after he had offered a one sacrifice for sins for ever, sat down on the right hand of God"

Thats the CROSS of CHRIST.

That's the Blood Atonement.

Same thing friend ! Yet it has nothing to do with Jn 3:16 teaching that Christ is being offered to men !

Sidon · Jul 4, 2021

[QUOTE="Brightfame52, post: 76067025, member: 431997"

You have to first hear to believe right ?[/QUOTE]

Yes.

How can you believe if you have not heard?

"faith comes by HEARING, and hearing by the word of God".

A preacher Preaches and a person hears this.........its the message of the Cross.

You have to hear this message to be able to believe it.

All that believe in Jesus (the message of The Cross), Shall be saved".

Sidon · Jul 4, 2021

Brightfame52 said:
Same thing friend ! Yet it has nothing to do with Jn 3:16 teaching that Christ is being offered to men !

What God "gave" is His " only begotten Son", and that is the Gift of Salvation, given to the world". = Jesus dying on The Cross

John 3:16

Brightfame52 · Jul 4, 2021

Sidon said:
[QUOTE="Brightfame52, post: 76067025, member: 431997"

You have to first hear to believe right ?

Yes.

How can you believe if you have not heard?

"faith comes by HEARING, and hearing by the word of God".

A preacher Preaches and a person hears this.........its the message of the Cross.

You have to hear this message to be able to believe it.

All that believe in Jesus (the message of The Cross), Shall be saved".[/QUOTE]
You need to be born of God to hear spiritually. Thats what Jesus said Jn 8:47

Brightfame52 · Jul 4, 2021

Sidon said:
What God "gave" is His " only begotten Son", and that is the Gift of Salvation, given to the world". = Jesus dying on The Cross

John 3:16

Yes He gave His Son, not offered His Son, big difference !

Navair2 · Jul 4, 2021

Sidon said:
It's impossible to be born again, before you believe in Jesus.

Doesn't Acts of the Apostles 16:14 describe that very thing?
God opening a person's heart, so that they then listen to God's words?

Sidon said:
Its BECAUSE you give God your faith in Christ, that this happens...."faith is counted as Righteousness".

But according to His word,
Where does God-honoring faith come from, my friend?

" knowing that a man is not justified by the works of the law, but by the faith of Jesus Christ, even we have believed in Jesus Christ, that we might be justified by the faith of Christ, and not by the works of the law: for by the works of the law shall no flesh be justified.
17 But if, while we seek to be justified by Christ, we ourselves also are found sinners, is therefore Christ the minister of sin? God forbid.
18 For if I build again the things which I destroyed, I make myself a transgressor.
19 For I through the law am dead to the law, that I might live unto God.
20 I am crucified with Christ: nevertheless I live; yet not I, but Christ liveth in me: and the life which I now live in the flesh I live by the faith of the Son of God, who loved me, and gave himself for me." ( Galatians 2:26-20 ).

It is the faith of the Son of God, who authored it and finished it for us...
He then gave it to us, His people, and it becomes ours...

Just as any gift that God will never take back ( Romans 11:29 ) is.

Sidon said:
So, it would be interesting to find out what denomination has taught you that you can be born again, without faith, or as you described it...."after" the new birth.

I first heard my Saviour's words in 1978 during the preaching of them in an "Independent Fundamental Baptist" church...
That church also taught that God's gifts were reliant upon our actions, as men, instead of squarely on God's grace towards undeserving sinners.
That's part of why I no longer am an IFB / IB and I no longer belong to denominations.

I simply state what I see in the Scriptures when I read them for myself.

But if I were to compare my beliefs with a denomination, they would come closest to what is nowadays called a "Particular Baptist".

Navair2 · Jul 4, 2021

Sidon said:
Your verse is teaching that Jesus on the Cross, this blood being shed as the new covenant, is the "Gift of God".

I'm sorry to disagree yet again, but I don't see that when I read it for myself.
I see that my faith is clearly the gift of God.

Sidon said:
See, if you teach that faith is the Gift, then what is Jesus on the Cross?

My Saviour, who loved me and gave Himself for me.

Sidon said:
He's THE Gift.

I agree with that, to be sure.
As He told Abraham, " .... I am thy shield, and thy exceeding and great reward." ( Genesis 15:1 ).

Sidon said:
See that?
The GIFT.......is the END RESULT of God as Christ on the Cross, offering this... John 3:16

To me, the gift of eternal life, which is to know God and His Son ( John 17:3 ), was and is only gifted to those that were given to Christ by His Father ( John 17:2 ) and no others.
You don't make that connection when you read His prayer to Him in John 17?
I do.

I also see that the end result of Him dying on the cross was to save His people from their sins ( Matthew 1:21, John 10:11 ).

That said, I see that God gives His people many gifts to go along with their salvation...

Righteousness ( Romans 5:17 ),
Faith ( Ephesians 2:8 ),
The Holy Spirit ( Acts of the Apostles 2:38 ),
Eternal life ( Romans 6:23 ).

Also, given that Christ is the author and finisher of our faith ( Hebrews 12:2 ) which is the evidence of His work in us ( Hebrews 11:1 ), and that not all men have it ( 2 Thessalonians 3:2 ), I'm at a loss as to why you don't see that a person's faith and trust in Him was made possible by Him and Him alone.

For what do we as believers in Jesus Christ have, that we have not been given?
A man can have nothing except it be given to him from Heaven.

Navair2 · Jul 4, 2021

@Sidon :
Ultimately, "How to be sanctified" is the same to me as "How to be saved"...
There is no "magic formula" and there is no step-by-step method that He has given to us as obstinate sinners, that will ever result in our achieving a state of grace with the Lord above.

If that were the case, then we could potentially boast in those things, and not the Lord's grace and mercy alone towards us.
That is why the Scripture says, "not of works, lest any man should boast."

Our faith, our belief, our works, our desires as sinners have no bearing on who He decides to save, for his works were finished before the foundation of the world.

He will have mercy upon whom HE will have mercy ( Exodus 33:19, Romans 9:14-18 ).
He decides who, out of all of us who are responsible before Him for our willfully committed sins against Him and our hatred of Him and His Son as a race ( that's all of us, even His people who were enemies in their hearts and minds before He changed our hearts ),
Who to save and who to reserve for everlasting punishment in the Lake of Fire that burns forever and ever.

In other words,
I see that a person believes on His Son because they are already saved, from His vantage point...chosen in Christ from the foundation of the world.
They can do nothing to earn any of it, and they never could.
He blesses them and has set His love on them out of His own free will, and that is why they trust Him;
We love Him because He first loved us ( 1 John 4:19 ).

That said, I take my leave of your threads and wish you well, sir,
and may God's blessings from on high be upon you in this life and in the life to come.

Sidon · Jul 5, 2021

Brightfame52 said:
Yes.

You need to be born of God to hear spiritually. Thats what Jesus said Jn 8:47

You need to hear to be born again, is what you mean.

Sidon · Jul 5, 2021

Brightfame52 said:
Yes He gave His Son, not offered His Son, big difference !

"On the Cross".

Same "Son", = John 3:16

Sidon · Jul 5, 2021

Navair2 said:
A man can have nothing except it be given to him from Heaven.

Does that include your Cable bill and your internet connection and your power bill?

Sidon · Jul 5, 2021

Navair2 said:
@Sidon :
there is no step-by-step method that He has given to us as obstinate sinners, that will ever result in our achieving a state of grace with the Lord above.

The Grace of God is the "state of Grace" that you are looking for.....and to find that you do this..

Jesus said...>"You must be born again", and He's not talking about water baptism.

Brightfame52 · Jul 5, 2021

Sidon said:
You need to hear to be born again, is what you mean.

Thats backwards, thats like saying a person had to be able to hear to be born physically !

Sidon · Jul 5, 2021

Brightfame52 said:
Thats backwards, thats like saying a person had to be able to hear to be born physically !

You have to be told what Christ did for you on the Cross, before you can believe the message.

"faith comes by hearing". = The Gospel.

Brightfame52 · Jul 6, 2021

Sidon said:
You have to be told what Christ did for you on the Cross, before you can believe the message.

"faith comes by hearing". = The Gospel.

You still have it backwards . You have to be born to hear !

Sidon · Jul 16, 2021

Brightfame52 said:
Yes He gave His Son, not offered His Son, big difference !

Jesus is a "sin offering".
He replaced all that were the same, in the OT.
Notice that Jesus is offering His Blood and Body. ??

That the "offering".

BBAS 64 · Jul 16, 2021

Sidon said:
You have to be told what Christ did for you on the Cross, before you can believe the message.

"faith comes by hearing". = The Gospel.

Good Day, Sidon

Um... that is not (=)

It is causality statement:

So faith comes from hearing, and hearing through the word of Christ.

Faith comes (caused) by hearing, and the hearing comes from ( caused) by (though) the Gospel.

Consider Isa 6.

In Him,

Bill

Sidon · Jul 16, 2021

BBAS 64 said:
Bill

Hey Bill,

"from" or "by".....hearing. = "same difference".

And the "cause" of the "faith", is not the hearing, but rather its the holy spirit that enlightens the hearer to be able to believe.

See, its all spiritual, as all things with God are Faith, Spirit, and Truth.

And remember....>"God is A Spirit", not just "spirit'.
So, if your bible says...>"God is Spirit", and not the correct as given by the Holy Spirit as...>"God is A Spirit", then your "bible" is not making the distinction between the Holy Spirit and the unholy Spirit.
See those "2".
That is not a myth.
So, if your bible falsely identifies God as "spirit", only, then throw away that book, as its not a bible.

and in 1 Timothy 3:16.....if your version says...."He appeared" or "He who was manifested".... and not "God was manifested in the flesh", then throw away that version as it it not a bible.

Sanctification : How to be sanctified.

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