YES! And I have read many! But I don't find species changing completely into something else!
If you can find me something like this, that would be awesome.
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Quick question on evolution
- Thread starter dysert
- Start date
YES! And I have read many! But I don't find species changing completely into something else!
If you can find me something like this, that would be awesome.
Because, like whales, they still have the remnants of pelvic bones.
[EDIT] I see PsychoSarah beat me to it.
We do have fossils of creatures related to seals and sea lions (or "pinnipeds"), but naturally these were around long before mankind itself, let along recorded history.
Reconstruction of the earliest known pinneped, Enaliarctos mealsi: A) Original fossil material; B) Reconstruction of Enaliarctos mealsi (USNM 374272); C) Life restoration of B; D) comparison with the closest living relative, the Southern Sea Lion, Otaria flavescenes (redrawn from Blainville). Illustrations by Mary Parrish under the direction of Annalisa Berta and Clayton Ray. Published in the Journal of Vertebrate Paleontology. The stipple technique (A, B) and graphite pencil technique (C) were used to render the illustration.
(SOURCE: paleobiology.si.edu)
I don't understand how fossils with similar bone structures automatically are assumed they are direct descendants from each other and not just different species living together (like seals and sea lions for example)
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PsychoSarah
Chaotic Neutral
It doesn't happen in one generation, you'll never see one species become another that quickly. It is many gradual changes for the most part, with occasional spurts caused by population bottle necks, etc.
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Notedstrangeperson
Well-Known Member
The "mitochrondrial Eve" is more of a nickname rather than the actual Eve of the Bible. She was estimated to live approx. 200,000 years ago in Africa. "Y-Chromosomal Adam" was estimated to live anywhere between 120,000 to 338,000 years ago, depending on which particular paper you look at.
Well that depends: a moment ago you said that that all living creatures have similar DNA because they have a common creator - but as you've just said, the "Y-Chromosomal Adam" and the "Mitochrondrial Eve" do show that all humans have a common ancestor.anyathesword said:
If Y-chromosomal Adam and Mitochrondrial Eve prove we are all related, it makes sense to think that the more DNA we share with non-humans animals, the more closely related we are to them.
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Yes, I understand the time factor. But have we seen any changes in seals before or after now? Humans have been around since a few thousand years..
That is definitly more than one generation of seals...
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No not neccessarily. (Yes, I understand it isn't the Biblical Adam and Eve, it is just the name for the ancestor and our common DNA). We trace ourselves back to them as humans. But we as humans can not trace ourselves with the animals back to a common ancestor...
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PsychoSarah
Chaotic Neutral
Yes, but written language hasn't existed as long as humans have, gosh, the first time in which a species extinction was really publicized was the Dodo bird in the 1600s. We haven't had the technology to make those kinds of observations the whole time humans existed, only very recently.
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Notedstrangeperson
Well-Known Member
You've pretty much answered you own question there - in some cases anatomical similarities indicate shared ancestry, rather than convergent evolution.anyathesword said:
Let's look at dugongs and manatees vs. seals and sea lions again for a moment. Even though all of them have a similar body structure and similar habits, dugongs and manatees are more closely related to elephants. For example:
Replica skull of a dugong:
Skull of young elephant (sorry about the tiny pic):
Now compare them to the skulls of seals and sea-lions, especially the teeth ...
Skull of California sea lion:
Skull of Harbour Seal:
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Notedstrangeperson
Well-Known Member
On the contrary - we can because we use the same technology. The technology used to discover our human ancestry is used to discover our non-human ancestry.
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And-U-Say
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Not sure just how many changes. That would depend on your definition of "changes". It would probably take millions of years of time.
The sole factor would be the enhanced survivability of certain members of the population that are better adapted to the water environment.
Hold on there, Tex! This IS happening today. Walruses, seals, manatees, and other species are on the trail from land animal to sea faring. One could even say otters. Whether they will continue on this trail or stay stable in their current form will be a question of mutations and environment.
You know, just by looking at extant spices, it is pretty obvious that all the transitions you worry about have all ready happened and are indeed represented with many examples. Your ignorance of the animal kingdom is no excuse for your lack of understanding this concept.
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Some More Observed Speciation Events
Here you go. I await your pending dismissal with baited breath.
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Um, we do actually. mitochondrial eve et al are just our most recent common ancestor. There's plenty more in previous species.
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We are in the same family as chimps. We are still primates.
We are in the same family as tigers. We are still mammals.
We are in the same family as fish. We are still vertebrates.
Did you know that we can trace back DNA to the common ancestor of two species using the same technique?
Through phylogenies. Genomic DNA comparisons produce a nested hierarchy which is the pattern of similarity that evidences evolution.
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