Is respect gained by being demanded or by being earned? For example, if I demanded that you respect my views, would you be more inclined or less inclined to respect my views and me as a person or would it make no difference? What if I tried to force you to respect my views? What would you think of my views and me then?
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CF has always been a site that welcomes people from different backgrounds and beliefs to participate in discussion and even debate. That is the nature of its ministry. In view of recent events emotions are running very high. We need to remind people of some basic principles in debating on this site. We need to be civil when we express differences in opinion. No personal attacks. Avoid you, your statements. Don't characterize an entire political party with comparisons to Fascism or Communism or other extreme movements that committed atrocities. CF is not the place for broad brush or blanket statements about groups and political parties. Put the broad brushes and blankets away when you come to CF, better yet, put them in the incinerator. Debate had no place for them. We need to remember that people that commit acts of violence represent themselves or a small extreme faction.
Respect
- Thread starter 3sigma
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Apollo Celestio
Deal with it.
- Jul 11, 2007
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Being earned. Some will give it to you merely for a title, but even some small things can be seen as earning. Informing one of the title is something that would make them give you respect.
Trap, yah?
Trap, yah?
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Maybe it would be a good idea to explain what exactly you mean when saying "respect"?
Personally, I agree or disagree or disagree with someone´s views, and I voice my agreement or disagreement. In any case, I am assuming that the other person has subjective reasons through which they arrived at their view.
Possibly, there are views that I find so far off that I don´t find them worth discussing. Would that be the point at which I am to conclude that I don´t respect them?
Could you describe a scenario in which someone is forced to respect a view and how this is done?
If you´d use anything but reason, logic or explanations (and, first of all, walking the way you talk) to deliver your views I guess I´d think "poor delivery".
In my terminology and view "respect" is sort of the default attitude - thus, for me, the question would rather be "can it be lost and if so how?"
I´m still not sure about the meaning you use "respect" in. How do I tell whether someone respect someone else´s views / doesn´t respect them? How do I tell whether I respect someone´s views or don´t?
Personally, I agree or disagree or disagree with someone´s views, and I voice my agreement or disagreement. In any case, I am assuming that the other person has subjective reasons through which they arrived at their view.
Possibly, there are views that I find so far off that I don´t find them worth discussing. Would that be the point at which I am to conclude that I don´t respect them?
I think of "respect" as an inner attitude. I have no idea how I could possibly be forced to respect a view.
Could you describe a scenario in which someone is forced to respect a view and how this is done?
My opinion about your views is - hopefully - not affected by the way you deliver them.
If you´d use anything but reason, logic or explanations (and, first of all, walking the way you talk) to deliver your views I guess I´d think "poor delivery".
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Im using the dictionary meaning of the verb respect, which is to consider worthy of high regard and to refrain from interfering with. So if I demanded that you respect my views, I would be demanding that you consider them worthy of high regard and that you refrain from interfering with them. In other words, I would be demanding that you not criticize my views regardless of their intrinsic merit or lack thereof and regardless of whether you disagree with them.
Suppose I threatened you with some form of personal injury if you criticized my views or failed to consider them worthy of high regard. It could be financial injury, abridgment of your rights or physical harm. If I did that, would you be more inclined or less inclined to respect my views and me?
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Would you say then that the demands and threats are counterproductive? That while, outwardly, you may feign respect for my views, inwardly, the demands and threats would make you less inclined to respect my views and me as a person?
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Actually, you seem to be using one of four possible uses of the verb respect (not counting the 8 definitions for when it is used as a noun). What I find in the dictionary:
And I think you are looking at this wrong. Typically when people demand to have their views "respected", they are likely using it to say that you should "have regard or consideration for" -- that you just don't dismiss the idea out of hand because it isn't your idea.
Very often the idea of respect is even based on the idea of the next definition, such as when gays say they want respect. They are not demanding that you consider them "worthy of high regard", rather they are wanting others to "refrain from intruding" or "interfering" in their lives.
I think most of the problem here is that words such as "respect" and "tolerance" have a wide range of definitions and people often craft arguments like you are here saying that respect has to be earned when people ask to be respected, when typically all they mean is that we should be courteous to them and respect their rights as a human.
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People who do that get laughed at and ridiculed. I knew a Sergeant in the Marines who acted like that and I felt bad for him. The old adage about people thinking a fool is smart until he opens his mouth to speak fit him well, unfortunately.
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Thanks for explaining!
However, I feel that this definition makes it a little hard to base such questions and answers on - because it merges two completely different points:
a. my considerations of worth
b. my behaviour.
Well, I think at best you can demand (and possibly force) the latter part, whilst concerning my opinions and considerations of worth and value you - fortunately - have no control (unless you are capable of using brainwashing methods).
I see. Would you provide any reasons as to why your opinion of all is not to be exposed to the scrutinity everybody else´s (and, among other, mine) is, or would you simply appeal to your own authority?
Well, the "don´t criticize" part of your definition of "respect" would depend on my courage, my opinion whether the case is even worth being discussed and probably some other conditions.
However, I like to think that my opinion about your views is not affected by the means you are using.
Then again, I guess I would wonder why you are trying to oppress criticism of your views, and my first guess would be that you don´t trust them yourself. Which, of course, does not really have any bearing on the validity of those views themselves. If anything, it would be a reason for me to take an even closer and even more skeptical look at them.
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Regardless of which of those dictionary meanings you use for respect, I dont think my asking that people respect my views is a problem, particularly if it is apparent that my views have merit. If my views have no apparent merit then I would expect people to ask questions to determine their merit and if no merit can be found then I wouldnt expect anyone to respect them.
However, what if instead of asking you to respect my views, I demanded that you respect them by stating that you are required to respect them or by threatening you with personal injury if you dont respect them? Would you be more inclined or less inclined to respect my views if, instead of just asking that you respect them, I demanded that you respect them or I tried to force you to respect them? Do such actions actually engender more respect or less respect for my views?
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On the contraryand not unexpectedlyyour solution would never work. What you are saying is that you demand to be respected by others before you will respect them. And if they follow your advice and demand the same, what then? If we employed your illogical method then no one would ever respect anyone.
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If thats what he meant then he should have expressed it more clearly because that isnt what he wrote. He wrote, [t]o get respect, you have to give it FIRST. Note that he used the imperative have to and he emphasized FIRST. In other words, you have to respect others before they will respect you or, differently again, others wont respect you until you respect them.
Now think of it from the point of view of the others. They will not respect you until you respect them. To use Godschild87s terms, they will not give respect until they get it. Everyone is an other to everyone else. So, if everyone will not give respect until they get it then we have reached an impasse. No one would ever give respect to anyone.
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I see Christians here and elsewhere constantly demanding respect for their beliefs. So when a Christian here writes that to get respect, I have to give it first, it looks like another demand to me. Hes not saying what he would do; hes telling me what I have to do.
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