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Radioactive dating

Dr GS Hurd

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Well, it is getting well practiced in science denial like this that paves the way for our current inability to get some serious work done on global warming. It is not a harmless aberration.

I sometime consider that their primitive beliefs will end civilization. And, following the global collapse, those few survivors will also return to the primitive lives of ancient times. Their religions will be also appropriate for the long - possibly final - decline of humanity.
 
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Paul of Eugene OR

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I sometime consider that their primitive beliefs will end civilization. And, following the global collapse, those few survivors will also return to the primitive lives of ancient times. Their religions will be also appropriate for the long - possibly final - decline of humanity.

Well, knowledge accumulates. In the long run, that won't be stopped.
 
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dad

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Well, it is getting well practiced in science denial like this that paves the way for our current inability to get some serious work done on global warming. It is not a harmless aberration.
We have work planned for global warming! Relax. Jesus will take us away, and in the tribulation it will get so hot, that some men will gnaw their tongues. Later, Jesus will return, and the climate will be fantastic! Nothing you can do will change that. Get off the high horse.
 
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dad

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Interesting!

I knew Shem was, but I didn't know Noah was.

Cool info, bro!
Well, I think he was:) At least the Jews claim that in their traditions.

"
Abraham was the tenth generation removed from Noah, being a direct descendant of Shem, (Noah's son), the father of all the "Semitic" peoples. When Abraham was born, Shem was 390 years Old, and his father Noah was 892 years old, Abraham was 58 years old when Noah died, and 110 years old when Shem died. These are important facts, for, as we shall see later, Abraham spent many years in the house of Noah and Sherri, and received instruction from them. Thus he learned all the details about the Flood from the very men who built the Ark and survived the Flood. (Noah knew Methuselah for many hundreds of years, who in turn knew Adam for many hundreds of years, which means that Abraham received first hand information about everything that happened since the very first day of Creation!).

Terah, Abraham's father, was the chief officer or minister of the first king mentioned in the Torah, the mighty King Nimrod of Babylon (also known by its former name, Shinear, and the land of the Chaldees). Terah was an idol worshipper, like his king, and their chief god was the Sun.

We have already told you what a close brush with death Abraham had on the very night of his birth. For Nimrod's stargazers told the king that Terah's newly-bom son would one day be a danger to his throne. Nimrod ordered Terah to send him the baby, to be put to death. Terah, however, outwitted the king. Instead of sending his real son to the king, be sent the baby of a slave who was born on the same night as Abraham, and Nimrod killed the baby with his own hands, believing that he was now safe from the threat.

The baby Abraham, with his mother and nurse, were hidden in a cave for ten years.

At the age of three years, Abraham knew that it was silly to worship the sun or any other idol, but that there was a great G-d, who created the sun and the moon, and the whole world, who, though Himself unseen, sees everything and knows everything, and is the real King of the World, more powerful than Nimrod. And since that time, Abraham's faith in G-d grew stronger every day.

At the age of ten, Abraham decided to leave the cave and to go to old Noah and Shem, of whom his mother had told him many wonderful stories. Unknown to anybody, Abraham made his way from the low country to the mountainous region of Ararat in the land of Kedem, where Noah and his family lived. He was made welcome by old Noah and Shem, who taught him all they knew about G-d and the ways of G-d.

Abraham stayed there for nearly 39 years, until the year 1997. It was at the end of this period, when he was 48 years old, while still at Noah's house, that Abraham heard about the world-shattering event of the Tower of Babel, which took place in the land of Shinear, where Nimrod reigned supreme. Nimrod and his people wanted to build a tower that would reach up to heaven, so that they might establish their reign upon the heaven as well as on the earth. It was the height of arrogance and defiance of men against G-d, and it led to confusion and to their dispersal and division into seventy tongues and nations. Abraham decided that it was high time for him to go out and teach them the truth about G-d, and about the falsehood and worthlessness of the idols. He knew that in defying Nimrod, and even his own father, he would be risking his life, for Nimrod had proclaimed himself god and demanded that all the people worship him.

At the age of fifty (in the year 1998) Abraham returned to his father's house in Babylon.

Terah was a high priest of the idol worshippers. He had twelve chief gods, one for each month of the year, and other idols. In fact, there was a workshop in Terah's house, where idols of wood, stone, silver and gold were made. People came to offer sacrifices to these idols, or to buy them, and Terah had a thriving business. Terah appointed Abraham to be the salesman and take charge of the business. How "well" he conducted the business, we have already told you.

Abraham's activities, in words and deeds, aroused Nimrod's anger. Both Abraham and his father were ordered to appear before the king. Here the king's stargazers at once recognized Abraham as the one about whom they had warned the king. Terah was taken to task for deceiving the king, and he put the blame on his older son Haran, who was 32 years older than Abraham. Haran had secretly followed Abraham, but he was not quite sure whether he was wise in doing so. He thought that he would come out openly on Abraham's side, if and when Abraham would come out victorious. Nimrod ordered that Abraham be thrown into a burning furnace.

When Abraham came out unharmed, Haran declared himself on Abraham's side and chose to be likewise thrown into the furnace, and he was burnt to death. Abraham, on the other band, whom G-d" had so wonderfully saved from the fire, was acclaimed by all the people, and they were ready to worship him. But Abraham told them to worship G-d, who had saved him from the burning furnace, and that he himself was nothing but a human being. Nimrod was greatly afraid of Abraham. He gave him many precious gifts, among them Eliezer, a member of the king's household, who became Abraham's trusted servant and friend.

Abraham, and his remaining brother Nahor, married two sisters, their nieces, the daughters of their brother Haran. Nahor married Milkah, and Abraham married Yiskah, better known as Sarai, (later-Sarah).

Two years later, Nimrod had a strange dream and once again his counsellors interpreted it to mean that as long as Abraham lived, his kingdom would be in danger. Nimrod, who had been worried about Abraham all the time, decided to try again to kill him, and sent men to capture him. Fortunately, Eliezer learned of the plot and informed Abraham in good time. Abraham, with his band of followers, numbering over 300, fled to Noah. About a month later, his father Terah came to visit him there. Abraham persuaded him to give up his idolatry. He pointed out to him, moreover, that his life was also in danger, for Nimrod would not spare him. So Terah gave up his high position at Nimrod's court, and decided to go with Abraham to the land of Canaan, where they would be free to worship G-d, out of reach of Nimrod.

Thus Terah, his son Abraham and his wife Sarai, and Lot, Haran's son, and all their household left Ur of the Chaldees in Babylon and set out for Canaan. On the way they came to Charan, where Nahor lived, found it a good place, and stayed there.

Three years later, when Abraham was 55 years old, G-d appeared to Abraham and told him to take his wife and household and go on to Canaan. This Abraham did, and be stayed there 15 years. At this time, when Abraham was 70 years old, G‑d made a covenant with him, and soon afterwards Abraham returned to Charan, where he stayed for five years. Then, once again G-d appeared to Abraham and told him to leave his father's home and native land for good, and go to the land of Canaan. This time, Lot his nephew (and brother-in-law) accompanied him. Terah died in Charan, and Nahor remained there with his family.

Thus, at the age of 75, Abraham came to dwell in the land of Canaan, the land which G-d had promised him to be the chosen land for his children as an everlasting inheritance."

http://www.chabad.org/library/article_cdo/aid/112063/jewish/Abrahams-Early-Life.htm
 
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AV1611VET

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Deleted, because I have better things to do.
By the way, Goonie, I appreciate you supporting this site.

Not that I'm a spokesman for this site or anything.

I just think that's commendable, in view of the fact that you are an atheist.
 
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Loudmouth

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Yours is though since it sits on belief.

Hypotheses sit on no beliefs.


Same Person changed the state as created the universe. Why expect some weirdness?

You are the one claiming that a same state past is the weirdness. So why would the evidence be consistent with a same state past?

Anyone can claim the evidence matches their beliefs.

You can't. You have been completely incapable of showing how the ratios in rocks match the predictions made by a different state past. Therefore, the ratios are evidence of a same state past, not a different state past. You have been proven wrong.

The evidence itself does not prove your claimed past nature in any way.

And yet you can't show how the evidence is inconsistent with a same state past.

Because the stuff in the glass was created stuff. It just did something new in the new nature. Simple.

Why would this produce evidence that is consistent with a same state past?

Your idea of consistent rests entirely in la la land in the imaginary same state past fantasy construct.

Then tell us how the ratios would be different if there was a same state past. If you can't, then you have admitted that the evidence supports a same state past.

Name the point in (imaginary) time you think that both of those things happened?

Answer the question. Stop avoiding it.

If the creation produced rocks with a 50/50 ratio of both U/Pb series then it would not fall on the concordia line. Can you tell us why the creation could not produce zircons with a 50/50 ratio for both U/Pb series? If you can't, then all of the evidence is consistent with a same state past, not a former state past.

Decay rate?? You claim there was decay in the far past? Where is the evidence for this claim?

The evidence is that U/Pb ratios for both decay series fall on the concordia line. Notice that the y and x axis are simply the measured ratios. The prediction is that when you plot those ratios they will fall on the line labeled "Concordia".

figure4.jpg


No assumptions of age are used.

Once we determine the ratio, you claim that the ratio exists because of present state decay.

If the U/Pb ratios did not consistently fall on the Concordia line, I would claim that they weren't produced by present state decay. My hypothesis is falsifiable.

You can't explain why a different state past would produce those specific ratios. A same state past does. Therefore, the data supports a same state past.

What else matters? Who cares how the ratios are measured??! The issue is what you do with them once we measured them.

I use them to test a falsifiable hypothesis. What do you do with them? Nothing?

Why would I try to weld reality to fit your godless unproven nature of the past? That is insanity.

I just proved a same state past, and you haven't been able to refute one bit of the evidence.
 
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Goonie

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By the way, Goonie, I appreciate you supporting this site.

Not that I'm a spokesman for this site or anything.

I just think that's commendable, in view of the fact that you are an atheist.
Thanks:) I appreciate a well moderated forum, and where else do you find flat earthers debating creationists:clap:
 
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dad

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Hypotheses sit on no beliefs.
False yours does sit. It does nothing else. Any so called hypothesis that assumes a same state past along with our present decay, sits. Sits and stands and squats on belief only.

You are the one claiming that a same state past is the weirdness. So why would the evidence be consistent with a same state past?
Do not ask the world to try to correlate itself and alll things to your unproven belief in a certain godless belief set.


You can't. You have been completely incapable of showing how the ratios in rocks match the predictions made by a different state past.
They match in fantasy land. What really matches is ratios. Created ratios have a pattern. You have inserted your belief system into that pattern, and think all must interpret it accordingly. Get a grip.

Therefore, the ratios are evidence of a same state past, not a different state past. You have been proven wrong.
Therefore...you believe in an unproven state in the past and are incapable of rational or free thought. Come on over to the sound minded, free thinking side. The water is fine.

Then tell us how the ratios would be different if there was a same state past. If you can't, then you have admitted that the evidence supports a same state past.
Relax. No one needs to address the strawman of a same state past that has no proof. Your whole bag is to obsess on your religious beliefs in a present state having existed in the past. You also claim it will exist in the future. Apparently God disagrees what the future will be like.



If the creation produced rocks with a 50/50 ratio of both U/Pb series then it would not fall on the concordia line.
Your concordia line is a belief line. A belief in a present state nature in the past. You then fit the creation ratios in, based on assuming the decay caused the daughter material. You are flat busted.


No assumptions of age are used.
Well, then if no ages are involved, what is in concord with what? Be honest.


If the U/Pb ratios did not consistently fall on the Concordia line, I would claim that they weren't produced by present state decay. My hypothesis is falsifiable.
Show the basis for the line. In what way do you even know that decay dates fall in line if you claim no assumptions of ages are involved?! It seems to me you must look at present decay. Then you map that out into the past.
I use them to test a falsifiable hypothesis. What do you do with them? Nothing?
No, you use then to hijack creation ratios!
 
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dad

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Do you have to prove a defendant guilty before you can use DNA fingerprinting?
You think you are in court now? What are you the criminal or judge? Keep us posted. As for DNA, that does not extend to Noah's day. You be hooped.
 
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Loudmouth

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False yours does sit. It does nothing else. Any so called hypothesis that assumes a same state past along with our present decay, sits. Sits and stands and squats on belief only.

All claims with zero evidence to back it up.

How does my hypothesis sit on beliefs? If there was a different state past, there is every reason to expect that the observations would not match the predictions of the hypothesis.

Do we have to prove a defendant is guilty before we can use DNA fingerprinting. Do we molest the DNA by simply seeing if it matches what we would expect to see from a DNA match?

Do not ask the world to try to correlate itself and alll things to your unproven belief in a certain godless belief set.

Then what in the world do you mean by evidence? Isn't evidence a set of observations that we would expect to see if a claim is true?

Until you describe what you mean by proof of evidence, you are doing nothing but blowing smoke.
 
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