Rcc: same god as Catholics!?!

[KNOWLEDGE BOMB]

From Vatican.va

the Vatican's own site teaches that Muslims and Catholics have the same god...

And how does the Vatican come to the conclusion that both have the same god? It's for certain that Muslims (Islam) is a creation of Satan! Allah is Not the God of the bible! Islam teaches that god has no son - only Satan teaches such things.... You can't have the father without the son and vice-versa! Islam started with worship of the moon....

They come to this conclusion because Islam claims to trace it's roots back to Abram.... Which isn't true at all.


(Pope Francis has urged Christians and Muslims to work together to promote mutual respect, particularly by educating new generations of believers.

He greeted Muslims around the world during his Sunday blessing of pilgrims gathered in St Peter's Square in Rome.

He said that "our brothers'' the Muslims had just concluded their holy month of Ramadan, dedicated to fasting, prayer and alms-giving.)


See the pope calls Muslims Brothers! You are brothers with someone because you have the same Father - Christians are brothers because of being in Christ Jesus... But to be brothers with Muslims you'd have to have their god! And that's Satan.... We are NEVER to work together with other religions because they are ALL from Satan! What does light have to do with darkness? Absolutely Nothing! This is filed under universal salvation of all men.... Not just those who trust in Jesus name....

Educating new believers?? In Islam ???

And then to call their celebration of their religion a Holy day?

How is Islam or anything to do with it Holy?

To think that you would get with a people and work with a people who deny Jesus is the son of God.....


There is never any excuse to work with Islam or any other religion...

 

[KNOWLEDGE BOMB]

Either Islam has God the Father (of Jesus)

or rcc has god of islam

that's what you should be asking yourself

 

[Forever trying]

Boy, you need to calm down and get off your high-horse. I'm not saying I like Muslims, let alone extremist... But Jews, Christians, and Muslims all worship the one God who guided Abraham and Moses. Similarities end with Christ though. Islam acknowleges him as a great prophet, whereas we know he was the Christ. I think Muslims (the non-extremist, rational ones) are our brothers just like the Jews. But think on the story of the prodigal son. In the end I'd rather be drawn to people on our similarities and then talk to them on things we differ on, then just straight out hate them and keep the cylce of hatred going. Christ commanded us to love our enemies.

 

[crimsonleaf]

Boy, you need to calm down and get off your high-horse. I'm not saying I like Muslims, let alone extremist... But Jews, Christians, and Muslims all worship the one God who guided Abraham and Moses. Similarities end with Christ though. Islam acknowleges him as a great prophet, whereas we know he was the Christ. I think Muslims (the non-extremist, rational ones) are our brothers just like the Jews. But think on the story of the prodigal son. In the end I'd rather be drawn to people on our similarities and then talk to them on things we differ on, then just straight out hate them and keep the cylce of hatred going. Christ commanded us to love our enemies.

I'm surprised that as a Catholic you would claim Muslims worship the same God. Our God is a Triune God, comprising Father, Son and Holy Spirit. The Muslim God bears no resemblance, and to deny that Christ is part of the Godhead is to deny God as Christians understand Him.

 

[Albion]

Boy, you need to calm down and get off your high-horse. I'm not saying I like Muslims, let alone extremist... But Jews, Christians, and Muslims all worship the one God who guided Abraham and Moses.

That's what Muslims will tell you, but really...if God is Triune, he isn't the God of the Muslims, that's for dead certain.

And that's to say nothing about where the Muslim Allah came from.

 

[ViaCrucis]

Yes. Jews, Christians, and Muslims all worship the same God. We disagree about this God, the Christian affirmation of the Trinity is clearly at odds with the more unitarian position held by both Judaism and Islam; but there are even Christians who reject the Trinity in favor of some heretical position.

Jehovah's Witnesses and Oneness Pentecostals are not worshiping different gods than Trinitarian Christians.

Jews and Christians worship the same God.

Muslims worship that God too.

If that offends certain people's anti-Muslim sensibilities, well, tough.

-CryptoLutheran

 

[Albion]

Yes. Jews, Christians, and Muslims all worship the same God. We disagree about this God, the Christian affirmation of the Trinity is clearly at odds with the more unitarian position held by both Judaism and Islam; but there are even Christians who reject the Trinity in favor of some heretical position.

And we call them heretics for it. The reason we'd still call them Christians is because of their commitment to Christ as Lord and Savior. If they saw him as something else, as Unitarians and Muslims do, we wouldn't agree on calling them Christian heretics.

 

[ViaCrucis]

And we call them heretics for it. The reason we'd still call them Christians is because of their commitment to Christ as Lord and Savior. If they saw him as something else, as Unitarians and Muslims do, we wouldn't agree on calling them Christian heretics.

Agreed. But note that we don't say that they worship an entirely different deity, as though Trinitarians and Jehovah's Witnesses worship two entirely different divine beings. The same Deity is being referred to, it is the understanding that is different.

Jews and Muslims may have an erroneous and incomplete portrait of God, but it's still God that they are directing their worship and prayers toward.

-CryptoLutheran

 

[Albion]

Agreed. But note that we don't say that they worship an entirely different deity, as though Trinitarians and Jehovah's Witnesses worship two entirely different divine beings. The same Deity is being referred to, it is the understanding that is different.

Jews and Muslims may have an erroneous and incomplete portrait of God, but it's still God that they are directing their worship and prayers toward.

-CryptoLutheran

We may have walking into something unexpected, VC, and I'm getting more interested rather than less. In view of your explanation above, what would you say about Mormonism? Is it Christian even though it has fashioned a purely imaginary Christ? Is there any significant difference from the view of the JWs and Muslims?

 

[ViaCrucis]

We may have walking into something unexpected, VC, and I'm getting more interested rather than less. In view of your explanation above, what would you say about Mormonism? Is it Christian even though it has fashioned a purely imaginary Christ? Is there any significant difference from the view of the JWs and Muslims?

I view Mormonism to have deviated significantly from mainstream Christianity that it probably constitutes a distinct religious tradition; that is Mormonism's relationship to Christianity is something akin to Christianity's relationship to Judaism. Or at the very least, it exists somewhere between a major heretical offshoot of Christianity to being a full-fledged religion in its own right distinct from the historic Christian tradition.

The only real difference that I can think of between the JW understanding of God and the Muslim one is that JW's confess that Jesus is God's son, though what they mean by that is markedly different than what the Creeds maintain; whereas Muslims are adamant that God has no son. Both understand God to be a unitary hypostasis, supreme, etc.

To that end, the basic theological error--namely of denying the Trinity--is common between both JWs and Muslims. Though the God they confess is the same we confess, the error is in theology, not in the worship of false gods. JWs and Muslims have not violated the commandment, "You shall have no other gods..."

-CryptoLutheran

 

[KNOWLEDGE BOMB]

Via so you and Muslims have the same god?


Since Muslims worship Allah and Allah Denys Jesus
and Allah is from Satan

so your god and their god both deny Jesus or how's that work?

 

[ViaCrucis]

Via you make no sense since Islam cannot trace itself anywhere near Abram....

Islam worships the God of Abraham, by its own admission. That is the identity of the God they profess.

Second since Muslims follow allah and allah is not the Father of Jesus then their god comes from where? Satan ofcourse

Allah is the Arabic word for God. Christians and Jews who speak Arabic as the first language likewise address God as "Allah", Christians and Jews were calling God "Allah" before Mohammad was even a twinkle in his father's eye. Not all people in the world speak English.

For Christians in places like Egypt, Palestine, or Jordan; yes Allah is the Father of Jesus Christ.

so the RCC and pope clearly tell you that the Muslim God is the same god you have, that would make your god who?

God, "the King eternal, immortal, invisible, the only God" (1 Timothy 1:17)

1. Can't be father of Jesus

I just don't understand catholics who can see that their own pope calls Muslims who deny Christ YOUR BROTHERS and that you both have a God that Denys Jesus

you have to in order for it to be the same

I just wonder how it will be when you expect the RCC to be there at your aide before christ and Jesus aak you about you both having the same Gods and you didn't bat an eye

It'd be more fruitful if you were able to think critically and objectively, rather than working from premise that everything Catholics do and say is evil and icky. One gets the impression that if the Pope enjoyed himself chocolate ice cream, you'd pull out the entire history of cocoa among the ancient people of Mesoamerica in order to show that the Pope is worshiping Quetzalcoatl.

-CryptoLutheran

 

[KNOWLEDGE BOMB]

Boy, you need to calm down and get off your high-horse. I'm not saying I like Muslims, let alone extremist... But Jews, Christians, and Muslims all worship the one God who guided Abraham and Moses. Similarities end with Christ though. Islam acknowleges him as a great prophet, whereas we know he was the Christ. I think Muslims (the non-extremist, rational ones) are our brothers just like the Jews. But think on the story of the prodigal son. In the end I'd rather be drawn to people on our similarities and then talk to them on things we differ on, then just straight out hate them and keep the cylce of hatred going. Christ commanded us to love our enemies.

How funny....

1. Islam cannot trace itself pass moon worship
2. Which means they have nothing to do with God (father of Jesus)
3. You say your a brother with those who deny Jesus - WOW

my high horse is based on truth and not foolishness.... How can a brother through Christ Jesus then be a brother to someone who Denys Him?


See you don't go by the word but by feelings - well Christians Do Not have the same God as Islam - Catholics have him but not us!


Islam Denys Christ and is from Satan - that's a really high horse!

 

[Albion]

Islam worships the God of Abraham, by its own admission. That is the identity of the God they profess.

Remember my Mormon analogy. Just because a religion borrows some existing God, completely redefines who he is but keeps the name, this doesn't mean they are worshipping that God.

Allah is the Arabic word for God.

That's right, but in itself it proves nothing. They will, of course, call their god "God" but so do Deists. That doesn't prove a thing.

 

[KNOWLEDGE BOMB]

Islam worships the God of Abraham, by its own admission. That is the identity of the God they profess.



Allah is the Arabic word for God. Christians and Jews who speak Arabic as the first language likewise address God as "Allah", Christians and Jews were calling God "Allah" before Mohammad was even a twinkle in his father's eye. Not all people in the world speak English.

For Christians in places like Egypt, Palestine, or Jordan; yes Allah is the Father of Jesus Christ.



God, "the King eternal, immortal, invisible, the only God" (1 Timothy 1:17)



It'd be more fruitful if you were able to think critically and objectively, rather than working from premise that everything Catholics do and say is evil and icky. One gets the impression that if the Pope enjoyed himself chocolate ice cream, you'd pull out the entire history of cocoa among the ancient people of Mesoamerica in order to show that the Pope is worshiping Quetzalcoatl.

-CryptoLutheran

Yes lol throw in the ice cream to cover your tracks....


The word says you cannot have the Father if you deny the Son (1john 2:23)

Islam Denys the Son! So they certainly can't have the same God correct?

But yet you do........ You can reason alot of words or what the RCC has said but you can't truthfully get around it....


(oh and saying they believe Jesus was a teacher is still denying the Son as in son of God)

 

[KNOWLEDGE BOMB]

It'd be more fruitful if you were able to think critically and objectively, rather than working from premise that everything Catholics do and say is evil and icky.

KNOWLEDGE BOMB replies:

what untruths have I said? But everything is icky

 

[ViaCrucis]

Yes lol throw in the ice cream to cover your tracks....


The word says you cannot have the Father if you deny the Son (1john 2:23)

Islam Denys the Son! So they certainly can't have the same God correct?

But yet you do........ You can reason alot of words or what the RCC has said but you can't truthfully get around it....


(oh and saying they believe Jesus was a teacher is still denying the Son as in son of God)

So then, the Jews have a different god too, yes?

-CryptoLutheran

 

[ViaCrucis]

Remember my Mormon analogy. Just because a religion borrows some existing God, completely redefines who he is but keeps the name, this doesn't mean they are worshipping that God.

They may not be worshiping Him according to the way in which He has made Himself known, but that doesn't mean they are worshiping some other god beside God.

-CryptoLutheran

 

[ViaCrucis]

what untruths have I said?

Most recently? The whole "moon god" bit. Though I'm sure you got lots of pretty pictures from the internet to show.

-CryptoLutheran

 

[KNOWLEDGE BOMB]

Do the Jews have the same god? How can they when scripture says they can't.

Jews without Jesus will see the lake of fire..... See you don't go by scripture because if you did then you'd go by the one that says if you deny the son you Cant have the Father!


But you don't go by scripture but what you feel is right.... This is exactly why I don't often come back to "debate" anyone.... You never answer the same god thing - how can Islam and your god be the same if they deny Christ.... Back to the pesky ole scripture again