believe in Christ, not me or my beliefs. Seek him, not me or my ideology. What I prove or not prove means nothing and doesn't actually "create" Christ so don't listen to me, listen to Christ."Why should I believe what you believe, to believe in Jesus?"
I'd love to do that... but he doesn't answer his phone when I try to call.believe in Christ, not me or my beliefs. Seek him, not me or my ideology. What I prove or not prove means nothing and doesn't actually "create" Christ so don't listen to me, listen to Christ.
don't use the phone to talk to Jesus, it's probably not going to work that way. Either Jesus is real or he is not but nothing anyone says will change the actual truth. I am not suggesting you listen to other people about I'm suggesting you ask Jesus to reveal himself to you.I'd love to do that... but he doesn't answer his phone when I try to call.
Sorry for the snark, but seriously: "Christ" doesn't talk. "Christ" may not even have been real, and if he was, the person he's based on has been dead for almost 2000 years.
All we have is a book that allegedly recorded what he allegedly said... and for some of these things we already know that he didn't.
So what you are really saying here is basically: don't listen to what I say about Jesus... listen to what other people say about Jesus.
no one can tell you what to believe or not believe and no one can conjure up truth that never was there. Either it's there or it's not but and no amount of words or questions will change this. if you want to believe then start making the choices to believe. If you don't want to believe then stop asking "us people" to convince you of something you don't want to accept. The only person who has control over this is you, you exist in your own vacuum and will allow what you wish inside the vacuum and what you don't wish outside but none of that changes who God is.*Sigh*
Why is it that you people never listen?
See, that again is just another case of where you simply do not listen.no one can tell you what to believe or not believe and no one can conjure up truth that never was there. Either it's there or it's not but and no amount of words or questions will change this. if you want to believe then start making the choices to believe. If you don't want to believe then stop asking "us people" to convince you of something you don't want to accept. The only person who has control over this is you, you exist in your own vacuum and will allow what you wish inside the vacuum and what you don't wish outside but none of that changes who God is.
There is a spiritual war going on for truth.
Christians are not suddenly perfect so that all agree.
The bottom line is a relationship with the Creator not theology.
Square one is accepting what Jesus did for you personally.
Then the journey begins...
Because they assume religion is Jesus' teachings. It isn't. It is an institution unto itself. Each uses what is convenient to justify their own views, ways and environment. In other words they make God over in their own image instead of changing to suit His will.
Consistent doctrine amongst all believer's should be evident if they all share one unified spirit, don't you think?This is some sort of association fallacy. Just because one being perfectly knows a certain bit of information, it does not follow that everyone will know it perfectly.
But if that really was a "true friendship", a relationship of equals, or at least of equal valuing and caring... this would either have to be reciprocal, or irrelevant.
Consistent doctrine amongst all believer's should be evident if they all share one unified spirit, don't you think?
What if people exposed me to the wrong theology?
Well, for that matter, why should you trust what you can get yourself to believe? Possibly, you are not somehow superior to anyone else so you can be sure of getting it right.
Only if God has me get something right > either He does, or I have a problem.
If no one can trust what they believe themselves without Jesus intercession, then why is Christianity splintered with belief's? One God does not equal many conflicting belief's.
So, yes even children of God can vary in their understanding. But my experience is that often God's people do not disagree, but we each can make different discoveries about a scripture, then feed what we have to one another.Christians are not suddenly perfect so that all agree.
The bottom line is a relationship with the Creator not theology.
When you see people only saying they are right, merely in comparison to other groups, this can mean they are ones who are only trying to fit God's word to how they are and how they want to see things.they make God over in their own image instead of changing to suit His will.
So, yes even children of God can vary in their understanding. But my experience is that often God's people do not disagree, but we each can make different discoveries about a scripture, then feed what we have to one another.
So, in case all you are seeing is disagreement, often between whole groups, it is possible you need to discover how Christians are able to help one another. But we tend not to make a project of congratulating ourselves in comparison with others. But we can spend more time with talking about how we need to get more real with God and forgiving.
When you see people only saying they are right, merely in comparison to other groups, this can mean they are ones who are only trying to fit God's word to how they are and how they want to see things.
And yes our character can be our dictator of what we are able to understand and how we can see things.
So, any of us can do this; so we all need to trust God and depend on Him to have us getting things right. But our Heavenly Father does have us sharing and caring as family; so He does not have us finding things out, only by our lonesome.
You'd rather want to find out for yourself, is my attitude. You'd listen to the only one sure to know, Jesus of Nazareth, and try out doing exactly what He said. Any other path would seem putting faith in some perfection of some individual preacher or whatever, a total gamble."Why should I believe what you believe, to believe in Jesus?"
Oh, I thought you wanted to make a point... but sure, I'll give my thoughts.
This is based on my interpretation of your post, which in turn is based on my experience with several other Christians (and other people) making a similar point. A point from, let's say "indirect evidence".
There is X. X comes from Y. Thus Y.
Now the step that I, from my own various experiences, doubt is the second. Does X really come from Y? Does it only come from Y? If not... that would invalidate the whole line of reasoning, wouldn't it?
So... someone might be smart, good looking, lovable and successful. But if they base that on their haircut instead of their faith... or even a mystical supernatural intervention... what would we do to find out?
See, that again is just another case of where you simply do not listen.
Either something is or is not. Yes, I would agree. So, does it make a difference? Can we tell the difference?
Believe it or do not believe it. I cannot tell you what to believe or what not to believe. If you want to believe, believe. If you don't want to believe, do not believe.
Right?
Wrong!
If there is a difference, if it makes a difference, then there has to be a way to find out. A real way. Not a way of "decide for yourself".
The square root of 2 is or is not an irrational number. I can tell you which. I can show you. I can guide you through a way to find out. I can take you through each single step and we can find out if this is correct or not. And if, after all that, you still do not "accept" it... you are just wrong.
Now for most of us, in most situations, it is completely irrelevant whether the square root of 2 is irrational or not. And still there is an answer.
But in this question, a question that your faith says it literally a question of life and death... the answer is just "meh, accept it or don't. I don't have anything to show you."
You might disagree... but at least listen to why we say what we say. Why we object what we object. Why we doubt what we doubt.
Consistent doctrine amongst all believer's should be evident if they all share one unified spirit, don't you think?
No - it is an interactive relationship with the Spirit of Truth via imperfect individuals, but core beliefs are agreed on.
Added to this the Father if Lies wants to get his oar in and twist truth if he can - Temptation of Jesus is a case in point.
No real believer argues against Jesus being risen in the flesh. Read the Gospels and make your choice... True or not?
If Jesus resurrected why didn't he stay down here on Earth? The usual excuse is that he work down here was done, Hmmmmmmmmmm!
God needed time for all the forums on the internet to come along to show the difference between ways of man and ways of God and the prejudices that dictate what is allowed on said forums which like with the Pharisees, usually favour the institutions of man.If Jesus resurrected why didn't he stay down here on Earth? The usual excuse is that he work down here was done, Hmmmmmmmmmm!
He tells us to deny our self, not our responsibilities. Essentially it is a focus of changing our ambitions to give glory to God rather than self.If Jesus actually asked people to leave their responsibilities and follow him that was not or a good or responsible thing to do, imo.
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