Sabbath And First Day

[prodromos]

If they are not Biblical then they are the traditions of man, and didd not come through the apostles.

They are indeed biblical and apostolic. The apostle Paul exhorts us in 2 Thessalonians 2:15
to hold fast to the traditions we were taught either by word or epistle.

 

[Jeepneytravel]

They are indeed biblical and apostolic. The apostle Paul exhorts us in 2 Thessalonians 2:15
to hold fast to the traditions we were taught either by word or epistle.

Biblical traditions, not the traditions of man....do you know the difference? The Apostles teachings do not differ from the Bible.

 

[prodromos]

Biblical traditions, not the traditions of man....do you know the difference? The Apostles teachings do not differ from the Bible.

I know that what you might call 'biblical traditions' are in fact modern interpretations of Scripture by men who will all claim they were guided by the Holy Spirit, yourself notwithstanding. How you determine that the tradition you follow it more or less true than the tradition which was passed down in the early Church? They were taught by the Apostles the meaning of what they wrote and handed that understanding down from each generation to the next. What makes you think you have a better understanding than them? They also had the Holy Spirit.

 

[Jeepneytravel]

What you are saying is not Biblical but your own erroneous opinion.

 

[prodromos]

What you are saying is not Biblical but your own erroneous opinion.

Right back at you bro.
Gotta love such such carefully reasoned and articulated responses. It really raises the bar in these discussions.

 

[Jeepneytravel]

Right back at you bro.
Gotta love such such carefully reasoned and articulated responses. It really raises the bar in these discussions.

....
What you got to do is rely on the Bible, and not so much on your personal opinion, or personal interpretations of what you think it says....example Jesus said "keep the commandments of God, and not the traditions of man" in Matthew, and yet you somehow feel Paul contradicts Jesus words on this subject....that is impossible

 

[prodromos]

yet you somehow feel Paul contradicts Jesus words on this subject.

Bearing false witness is right up there with murder and committing adultery. I advise you to retract as I have not implied nor do I believe any such thing.

 

[Meowzltov]

What you got to do is rely on the Bible, and not so much on your personal opinion, or personal interpretations of what you think it says

There is no such thing as reading the Bible without interpreting it.

 

[Jeepneytravel]

Bearing false witness is right up there with murder and committing adultery. I advise you to retract as I have not implied nor do I believe any such thing.

Glad to hear it..

 

[Jeepneytravel]

There is no such thing as reading the Bible without interpreting it.

That would be a good thing to tell the pope.

 

[Meowzltov]

That would be a good thing to tell the pope.

The Pope already knows. This is what the Church is for, to help interpret for us.

 

[bbbbbbb]

The Pope already knows. This is what the Church is for, to help interpret for us.

That is not entirely correct. The Catholic Church does not exist to help its members in their interpretation of Scripture. It exists to interpret Scripture for its members. Its members' role is to docilely believe whatever the Catholic Church tells them to believe.

 

[Meowzltov]

The Catholic Church does not exist to help its members in their interpretation of Scripture. It exists to interpret Scripture for its members.

If you were correct, the Church would supply a list of interpretations of each verse,but it does not.

 

[bbbbbbb]

If you were correct, the Church would supply a list of interpretations of each verse,but it does not.

The Catholic Church does not need to provide a verse-by-verse interpretation of the Bible because the Catholic Church's teaching authority rests not in the Bible alone, as in Protestantism, but in Holy Tradition, of which the Bible forms a part, albeit a significant part. Thus, the teaching authority of the Church extends to matters never addressed in the Bible. These interpretations of the Faith are requisite for the faithful Catholic to believe, not to interpret for themselves or to question.

In the matter at hand, although the Bible never mentions a commandment to worship on Sunday, the Catholic Church has included the tradition of worshipping on Sunday and has interpreted it as binding on all faithful Catholics. To willfully miss Sunday worship at mass for a Catholic is a mortal sin.

 

[1watchman]

Very sound ministry, bbbbbbbb! No man should threaten one with eternal condemnation for going against their religious ideas, as the RC religion has been doing for years. The true saints of God ("born again" believers as John 3) have Holy Scripture and the Holy Spirit to teach us, and we need not some high authority of man to dictate to us. One should note 1 Peter 2 to see the saints (all sanctified believers) are a "Holy" and "royal priesthood".

Well, I think this site has long since deviated from the original post.

 

[bbbbbbb]

Very sound ministry, bbbbbbbb! No man should threaten one with eternal condemnation for going against their religious ideas, as the RC religion has been doing for years. The true saints of God ("born again" believers as John 3) have Holy Scripture and the Holy Spirit to teach us, and we need not some high authority of man to dictate to us. One should note 1 Peter 2 to see the saints (all sanctified believers) are a "Holy" and "royal priesthood".

Well, I think this site has long since deviated from the original post.

Thank you.

 

[Meowzltov]

Catholic Church's teaching authority rests not in the Bible alone, as in Protestantism, but in Holy Tradition, of which the Bible forms a part, albeit a significant part.

Even Protestants admit it was this way before the canon of the NT was formed. What did Peter preach on Pentecost if not the Oral Teachings?

 

[bbbbbbb]

Even Protestants admit it was this way before the canon of the NT was formed. What did Peter preach on Pentecost if not the Oral Teachings?

Here is what Peter said -

4 But Peter, taking his stand with the eleven, raised his voice and declared to them: “Men of Judea and all you who live in Jerusalem, let this be known to you and give heed to my words. 15 For these men are not drunk, as you suppose, for it is only the third hour of the day; 16 but this is what was spoken of through the prophet Joel:

17 ‘And it shall be in the last days,’ God says,
‘That I will pour forth of My Spirit on all mankind;
And your sons and your daughters shall prophesy,
And your young men shall see visions,
And your old men shall dream dreams;
18 Even on My bondslaves, both men and women,
I will in those days pour forth of My Spirit
And they shall prophesy.
19 ‘And I will grant wonders in the sky above
And signs on the earth below,
Blood, and fire, and vapor of smoke.
20 ‘The sun will be turned into darkness
And the moon into blood,
Before the great and glorious day of the Lord shall come.
21 ‘And it shall be that everyone who calls on the name of the Lord will be saved.’


22 “Men of Israel, listen to these words: Jesus the Nazarene, a man attested to you by God with miracles and wonders and signs which God performed through Him in your midst, just as you yourselves know— 23 this Man, delivered over by the predetermined plan and foreknowledge of God, you nailed to a cross by the hands of godless men and put Him to death. 24 But God raised Him up again, putting an end to the agony of death, since it was impossible for Him to be held in its power. 25 For David says of Him,

‘I saw the Lord always in my presence;
For He is at my right hand, so that I will not be shaken.
26 ‘Therefore my heart was glad and my tongue exulted;
Moreover my flesh also will live in hope;
27 Because You will not abandon my soul to Hades,
Nor allow Your Holy One to undergo decay.
28 ‘You have made known to me the ways of life;
You will make me full of gladness with Your presence.’


29 “Brethren, I may confidently say to you regarding the patriarch David that he both died and was buried, and his tomb is with us to this day. 30 And so, because he was a prophet and knew that God had sworn to him with an oath to seat one of his descendants on his throne, 31 he looked ahead and spoke of the resurrection of the Christ, that He was neither abandoned to Hades, nor did His flesh suffer decay. 32 This Jesus God raised up again, to which we are all witnesses. 33 Therefore having been exalted to the right hand of God, and having received from the Father the promise of the Holy Spirit, He has poured forth this which you both see and hear. 34 For it was not David who ascended into heaven, but he himself says:

‘The Lord said to my Lord,
“Sit at My right hand,
35 Until I make Your enemies a footstool for Your feet.”’


36 Therefore let all the house of Israel know for certain that God has made Him both Lord and Christ—this Jesus whom you crucified.”

Peter assuredly did not proclaim "Oral Tradition" unless you happen to believe that the Bible (i.e. the Old Testament) is not the written Word of God. Peter quoted directly from the Psalms and the Prophets.

 

[prodromos]

Peter assuredly did not proclaim "Oral Tradition" unless you happen to believe that the Bible (i.e. the Old Testament) is not the written Word of God. Peter quoted directly from the Psalms and the Prophets.

And gave the New Testament interpretation of those prophecies, which were not yet recorded anywhere. None of the Gospels had been written and no Epistles had been written. The receiving of the Gospel was purely oral tradition at this stage and would be for many years to come.

 

[Meowzltov]

Peter assuredly did not proclaim "Oral Tradition" unless you happen to believe that the Bible (i.e. the Old Testament) is not the written Word of God. Peter quoted directly from the Psalms and the Prophets.

Where did Peter get the idea that those OT passages applied to Christ? There is nothing in those passages that mentions Jesus. Peter was TAUGHT these things by CHRIST. He is passing on those teachings.