Reformed Views on the Millennium

[ClementofRome]

Well, even though "amil" literally means "no mil," the view is more that the millennial period of Rev. 20 is figurative. (Apart from denying parts of Scripture, it's impossible to get around the "millennium problem." It begs some kind of interpretation.) In fact, most postmils hold the same view. The biggest distinction is that amils say there will be increasing disparity between the faith and order of the elect and the apostasy and chaos of the world. That is, the state of the world will continue to worsen and the church will undergo great tribulation prior to Christ's return. Postmils see the opposite happening, but do see a period of apostasy prior to Christ returning (per 2 Thess. 2:1-3).

Soli Deo Gloria

Jon

Agreed, mostly. I believe that the millennial reign and the "7" year tribulation are simultaneous...we are in the millennial reign and the great tribulation at the same time! The numbers are certainly figurative and symbolize complete periods of time. It may or may not get worse for us.... Satan is on a leash, yes indeedy, and at his/its unleashing evil will intensify, but this will also be the culmination of the ages at that very moment. Boom, poof...

 

[Jon_]

Boom, poof...

That must be the Reader's Digest version. I like it!

Soli Deo Gloria

Jon

 

[R.J.S]

I am postmillennial

 

[DrWarfield]

Well, even though "amil" literally means "no mil," the view is more that the millennial period of Rev. 20 is figurative. (Apart from denying parts of Scripture, it's impossible to get around the "millennium problem." It begs some kind of interpretation.) In fact, most postmils hold the same view. The biggest distinction is that amils say there will be increasing disparity between the faith and order of the elect and the apostasy and chaos of the world. That is, the state of the world will continue to worsen and the church will undergo great tribulation prior to Christ's return. Postmils see the opposite happening, but do see a period of apostasy prior to Christ returning (per 2 Thess. 2:1-3).

Soli Deo Gloria

Jon

You rdiscription is accuracte and you have got to the heart of the distinction between between Amil and Postmil. Yes, most Postmil's today hold that same view of a non literal reading of the millenium. The only thing I would quibble over is when you state that "Postmils see the opposite, but do see a period of apostasy prior to Christ returning." Now many Postmils do see a period of apostacy but by no means ALL. L. Boettner, B. B. Warfield and Francis Nigel Lee do not see any such apostasy, nor do I for what that is worth. L. Boettner used to hold to the falling away view, but in the last updated edition of his book on the subject he changed his mind. There is an old adage that holds true, it is better to read the mature theologian rather than the ramblings of the young buck (I know that I have mutilated the saying, lol). As an aside that is why I think that most of us shouldn't go into print until we are about 50 years old, and I am serious about that (of course there are exceptions like say, Mmmm, Calvin).

Regards,
DrWarfield

 

[Imblessed]

I voted other. Was raised dispy premil pretrib, but after reading (most of)the left behind series, I got real interested in end times and also started seeing some problems with the dispy view.

I started looking seriously into preterism(consistant), which, I don't think is too suprising considering I was throwing off dispensationalism.....going to the other end of the spectrum, so to speak.....

I ended up partial preterist.....but aside from that I don't know. I really think most of Matt. 24's been fullfilled...

I think the amill view is a strong one, but no matter how hard I try, I can't get past the fact that most amills don't see any significance to 70 AD and they hold to a one-time ressurection of both the sinners and saints....I see a separation of time(not necessarily a millenium though) Spurgeon's sermon on that really affected me.

So,

maybe a cross between partial preterism, historical pre-mill and amill? LOL how's that for mixing things up a bit????

speaking of the millenium views, have any of you caught the new view making it's rounds? That everyone(the non-saved) will be dead for the millenium? Basically the view is a post-trib rapture view, and when Jesus comes he destroys the wicked, and earth lays barren for about a thousand years, while all the saved are in heaven. Satan is stuck wandering around with no one to deceive for a thousand years. After the thousand years, God raises the wicked(in the post-ressurection bodies), At this time, heaven is back on earth(I think--New Jeruselem) and Satan convinces the once-dead now ressurected wicked to join him in overthrowing New Jeruselem....and we know how the rest ends..

I think that's how the view works....anyone else seen it? I had never heard of it before a couple of days ago.....

 

[R.J.S]

I think the amill view is a strong one, but no matter how hard I try, I can't get past the fact that most amills don't see any significance to 70 AD and they hold to a one-time ressurection of both the sinners and saints....I see a separation of time(not necessarily a millenium though) Spurgeon's sermon on that really affected me.

All the amills I know hold that AD70 was the fulfilment of Matthew 24's abomination of desolation.

speaking of the millenium views, have any of you caught the new view making it's rounds? That everyone(the non-saved) will be dead for the millenium? Basically the view is a post-trib rapture view, and when Jesus comes he destroys the wicked, and earth lays barren for about a thousand years, while all the saved are in heaven. Satan is stuck wandering around with no one to deceive for a thousand years. After the thousand years, God raises the wicked(in the post-ressurection bodies), At this time, heaven is back on earth(I think--New Jeruselem) and Satan convinces the once-dead now ressurected wicked to join him in overthrowing New Jeruselem....and we know how the rest ends..

Oh it aint new, I have a book from the 1940s which advocates that view.

 

[Rolf Ernst]

Certainly agreed there Rolf! I am just a good old trouble maker!

It is good for us to make trouble when truth is the hammer with which we strike the anvil.

 

[ClementofRome]

It is good for us to make trouble when truth is the hammer with which we strike the anvil.

AMEN! Happy New Year to you!
Clem

 

[Imblessed]

All the amills I know hold that AD70 was the fulfilment of Matthew 24's abomination of desolation.

Oh, Ok. I had read somewhere(gosh, I can't remember where, I've perused so many sites) that amills don't see the significance....

hmmm, if that's the case I shouldn't say that any more!

It's so easy to get wrong information...even from a good source....

Oh it aint new, I have a book from the 1940s which advocates that view.

well, nothing is new under the sun, is it?
I meant new around these forums.....from the looks of the websites that guy sent me to, it's well developed; just not something I had heard of before...

 

[R.J.S]

I meant new around these forums.....from the looks of the websites that guy sent me to, it's well developed; just not something I had heard of before...

Oh right Can you provide the links?

 

[Imblessed]

here are the links I was given. This comes from a guy in the eschetology section in a thread called "mortals in the millenium? nah..."

I didn't read any of the websites thoroughly, but I did check all of them.....

http://www.endtimeinsights.com/site...tegory/3/25/63/

http://biblelight.net/millen.htm

http://www.bibleonly.org/proph/rev/Study6.pdf

http://www.amazingfacts.org/items/Read_Media.asp?ID=646

http://www.tagnet.org/cyberspace/Le...5/trut1-25.html

 

[R.J.S]

here are the links I was given. This comes from a guy in the eschetology section in a thread called "mortals in the millenium? nah..."

I didn't read any of the websites thoroughly, but I did check all of them.....

http://www.endtimeinsights.com/site...tegory/3/25/63/

http://biblelight.net/millen.htm

http://www.bibleonly.org/proph/rev/Study6.pdf

http://www.amazingfacts.org/items/Read_Media.asp?ID=646

http://www.tagnet.org/cyberspace/Le...5/trut1-25.html

Thankyou

 

[Cajun Huguenot]

I prefer to hold that the millennium began either at the resurrection or on Pentecost and continues through today to some point in the future when all will be consummated.

I agree with this statement about the millennium. I voted postmill because I have a very optimistic view about the future influence of the Gospel of Jesus Christ in this world. My position could also be called a very optimistic amillennialsm.

Coram Deo,
Kenith