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I posted this question in the Romans 9 thread but it just turned into an eschatology debate. I'm just wanting to focus on soteriology.
The question is, can someone with a Reformed view of soteriology explain the text of Romans 11 to me? It seems Paul is stating that some of the non-elect can be saved. Read on:
Paul states that Israel is divided into believers and non-believers:
1 I say then, has God cast away His people? Certainly not! For I also am an Israelite, of the seed of Abraham, of the tribe of Benjamin. 2 God has not cast away His people whom He foreknew. 5 Even so then, at this present time there is a remnant according to the election of grace.
So first off, Paul emphatically states that God has not cast off all Israel since Paul is an Israelite himself and then concludes that God has not cast of those whom He foreknew, so there is indeed a remnant of Israel who like Paul are believers "according to the election of grace"
No problem so far. But that's about to change. Reading on:
7 What then? Israel has not obtained what it seeks; but the elect have obtained it, and the rest were blinded. 8 Just as it is written:
“ God has given them a spirit of stupor,
Eyes that they should not see
And ears that they should not hear,
To this very day.”
9 And David says:
“ Let their table become a snare and a trap,
A stumbling block and a recompense to them.
10 Let their eyes be darkened, so that they do not see,
And bow down their back always.”
Two parts of Israel, one part elect, the rest are blinded. But what will become of the blinded part. You know, the part that is not elect?
11 I say then, have they stumbled that they should fall? Certainly not! But through their fall, to provoke them to jealousy, salvation has come to the Gentiles. 12 Now if their fall is riches for the world, and their failure riches for the Gentiles, how much more their fullness!
Very interesting. Paul is holding out hope for this non-elect part of hardened Israel. Read on:
13 For I speak to you Gentiles; inasmuch as I am an apostle to the Gentiles, I magnify my ministry, 14 if by any means I may provoke to jealousy those who are my flesh and save some of them. 15 For if their being cast away is the reconciling of the world, what will their acceptance be but life from the dead?
How can one read this another way? Paul begins by stating some of Israel are elect and foreknown by God and have not stumbled, but others of Israel were not believers, not elect and were blinded by God and cast off. But Paul then states that he is hoping to provoke them to jealousy and save some of them!
How can Paul really believe he can rouse and save some of the non-elect, blinded by God Jews? Can a non-elect person be saved?
The question is, can someone with a Reformed view of soteriology explain the text of Romans 11 to me? It seems Paul is stating that some of the non-elect can be saved. Read on:
Paul states that Israel is divided into believers and non-believers:
1 I say then, has God cast away His people? Certainly not! For I also am an Israelite, of the seed of Abraham, of the tribe of Benjamin. 2 God has not cast away His people whom He foreknew. 5 Even so then, at this present time there is a remnant according to the election of grace.
So first off, Paul emphatically states that God has not cast off all Israel since Paul is an Israelite himself and then concludes that God has not cast of those whom He foreknew, so there is indeed a remnant of Israel who like Paul are believers "according to the election of grace"
No problem so far. But that's about to change. Reading on:
7 What then? Israel has not obtained what it seeks; but the elect have obtained it, and the rest were blinded. 8 Just as it is written:
“ God has given them a spirit of stupor,
Eyes that they should not see
And ears that they should not hear,
To this very day.”
9 And David says:
“ Let their table become a snare and a trap,
A stumbling block and a recompense to them.
10 Let their eyes be darkened, so that they do not see,
And bow down their back always.”
Two parts of Israel, one part elect, the rest are blinded. But what will become of the blinded part. You know, the part that is not elect?
11 I say then, have they stumbled that they should fall? Certainly not! But through their fall, to provoke them to jealousy, salvation has come to the Gentiles. 12 Now if their fall is riches for the world, and their failure riches for the Gentiles, how much more their fullness!
Very interesting. Paul is holding out hope for this non-elect part of hardened Israel. Read on:
13 For I speak to you Gentiles; inasmuch as I am an apostle to the Gentiles, I magnify my ministry, 14 if by any means I may provoke to jealousy those who are my flesh and save some of them. 15 For if their being cast away is the reconciling of the world, what will their acceptance be but life from the dead?
How can one read this another way? Paul begins by stating some of Israel are elect and foreknown by God and have not stumbled, but others of Israel were not believers, not elect and were blinded by God and cast off. But Paul then states that he is hoping to provoke them to jealousy and save some of them!
How can Paul really believe he can rouse and save some of the non-elect, blinded by God Jews? Can a non-elect person be saved?
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