Republicans (Pharisees) ? A serious question

[Gary987]

Jesus saved us from a depraved life. He refrained you in your thinking and actions your entire life for his names sake. Not yours. So my question is this, when does a Christian cross the line from republican voting (because right now that’s where Christian values are most represented) and acting like a Pharisee accusing the world of sin and touting your political views and not convicting them of Christ ?

 

[Gary987]

Jesus saved us from a depraved life. He refrained you in your thinking and actions your entire life for his names sake. Not yours. So my question is this, when does a Christian cross the line from republican voting (because right now that’s where Christian values are most represented) and acting like a Pharisee accusing the world of sin and touting your political views and not convicting them of Christ ?

 

[Gary987]

Answering my own question so you know where I stand

I am so separated from this world system recently that many things are bothering me to the point of prayer and not anger and action

why. Because I am wondering how right I am being right lately?
Jesus means so much more to me than this world. So why do I fight for this world if I’m praying for Jesus return. And if I’m not fighting for this world how can I represent Jesus. If I sin my self into seclusion because of my anger of the left right now I make my self a scoffer who does not listen to myself anymore let alone others.
Listening to my self in prayer I see my political stances so weak even though they are more right than the left it has hurt my motivation. Thanks for listening

 

[Bobber]

Jesus saved us from a depraved life. He refrained you in your thinking and actions your entire life for his names sake. Not yours. So my question is this, when does a Christian cross the line from republican voting (because right now that’s where Christian values are most represented) and acting like a Pharisee accusing the world of sin and touting your political views and not convicting them of Christ ?

Each one will give account before God at how well they kept things in balance with these things. I've learned though never to take too seriously the clamor of some that certain Christians are like Phariseees. Yes there's always been some who have had a Pharissee type of spirit but there's many, many others who have been kind, loving and gracious and yet they still held to the truth of things and weren't ashamed to say it. You can speak the truth in LOVE but there are those who are stubborn and rebellious that won't accept that you did. Their version of what it means to be a loving Christian can actually be a twist from reality.

 

[disciple Clint]

Answering my own question so you know where I stand

I am so separated from this world system recently that many things are bothering me to the point of prayer and not anger and action

why. Because I am wondering how right I am being right lately?
Jesus means so much more to me than this world. So why do I fight for this world if I’m praying for Jesus return. And if I’m not fighting for this world how can I represent Jesus. If I sin my self into seclusion because of my anger of the left right now I make my self a scoffer who does not listen to myself anymore let alone others.
Listening to my self in prayer I see my political stances so weak even though they are more right than the left it has hurt my motivation. Thanks for listening

Gary, please sit down with your pastor or someone you can talk with and talk things out, clear your mind, then put things in order. I will pray for you.Everything is going to be ok, we all get to the same place you are right now, it is just part of life.

 

[Mr. M]

Jesus saved us from a depraved life. He refrained you in your thinking and actions your entire life for his names sake. Not yours. So my question is this, when does a Christian cross the line from republican voting (because right now that’s where Christian values are most represented) and acting like a Pharisee accusing the world of sin and touting your political views and not convicting them of Christ ?

These politicized conservative Christians should not be accepted as representative of Christianity.
There are many who try to unite Christianity behind support for the modern nation state of Israel,
while many are outspoken against this idea as a type of idolatry.
When George W. Bush openly professed Christ in his presidential campaign, Al Gore was speaking
at many large congregation African American churches of various denominations. A majority of
African Americans voted for Gore, so the idea is more complex to fully examine. What about God-
fearing Latinos? Democrat or Republican?
God forbid that far right conservatives become the banner bearers for Christianity!

 

[Gary987]

These politicized conservative Christians should not be accepted as representative of Christianity.
There are many who try to unite Christianity behind support for the modern nation state of Israel,
while many are outspoken against this idea as a type of idolatry.
When George W. Bush openly professed Christ in his presidential campaign, Al Gore was speaking
at many large congregation African American churches of various denominations. A majority of
African Americans voted for Gore, so the idea is more complex to fully examine. What about God-
fearing Latinos? Democrat or Republican?
God forbid that far right conservatives become the banner bearers for Christianity!

 

[Gary987]

your view here is in my opinion very close to the diagnosis and reality

 

[Mr. M]

your view here is in my opinion very close to the diagnosis and reality

Hey Gary,
Just click reply, and type below the quote. You don't have to go to the next block.

 

[Gary987]

I will try and learn. I do t know how to navigate easily . Thanks

 

[Maria Billingsley]

Jesus saved us from a depraved life. He refrained you in your thinking and actions your entire life for his names sake. Not yours. So my question is this, when does a Christian cross the line from republican voting (because right now that’s where Christian values are most represented) and acting like a Pharisee accusing the world of sin and touting your political views and not convicting them of Christ ?

Not all who say they are Christians , are Christians. Dominionism abounds which teaches "kingdom now" aka " seven mountain mandate" theology. This is why many have been decieved. Jesus Christ of Nazareth warned about this. Not until those who persue this type of "salvation" go back to their first love, I am affraid they will stay on the wide road of destruction. Be blessed.

 

[thecolorsblend]

.

 

[rturner76]

Answering my own question so you know where I stand

I am so separated from this world system recently that many things are bothering me to the point of prayer and not anger and action

why. Because I am wondering how right I am being right lately?
Jesus means so much more to me than this world. So why do I fight for this world if I’m praying for Jesus return. And if I’m not fighting for this world how can I represent Jesus. If I sin my self into seclusion because of my anger of the left right now I make my self a scoffer who does not listen to myself anymore let alone others.
Listening to my self in prayer I see my political stances so weak even though they are more right than the left it has hurt my motivation. Thanks for listening

I say keep up the self reflection. Consider what the values of Christ mean in politics. It does not need to be either/or. I have issues I feel conservative about even though I would identify as a Democrat. I believe in personal freedom, privacy rights, 2nd amendment rights (with restrictions) and I also believe in a social safety net, public education, and civil rights.

If I am more inclined to one party, I don't have to believe everything they believe, I support the issues individually rather than looking at what party to prop up.

Questioning yourself is very productive. You can research issues and take a stand based on those issues rather than a particular party. It makes it harder to know how to vote but the issues are more important than the party IMO.

 

[Yekcidmij]

Jesus saved us from a depraved life. He refrained you in your thinking and actions your entire life for his names sake. Not yours. So my question is this, when does a Christian cross the line from republican voting (because right now that’s where Christian values are most represented) and acting like a Pharisee accusing the world of sin and touting your political views and not convicting them of Christ ?

I don't think Republicans or Democrats are Pharisees. Pharisees were a political-religious movement/party in the 2nd Temple period. They had paricular doctrines, aims and beliefs in contrast to the other movements of the day - Sadducees, Essenes, Herodians, other apocalyptic sects, etc.. Pharasaic traditions were taught and carried mainly through two schools of thought - Hillel and Shammai. Orthodox Judaism probably most carries the teachings and tradition of the Pharisees. But it is true that Christianity shares some common beliefs and teachings with the Pharisees as well.

Unfortunately today, "Pharisee" has become a boogeyman term that really means "baddest of bad guys." But the New Testament gives a more nuanced view as does the historical record. Sometimes the Pharisees treat Jesus as an equal, having him over for dinner. They warn Jesus of danger. We're told to pay attention to what they say. And some of the earliest believers seem to have been Pharisees. Nicodemus was a Pharisee. So was Paul - Paul was a student of Hillel's grandson, Gamaliel who had a rather lenient attitude toward Christians (and is a saint in the Eastern Orthodox church!).

Matt 23:2 “The experts in the law and the Pharisees sit on Moses’ seat. 23:3 Therefore pay attention to what they tell you and do it. But do not do what they do, for they do not practice what they teach.

Lk 7:36 Now one of the Pharisees was requesting Him to dine with him, and He entered the Pharisee’s house and reclined at the table.

Lk 11: 37 Now when He had spoken, a Pharisee *asked Him to have lunch with him; and He went in, and reclined at the table.

Lk 13:31 Just at that time some Pharisees approached, saying to Him, "Go away, leave here, for Herod wants to kill You."

Acts 15:5 But some of the sect of the Pharisees who had believed

 

[Yekcidmij]

I don't think Republicans or Democrats are Pharisees. Pharisees were a political-religious movement/party in the 2nd Temple period. They had paricular doctrines, aims and beliefs in contrast to the other movements of the day - Sadducees, Essenes, Herodians, other apocalyptic sects, etc.. Pharasaic traditions were taught and carried mainly through two schools of thought - Hillel and Shammai. Orthodox Judaism probably most carries the teachings and tradition of the Pharisees. But it is true that Christianity shares some common beliefs and teachings with the Pharisees as well.

Unfortunately today, "Pharisee" has become a boogeyman term that really means "baddest of bad guys." But the New Testament gives a more nuanced view as does the historical record. Sometimes the Pharisees treat Jesus as an equal, having him over for dinner. They warn Jesus of danger. We're told to pay attention to what they say. And some of the earliest believers seem to have been Pharisees. Nicodemus was a Pharisee. So was Paul - Paul was a student of Hillel's grandson, Gamaliel who had a rather lenient attitude toward Christians (and is a saint in the Eastern Orthodox church!).

Matt 23:2 “The experts in the law and the Pharisees sit on Moses’ seat. 23:3 Therefore pay attention to what they tell you and do it. But do not do what they do, for they do not practice what they teach.

Lk 7:36 Now one of the Pharisees was requesting Him to dine with him, and He entered the Pharisee’s house and reclined at the table.

Lk 11: 37 Now when He had spoken, a Pharisee *asked Him to have lunch with him; and He went in, and reclined at the table.

Lk 13:31 Just at that time some Pharisees approached, saying to Him, "Go away, leave here, for Herod wants to kill You."

Acts 15:5 But some of the sect of the Pharisees who had believed

Christianity and Orthodox Judaism both descend from a larger Pharasaic tradition with the break between the two occurring in the very late 2nd temple period over several key points of disagreement, to include at least: (1) the status of Jesus as messiah, (2) the two powers in heaven controversy, (3) what to do about Gentile converts.

In short, neither Republicans nor Democrats nor any US political party can be accurately called "Pharisees."

 

[Mr. M]

lol, supporting Israel is not idolatry.

Supporting Israel is merely supporting a dangerous, hateful, racist, apartheid state. But it isn't idolatry.

Subtle.

 

[Gary987]

Christianity and Orthodox Judaism both descend from a larger Pharasaic tradition with the break between the two occurring in the very late 2nd temple period over several key points of disagreement, to include at least: (1) the status of Jesus as messiah, (2) the two powers in heaven controversy, (3) what to do about Gentile converts.

In short, neither Republicans nor Democrats nor any US political party can be accurately called "Pharisees."

Yeksid. I think you might have misunderstood and possibly it was my explanation being insufficient. But I meant taking a lead role in accusing the country of sin but not lifting a finger themselves for Christ and instead for political and religious dogmas and beliefs that yield fleshy fruit like bands of youth unifying against Christ and the church unlike I have seen in my lifetime.

I am in forums of worldly folk who hate Jesus and the church because of the name the right carries with it. When much of what the right does is as horrific as anything else we vote against. We must separate ourselves from political poles as Christians and be careful how we speak as to not poison the well of our youths experience of what the church represents

 

[Sketcher]

So my question is this, when does a Christian cross the line from republican voting (because right now that’s where Christian values are most represented) and acting like a Pharisee accusing the world of sin and touting your political views and not convicting them of Christ ?

Probably when the Christian fails to separate their views adequately. Christians on the left are also guilty of this.

I'm politically conservative, but I know there are quite a few political conservatives who are theologically liberal, as well as not Christian at all.

I'm conservative in Christian doctrine too, in that I try to not go to the left or the right of what the Biblical text says. Those who add to Scripture sin. Those who dilute it also sin. I try to do neither.

One does not require the other strictly speaking, but I happen to be both. I recognize that there is some flex allowable for Christians - if someone disagrees with me on the minimum wage for instance, that doesn't mean they're sinning. If someone refuses me the same courtesy, they are sinning, because they have projected their beliefs onto God.

 

[hislegacy]

Jesus saved us from a depraved life. He refrained you in your thinking and actions your entire life for his names sake. Not yours. So my question is this, when does a Christian cross the line from republican voting (because right now that’s where Christian values are most represented) and acting like a Pharisee accusing the world of sin and touting your political views and not convicting them of Christ ?

From a purely scriptural standpoint there no party that fits what you are describing. I think a vast number of voters who describe themselves as Christian side with the Republican Party because the Democratic Party is openly embracing sin and calling it lifestyle. Openly embracing killing children and calling it woman’s rights and so much more.

In short, neither Republicans nor Democrats nor any US political party can be accurately called "Pharisees."

That is true.

 

[The Barbarian]

When a person wants to be a republican for religious reasons, you have to look at the morals and principles of the man who now owns the republican party.

A guy who uses the Ten Commandments like bathroom tissue.

There are some proclaimed Christians who admire that kind of thing. If so, they're welcome to go have it. But don't link the rest of us to it.