Re. Therapy

[RachelZ]

I could use a little help re. therapy...just wondered what you're thoughts were cos my anxiety just keeps kicking in about it. I don't know if I'm ignoring God's prompting cos I'm afraid of the consequences or if I'm being overly worried. The thing is if I take the golden rule of if it's accompanied by anxiety then it's OCD then yes this is just OCD...but I feel it may actually be a moral issue...I then get really worried cos if this one is a real thing that I need to act on then as it feels similar to other issues then those must be real too! And now I feel like I'm swaying you're opninon and resisting God's will....

Anyway, to the point...is it wrong to see a Christian therapist if they say or do things you wouldn't as a Christian? This is not doctrinal as in He's saying that Jesus isn't the only way or anything like that...it's just things he obviously thinks are OK that I wouldn't do or say. It doesn't bother me in the sense that I insist on all Christians sticking to my code of conduct it just causes me to be anxious about whether God would really provide someone who says things I wouldn't. The thing is I felt he was a gift from God cos I can't afford therapy and he's seeing me for free. Yet would God provide someone who isn't mega squeeky clean? I'm scared God is saying stop seeing him as I really value the sessions...and yet I feel yet again like I'm resisting God's narrow and tough way. And on and on the anxiety goes coursing through my arms...I hate it. I feel if I give into every anxiety then I'll end up living in a two inch by two inch metaphorical space...yet God speaks of a narrow way so maybe that is as it should be.

Any wisdom on this gratefully received...thanks...take care, Rachel

 

[SoldierOfSoul]

I think the Bible makes it clear that the narrow way is repenting from your sins and believing on Jesus for salvation by the finished work of His cross. If you believe that than you are walking in the narrow way. As long as you stay true to the gospel, no matter what, you are on the narrow way. I think when people stray from "the way" they are either leaving the gospel, or taking away from it,or adding to it.

We can do nothing for our salvation that Christ has not already done, Jesus is the way the truth and the life, and if we believe on Him we are doing what He has commanded of us.

Anyway, to the point...is it wrong to see a Christian therapist if they say or do things you wouldn't as a Christian?

That all depends on what they are saying, if it is not biblical than I would stop seeing them, if it is a minor doctrinal difference that in no way affects the truth of salvation by grace through faith, than it possibly could be overlooked. I guess it all depends on your convictions, just ask God to show you what you need to do, ask Him if the therapist is in His will for you.

it's just things he obviously thinks are OK that I wouldn't do or say.

Well if he is a confessing Christian He should be keeping watch over his tongue, but possibly he has not matured enough in his faith. Maybe you should question some of the things he says to his face, test him to see if the fruits of his words really show he is a christian.

 

[Jayangel81]

Anyway, to the point...is it wrong to see a Christian therapist if they say or do things you wouldn't as a Christian? This is not doctrinal as in He's saying that Jesus isn't the only way or anything like that...

If you are going with a Christian counselor than I would never go with one denying Christ is the only way. You are in a fragile state of mind and you do not need rubbish being filled into your head (bluntly speaking )

it's just things he obviously thinks are OK that I wouldn't do or say. It doesn't bother me in the sense that I insist on all Christians sticking to my code of conduct it just causes me to be anxious about whether God would really provide someone who says things I wouldn't.

There is a reason we are commanded to not be unequally yoked with unbelievers. For one you would be suprised on how they can have an effect on our minds This is not from God rachel this is from the one who comes to kill,steal and destroy.

You need help from a God-Annointed Christian.

Not from this New Age rubbish

Seek Him in Prayer.

The thing is I felt he was a gift from God cos I can't afford therapy and he's seeing me for free. Yet would God provide someone who isn't mega squeeky clean?

I really believe you should pray on this, while God can use people any way He sees fit, I would be very cautious, as I said you are in a delicate position.

I'm scared God is saying stop seeing him as I really value the sessions...and yet I feel yet again like I'm resisting God's narrow and tough way. And on and on the anxiety goes coursing through my arms...I hate it. I feel if I give into every anxiety then I'll end up living in a two inch by two inch metaphorical space...yet God speaks of a narrow way so maybe that is as it should be.

Jesus is the narrow way. Seek Him for counsel. Trust in Him that He will lead you according to HIS will. Be patient about it though, and hold onto that Faith.

The narrow way is something we walk on throughout life. and often times we fall right off it, that is when Jesus dusts us off and puts us right back on that narrow path.

 

[SoldierOfSoul]

The narrow way is something we walk on throughout life. and often times we fall right off it, that is when Jesus dusts us off and puts us right back on that narrow path.

 

[RachelZ]

Sorry didn't explain well I meant he wasn't saying anything doctrinally dodgy like Jesus isn't the only way...I think it may have sounded like I was saying he DID say that. Sorry...Rachel

 

[JennyKatz]

I think it comes down to whether or not you feel the differences between you will cause you enough problems to negate the benefit of therapy. If it's something you can work through, stick with the therapy since you're lucky enough to have someone willing to see you for free. If not, well, it may be better to walk away and not create a worse situation.

 

[RachelZ]

Thanks SoS, JayAngel and JennyKatz for your replies...will pray...take care, Rachel

 

[keryakos]

I could use a little help re. therapy...just wondered what you're thoughts were cos my anxiety just keeps kicking in about it. I don't know if I'm ignoring God's prompting cos I'm afraid of the consequences or if I'm being overly worried. The thing is if I take the golden rule of if it's accompanied by anxiety then it's OCD then yes this is just OCD...but I feel it may actually be a moral issue...I then get really worried cos if this one is a real thing that I need to act on then as it feels similar to other issues then those must be real too! And now I feel like I'm swaying you're opninon and resisting God's will....

Anyway, to the point...is it wrong to see a Christian therapist if they say or do things you wouldn't as a Christian? This is not doctrinal as in He's saying that Jesus isn't the only way or anything like that...it's just things he obviously thinks are OK that I wouldn't do or say. It doesn't bother me in the sense that I insist on all Christians sticking to my code of conduct it just causes me to be anxious about whether God would really provide someone who says things I wouldn't. The thing is I felt he was a gift from God cos I can't afford therapy and he's seeing me for free. Yet would God provide someone who isn't mega squeeky clean? I'm scared God is saying stop seeing him as I really value the sessions...and yet I feel yet again like I'm resisting God's narrow and tough way. And on and on the anxiety goes coursing through my arms...I hate it. I feel if I give into every anxiety then I'll end up living in a two inch by two inch metaphorical space...yet God speaks of a narrow way so maybe that is as it should be.

Any wisdom on this gratefully received...thanks...take care, Rachel

The Answer is you need another therapist ...I think you are dead on with this one Rachel.

 

[RachelZ]

Thanks Keryakos...trouble is another therapist isn't one of the options. I cannot afford sessions not even monthly ones. But thanks for the suggestion...hope you're doing OK...take care, Rachel

 

[keryakos]

Thanks Keryakos...trouble is another therapist isn't one of the options. I cannot afford sessions not even monthly ones. But thanks for the suggestion...hope you're doing OK...take care, Rachel

\

I have been there so i understand and your welcome

 

[kaykay9.0]

I don't know, Rachel. I've weighed in on this before and I'm still uncertain. You say he claims to be a Christian but I think you said that sometimes he says a swear word and things like that.

I know that the bible talks about "not sitting in the counsel of the ungodly." But is this man really "ungodly?" I mean, yes, if he were telling you stuff that wasn't doctrinally correct, and filling your head with unscriptural ideas, I would say get out of there in a New York minute! Does he advocate doing stuff that would conflict with Biblical principles?

However, I don't think he is necessarily "not sent from God" to you just because he may be at an immature level spiritually. I think God can use all kinds of things to speak to us, but again, if you feel his counsel is not just worldly but unbiblical, that's a horse of a different color.

I think despite your OCD, you have some wisdom and discernment. Do you feel the counsel he is giving you is something you can trust?
You've been going awhile. Do you think he is helping you at all.? Is he leading you closer to God or further away?

 

[RachelZ]

I feel really lousy...I think this issue is gonna prove that what I am dealing with in the main is not OCD but is my refusal to listen to my conscience and obey God. Therefore be it ROCD or scrupulosity or whatever it's more about me as a sinner than about an overly anxious brain.

 

[kaykay9.0]

I feel really lousy...I think this issue is gonna prove that what I am dealing with in the main is not OCD but is my refusal to listen to my conscience and obey God. Therefore be it ROCD or scrupulosity or whatever it's more about me as a sinner than about an overly anxious brain.

Well, Rachel, it's hard to verify without knowing exactly what your sessions are like. I feel like if I could be a "fly in the wall" for a couple of sessions with you, I could counsel you better about this...but as it is, I don't feel I know enough about this man and his counsel to advise you. Now if he's saying things that are really off the wall or cussing all the time..eh, I 'd say probably time to dismiss him but if not.....

whatever you decide, don't blame yourself about not quitting seeing him. I don't think you should just throw a FREE counselor out on a whim. You MAY need to stop, but don't blame yourself because you haven't thus far. God does call us to obedience but when something is unclear like this, I don't think God faults us for carefully weighing the situation before acting in one direction or another. We are told to "test the spirits."

 

[RachelZ]

Sorry KayKay was typing post above as you must have been posting yours. I don't think he's leading me away from God...I don't think he's advocating I do stuff I shoudn't...if anything I long to know more about the God who's grace he rests under and who's love he is so sure of. But right now I don't know...all I can feel is horrible anxiety. There is a sense of it not being right to keep going but another sense in which that doesn't seem right. I have no idea how you're supposed to discern things when you get told if it's accompanied by anxiety it's OCD...I'm riddled with anxiety now not least about what this situation may prove about other issues.

Thanks for your wisdom on this...take care, Rachel

 

[RachelZ]

Done it again...we must be tandem typing...thanks KayKay...hugs, Rachel

 

[kaykay9.0]

Sorry KayKay was typing post above as you must have been posting yours. I don't think he's leading me away from God...I don't think he's advocating I do stuff I shoudn't...if anything I long to know more about the God who's grace he rests under and who's love he is so sure of. But right now I don't know...all I can feel is horrible anxiety. There is a sense of it not being right to keep going but another sense in which that doesn't seem right. I have no idea how you're supposed to discern things when you get told if it's accompanied by anxiety it's OCD...I'm riddled with anxiety now not least about what this situation may prove about other issues.

Thanks for your wisdom on this...take care, Rachel

Even if it turns out it's not OCD, that doesn't mean that other things in your life are not OCD because I say this kindly (no offense) you DO seem to struggle pretty viciously with OCD and I think you know that deep down.

Your husband is your spiritual authority no matter what spiritual level he's on or not on. Does he have an opinion about whether you should continue or not or has he left it entirely up to you?

Another thought, I think sometimes God puts us with someone who abounds in grace to kinda balance us out a bit the other direction. Do you know what I mean?

 

[annrobert]

Rachel,
I feel for you,I have struggled greatly with this same issue.Very very much.That verse kaykay brought up comes to my mind.I was terrifed to get help for long time.I was told to go to a counsellor ,but I was so scared to.The I got too sick and tormented to even try.Finally I found a counsellor in February I think and she is a really good counsellor and christian and very kind and helpful.I want to go back to her,but I stopped for awhile due to my health being so bad.I was in alot of pain and very tired and being worn out with tests and still need more.But I hope to be able to start going back to her.I am going to see a psychiatrist soon.I am worried about it,but I have heard that she is chrisitan.I have seen her before ,years ago,she is a very nice person.I am wondering if I should try medication again.It did nothing for me before.I am wondering if she has ever seen someone who has gone through the same things as me.I am planning to be very careful about this and wondering if I should go.Maybe if she has some ideas to help me.I am just worried.I know what you are talking about and I want to go back to the counsellor I started seeing.
I am not sure what you should do.Maybe try to discern if his faith is for real ,at least as much as you can.His knowing how to live under grace sounds like a good thing.I have wrote here and deleted too many times.I just do not know what to say.
Maybe really pray about it.If he is giving you godly counsel and helping you,well that is really good,but if something feels wrong about him ....well.I wish I could help you more on this,but it is something I worry about also.

 

[ObsessedButBlessed]

Is any one of us a perfect Christian?

Do any of us follow Christ perfectly all of the time?

Have any of us ever sinned or struggled with sin?

Have any of us ever done something that doesn't reflect Christ?

I would venture yes. No therapist is perfect, even a Christian therapist. I worked with a Christian therapist, and even though he was kind, he said things that doctrinally I disagreed with. And yes it made me anxious, thinking if he was wrong about this then he could be wrong about my OCD (but he wasn't!!). If you feel this therapist is helping you, then by all means, continue. We can't go running from therapists just because we disagree with them. There ARE times and places to dump your therapist, maybe because you don't feel they are helping, or you don't like their approach, or they are simply uneducated (in the case of one former therapist who told me I couldn't have OCD because I didn't have compulsions). There ARE bad therapists out there. But there are also many good ones. I think the decision whether or not to stick with a therapist should be made on whether or not you are gaining any benefit from it and if you are IMPROVING. Are you? Have you improved since you began seeing him?

I understand you seeing him because it is free. Therapy is tough to pay for, and money is tight these days. Do you not have socialized health care in the UK? I don't know how the system works but I thought you could see a doctor for free? IMO, you are so deeply entrenched in OCD that you can't see the irrationality of it and therefore really need someone trained in OCD to guide you through the recovery process.

Bottom line is, when you are entangled in OCD, you can't trust your feelings. You cannot control your thoughts. You cannot control your feelings. But you can control your response to them.

 

[RachelZ]

Thanks KayKay, I really appreciate your very balanced and wise approach to things. Yes I DO know what you mean regarding people balancing us out. I definitely swing towards a God of wrath who's love is not like we imagine love but like an aloof kind of generosity that is bestowed on whome He chooses despite the needs of the person. I listen to you and others on here talk and I long to have the view of God you do and really firmly believe it to be true. I don't know how I can really tackle the OCD whilst I have such a terrifying image of God. I feel a bit like I could just cry and I don't really do that much any more but I just feel like I can't deal with this...which is a bit pathetic really. I feel like if I have to give this up then that's it...I have battled for years and years hoping to get better and this was a kind of last hope kinda thing. I'm in my late thirties and just think what a waste of a life. And I feel so sad to think that something I thought was from God that I thought was so nice of Him to provide me with may well not be from Him after all...it just takes me back to how I feel about Him generally, ie that He despises me and certainly won't supply an answer other than to repent of being such a lousy Christian. I wish I could explain the feelings inside...and I wish I could know what is OCD and what is not cos based on my understanding so far if this issue ends up not being OCD but ends up being something I do have to do something about then it will shake any tentative belief I have that the ROCD and scrupulosity issues are OCD cos the anxiety feels so similar. Sometimes this feels a bit different but then when I think how I have been with the ROCD stuff in the past it's not so very different at all...so maybe that just shows my OCD actually should be called HCD...Hopeless Christian Disorder!!!! I felt my hubby was a gift from God and am tormented that he wasn't...ditto my son...now this...maybe I am just a very, very, bad Christian. Maybe I should be running back to my presbyterian roots which say don't laugh in church, don't smile much there either, don't worship with any more than one instrument, don't listen to modern Christian music, don't celebrate Christmas on a Sunday and certainly don't have a Christmas tree no matter what day of the week it falls on! Don't feel free...do say thee and thou, do feel afraid of God.

One thing that did strike me last night about this was that whenever something isn't perfect I kinda often feel I have to do something but maybe I don't allways have to. With issues like this though I just feel overwhelming urges to act and sort things and do the most difficult option to fix it all. How can I allow my therapist to be imperfect yet still OK in God's eyes if I can't even do that for myself? And I think to myself that I say the word crap which to some Christians would be deemed terrible so how come I'm so worried about what another Christian says? I've also sworn worse than that yet I'm anxious cos of someone else doing it. I do think that some of how he is is an effort to show his clients that the room is a free speech zone...ie if you're feeling it say it cos it needs to be got out rather than staying put and remaining toxic. But then I think am I excusing sin? Also, I'm not sure my view of God is one that glorifies Him...and I wonder if sometimes those Christians who I might look on as doing stuff they shouldn't yet who talk of God's love and mercy in such glowing terms are really more pleasing to Him than me with my list of do's and don'ts and horrible fear around Him.

Thanks annrobert...I'm sorry you struggle too...I really hope you manage to find the help you need. It's so hard isn't it to make decisions when you are riddled with anxiety. As to whether his faith is real or not...all I can say is I find an attractiveness about the way He sees all the bible through the lenses of God's love and that it's only His love that makes it make any sense. I'd love to have those specs on!! I see God's anger, anger and more anger interspersed with some love for a select few. He seems so much more relaxed with God than I do...but then maybe that's just because he isn't seeing it properly. Again, thank you for responding particularly as this is an area you find difficult!

Hey ObsessedButBlessed...hope you're doing OK. Thanks for your response, it's muchly appreciated! As to whether or not I'm improving...I think the potential is there...I think that although I don't agree with all his interpretations about stuff He does seem to have a wisdom about him and allows and encourages my feelings to come out. There is a National Health Service in the UK but they've seen me and discharged me and what you get offered isn't allways as much as or what you need. The psychologist was very into mindfullness as was the Psychiatrist though both were nice and seeing them did help especially through my pregnancy when I was absolutely terrible. I remember once in a sesh that at the end the psychologist felt I was worse than at the begining of the sesh and he seemed to think that wasn't a good thing but to me it felt like I needed to get my feelings out and be encouraged to do so. I didn't want to be signed of from the psychiatrist but what you want isn't allways what you get. Oddly enough perhaps it does help that you see me as being deeply entrenched in the OCD...you and KayKay have both described my OCD as being bad and though I wish I didn't have it it helps to have it validated.

I'm feeling really low about all this but you prolly guessed that already! I know the responses have all said different things about what I should do but that is to be expected and I'm not compaining. I appreciate your input and care more than you know. I'm very tired of so often having something to feel tormented about...I feel very little hope right now...please pray that whatever God is wanting me to do He will say it very loudly cos I am utterly crap at hearing and obeying Him...thanks and take care, Rachel

 

[RachelZ]

PS Haven't spoken with Hubby about it yet KayKay.