Republicans' appalling comments can tip the scale for undecided voters-IMHO

[TheQuietRiot]

There's just not that much in this unknown category; it's insignificant, to a National scale

Is this category insignificant because of the number of people in it, or by the amount of money that those people have control over?

No it is not the same. There is a great amount that is not known. As Mzungu said, it could sit in accounts, either offshore or not; and as he failed to account for, it could go to literally any other possible use, including space exploration, or becoming a drug lord. (Just as 2 off the wall examples)

I agree, a great amount is not known and I don't think it could possibly be accounted for in any realistic sense.

But just because mzungu was incorrect in claiming that it must sit in local or international bank accounts doesn't make you correct about knowing how millions feel about their entitlments

No, that actually supports my claim, and is the basis of it. Anyway, yes that is the problem. I don't think Govt has an answer for that short of socialism / communism, and history shows those to be no solution at all.

At least we can agree on the source, but must now work together for the solution.

 

[Anna Scott]

Dear Anna:

I am confused. Do you think that R's getting elected will increase the crime of rape?

I'm saying their comments can tip the scales for undecided voters. Though, I would hate to have one of them on the jury of a rape trial.

 

[razeontherock]

Is this category insignificant because of the number of people in it, or by the amount of money that those people have control over?

Insignificant re: the amount of $

I agree, a great amount is not known and I don't think it could possibly be accounted for in any realistic sense.

But just because mzungu was incorrect in claiming that it must sit in local or international bank accounts doesn't make you correct about knowing how millions feel about their entitlments

My point is it would be useful to have a more accurate breakdown, as compared to Romney's 47%. I know for a fact there are people on entitlement programs that hate taking it, and will jump at any chance to get off it. They make up part of that 47%, but how much? And there are other people that would prefer to stay on that program like leeches; but how many? I won't hazard a guess, but my point here is I don't think Romney knows, and I'm not sure the info is really available.




At least we can agree on the source, but must now work together for the solution.[/QUOTE]

 

[razeontherock]

I'm saying their comments can tip the scales for undecided voters. Though, I would hate to have one of them on the jury of a rape trial.

Yeah, I hear that! Fortunately, I think they can pull strings to get out of that ...

 

[razeontherock]

At least we can agree on the source, but must now work together for the solution.

If you have a better idea I'd love to hear it, but I think it boils down to a healthy economy, and the working class being able to afford a wildcat strike. Do you know what that is? (Not saying that those are the solution, but being able to do so significantly changes the balance of power)

 

[DaisyDay]

The appalling things said has tipped the scale in the Akin-McCaskill race. She had been way behind, but now she stands a chance of winning.

Mourdock is now trailing Donnelly in their senate race.

So yes, sometimes voters do pay attention and are bothered by the appalling things said.

 

[Illuminaughty]

I did say that if I were Romney I would put out a memo to all the Republican candidates warning them to avoid the issue of rape like the plague until after the election but come to think of it they should make it a center of the Republican platform. It would be an ongoing foot in mouth spectacle.

 

[SolomonVII]

The appalling things said has tipped the scale in the Akin-McCaskill race. She had been way behind, but now she stands a chance of winning.

Mourdock is now trailing Donnelly in their senate race.

So yes, sometimes voters do pay attention and are bothered by the appalling things said.

Republicans in general told him to resign, but his pride got in the way.

 

[ElijahW]

Well, I grew up poor, and it took me quite a few years of hard work to lift myself out of poverty. I certainly understand the dignity of honest work, and of turning down handouts that are available. Then again, I've run my own business for 20 years now. (No public assistance in that, either) Statistics would suggest not all have that kind of drive, and that some will languish in an entitlement mentality if allowed. I think he is incorrect about the 47%, but don't know what an accurate figure might be

This type of talk, that glorifies your labor that got you where you are, is step one to demonizing those in poverty. That is how people with success can blame people for their poverty.

“If you go to the city of Washington, and you examine the pages of the Congressional Directory, you will find that almost all of those corporation lawyers and cowardly politicians, members of Congress, and misrepresentatives of the masses — you will find that almost all of them claim, in glowing terms, that they have risen from the ranks to places of eminence and distinction. I am very glad I cannot make that claim for myself. I would be ashamed to admit that I had risen from the ranks. When I rise it will be with the ranks, and not from the ranks.” Eugene Debs
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It would seem to me that anyone taking the entitlements, feels entitled to do so. And a great many of them have been responsible, which is why they are entitled in the first place. A lot of this entitlement is unemployment insurance, which you have to pay into by working. This 47% figure is meaningless without a breakdown, although I'm thinking Romney's take on this is disclosed, somewhere.

So you feel they are actually entitled instead of what Romney said they think they are entitled. If Romney said that Americans here are entitled to not die on the streets starving, and we of the 53% have a responsibility to make sure that doesn’t happen, then few would have had an issue with what he said.

All right, let's go there; was it privileged information, or a campaign fund raising speech?

Fund raising speech for the well-to- do and like-minded donors. Do you think he was lying to them and actually thinks they are entitled and [/FONT][FONT=&quot]it’s not an issue about personal responsibility? Just playing to whichever crowd he is in front of?[/FONT]

 

[SolomonVII]

I'm saying their comments can tip the scales for undecided voters. Though, I would hate to have one of them on the jury of a rape trial.

Interestingly, men are often preferred on rape trials than women. Women get too personally involved, and are more likely to ascribe responsibility to the victim. After all if it could happen to the woman, it could happen to them too. That is often too stressful to contemplate.
Indifference and a blindness to the emotional trauma involved often allow many men to just keep their judgment based on the facts at hand. It is a method that sucks at making any kind of emotional connection, but it is useful for juries.

 

[Jeffwhosoever]

"Romney and Ryan both called on Akin to leave the race after his comment about "legitimate rape."

Source: Election 2012 - All hands on deck: Biden, Romney, Obama, Ryan work Wisconsin

 

[SolomonVII]

"Romney and Ryan both called on Akin to leave the race after his comment about "legitimate rape."

Source: Election 2012 - All hands on deck: Biden, Romney, Obama, Ryan work Wisconsin

And virtually every conservative commentator are shaking their heads in disdain that the man was so stubborn and filled with himself that he did not listen to the advise that everyone outside of his own family was giving to him.
As committed as conservative voters are to their conservative values, there comes a point when they will not abase themselves just to put another Republican into office. Power is an important thing, but it is not the only thing.

 

[DrkSdBls]

While I do believe what many of the quoted republican candidates said was distasteful, I also think it is wrong to generalize the whole republican party to hold these extreme positions. I also think it is a bit disingenuous to link these comments to Romney's presidential bid. If you are going to criticize Romney, please address his actual words and policy positions.

We would criticize his positions but he doesn't have any.

So all we can do is criticize his words and the words of those who Speak for him (Sununu) some of which have said much worse.

 

[Sean611]

How the GOP's Real Agenda Is Revealed in Their Nasty Rape Comments
“Republican activist Phyllis Schlafly declared that marital rape doesn't exist, because when you get married you sign up to be sexually available to your husband at all times.”
______________________-

Rep. Todd Akin
"If it's a legitimate rape, the female body has ways to try to shut that whole thing down. But let's assume maybe that didn't work or something. I think there should be some punishment, but the punishment ought to be on the rapist."
________________________

Boston Globe: US Senate candidate Richard Mourdock stands by comment that pregnancy from rape ‘something God intended’
Richard Mourdock: ‘‘I struggled with it myself for a long time, but I came to realize that life is that gift from God. And, I think, even when life begins in that horrible situation of rape, that it is something that God intended to happen.’’
_________________________

National Republican Senatorial Committee Chairman Sen. John Cornyn of Texas actually supported Mourdock, saying that the Republican's view on abortion is the same as that of Mourdock's rival, Rep. Joe Donnelly.
__________________________

Global Post: “Some Girls Rape Easy“: Republican candidate Roger Rivard sparks outrage

______________

Sharron Angle's Advice For Rape Victims Considering Abortion: Turn Lemons Into Lemonade
In the case of a young girl raped by her father , Sharron Angle insisted that "two wrongs don't make a right," and “Lemons can be made into lemonade.”
___________________________

Who talks like this? Who says, “lemons can be made into lemonade” when a young girl has been raped by her father. Regardless of what one believes about the abortion issue; such a statement is offensively and outrageously insensitive. The trauma of such a rape can take a lifetime to overcome, and some never heal.

What kind of person says, some girls rape easy or marital rape doesn't exist or in a "legitimate" rape a girl will not become pregnant?

Then there is Mitt Romney's statement about Americans who don't pay taxes:

Mitt Romney Bootlegs, Clinging to the 47 Percent of ‘Entitled’ ‘Victims, Silver Spoons and Eastwood Talks (PM Note)
“believe that they are victims, who believe the government has a responsibility to care for them, who believe that they are entitled to health care, to food, to housing, to you-name-it. That that’s an entitlement. And the government should give it to them. And they will vote for this president no matter what…These are people who pay no income tax. . . .

. . . . .“My job is not to worry about those people,” Romney says in the video. “I’ll never convince them they should take personal responsibility and care for their lives.””
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Never mind that the poor, elderly, disabled, veterans/military, etc. can easily fall into this 47% who do not pay taxes. Though, I'm quite certain Romney cares about the very wealthy who manage to pay no taxes.

This is the first Presidential race in which I found myself in the "undecided" voter category. (I've heard conservative talk show hosts insult "undecided voters.")

Romney's obvious disdain for the less fortunate, combined with the inexcusable comments Republicans have made about women and rape, provided the tipping point for me in this election.

I am a registered Republican. I voted for Ronald Reagan, George H. W. Bush, and George W. Bush.

In November, I will vote for President Obama. In fact, I will vote a straight Democrat ticket.

One thing Republicans have managed to accomplished is turning this Republican into a Democrat.

I think the rape comments being made by these politicians is appalling. In some cases, especially in the case of Akin, it could sway the vote to the Democrat. I'm really shocked Akin didn't bow out. All of this being said, I think that these comments don't represent the view of almost any Republicans and i'd say they are being used as political propaganda by the Democrats. Afterall, if Democrats actually ran on their record this year and what they've "accomplished" in the White House and Congress, they'd be finished. So, in true political form, they are resorting to "dirty" ads, name calling, and insults. Don't get me wrong, the Repubs do it too, but not to the extent of the Democrats....the whole thing is shameful in my eyes.

The best way for undecided voters to send the two corrupt and abusive major parites a message is either by staying at home or by voting for third party candidates. Many polls are actually showing that most undecided voters are undecided because the "real" differences between Obama and Romney are very very small. The only people who are actually fired up about this elections are the die-hard supporters of the two corrupt parties.

For me, I have spent nearly all my life as a conservative Republican. After Ron Paul exploded onto the scene, I realized that the vast majority of elected Republicans are not fiscal conservatives and that Republican's foreign policy platform of high military spending and policing the world is a joke. Not only that, I think Republicans fail on the test of civil liberties as well (marriage, Patriot Act, marijuana).

That leaves me with the Democrats and third parties. The Democrats are terrible on the economy and have sold their souls to business and job killing heavy government regulations and corporate statism. Many Democrats also support late term abortions, something I find to be much more appalling than the "rape" comments. I'm not an expert on abortion, but I do know that having a late term abortion is murder and that it should be illegal. They also believe in heavily taxing the wealthy and big business in order to support their failed or failing social programs. Add the fact that Democrats are terrible with civil liberties as well (NDAA, Patriot Act, marijuana raids) and have an almost identical aggressive foreign policy as the Republicans and one begins to ask themselves, "what is the real difference between the two?"

Thus, I joined the Libertarian Party. Libertarians believe in bringing our troops home now, ending "crony" corporate capitalism, real free market capitalism, lowering taxes to the absolute minimum or eliminating most them for the "Fair Tax," auditing and shutting down the Federal Reserve, ending our aggressive foreign policy and stop policing the world, supporting civil liberties, legalizing marijuana, and leaving people's sex lives up to them.

Some claim that cutting social welfare and all these programs is "cold-hearted" and will leave people dying in the streets! Nothing could be farther from the truth, Libertarians believe in private charity and private local programs that are driven by local charity in order to take care of those who are disadvantaged or who need help. If the government quits stealing all of our money, then just think about how much more money we can actually give to private charities that are efficient and effective! Afterall, Americans were able to raise more money through private charity for Haiti than the entire yearly budget of federal social welfare! Americans don't need these ridiculous and costly programs.

At the end of the day, there is very little difference between Dems and Repubs. For the same reason Dems bash Repubs, Repubs could bash Dems and vice versa. Both political parties are a complete joke and they no longer represent the American people.

End of rant lol

 

[razeontherock]

This type of talk, that glorifies your labor that got you where you are, is step one to demonizing those in poverty.

No it's not, but you are taking the "you didn't build that" to it's objectionable progression!

Do you think he was lying to them and actually thinks they are entitled and [/SIZE] [/FONT][FONT=&quot]it’s not an issue about personal responsibility? Just playing to whichever crowd he is in front of?[/FONT]

I think he didn't go into detail on that point, and didn't consider it relevant to the moment. Have you seen the video?

I think if we want to know what Romney thinks on that particular issue, we would need to hear him address it. And then the question becomes, what would his actions be on that point? I'm not sure POTUS holds a lot of sway either way here

 

[Anna Scott]

The problem with Romney's comments about the 47% goes far beyond focusing on certain populations in his election campaign strategy.


CBS News: Fact-checking Romney's "47 percent" comment

Romney Quote: "There are 47 percent of the people who will vote for the president no matter what. All right, there are 47 percent who are with him, who are dependent upon government, who believe that they are victims, who believe the government has a responsibility to care for them, who believe that they are entitled to health care, to food, to housing, to you-name-it -- that that's an entitlement. And the government should give it to them. And they will vote for this president no matter what. ... These are people who pay no income tax. ... [M]y job is not to worry about those people. I'll never convince them they should take personal responsibility and care for their lives."

Romney made these comments to a small group of wealthy contributors during a private fundraiser earlier this year.

So, let's look at this. According to Romney's own words, the 47% who pay no income tax---

• will vote for the president no matter what
• are dependent upon government
• believe that they are victims
• believe the government has a responsibility to care for them
• believe that they are entitled to health care, to food, to housing, to you-name-it -- that that's an entitlement. And the government should give it to them

Romney takes a clear position by saying that it's not his job to worry about "those people," because he will never convince them they should take personal responsibility and care for their lives.


The CBS News article has a link to Mother Jones SECRET VIDEO: Romney Tells Millionaire Donors What He REALLY Thinks of Obama Voters.

Since this video has been made public, Romney says he cares about 100 Percent of the American People. If that's the case, was he lying to his wealthy contributors during the private fundraiser earlier this year? Or is Romney lying when he says he cares about 100% of Americans? Both statements cannot be true at the same time.

So, how damaging are Romney's comments for undecided voters? Can such comments tip the scales in such a close election?

 

[razeontherock]

Romney says he cares about 100 Percent of the American People. If that's the case, was he lying to his wealthy contributors during the private fundraiser earlier this year? Or is Romney lying when he says he cares about 100% of Americans? Both statements cannot be true at the same time.

Of course they can. The question becomes, are people really going to make decisions based on bad information? And apparently the answer to that, is "yes." It's always easier to not understand

 

[Anna Scott]

Stupid Joe Biden Quotes - Dumbest Joe Biden Gaffes and Quotes

Off topic again.

 

[SolomonVII]

Romney in his debate debunked the millions of dollars that Axelrod had put into his smear campaign of painting Romney as a cold-blooded, uncaring figure. Clearly, the 47% comment was not a statement of Romney not caring about all Americans, and the world to come will not include pregnant young girls dying out on the streets with their grandmothers.

Of course, the only choice for Axelrod and Obama, is to double down on the personal attacks and demonizing. It is not as if they can run on their record, and to now go positive and talk about their big plans of hope and change for the next four years is going to fall a little flat.

So now it is all about Republicans advocating rape and class warfare against the poor and the victims.

Democrats must really like the poor, because their policies have left greatly increased the numbers of poor in America.

 

[SolomonVII]

Off topic again.

You opened the door to that topic when you began to focus on the 47 % gaffe.