Questions on sanctification from a new believer

[Phil W]

The original text in the Bible was a lot more colorful and difficult for most of us to comprehend, let alone even being able to read. For example, in English we read the same word for "love" used for 3 or 4 different senses or meanings of the word. (See:
Different Types Of Love From The Bible: A Christian Study "It appears that, in New Testament times, there were at least four different Greek words that we translate as the English word ‘love’. This variety actually helps us in the work of translation because each of the four different Greek words carries a slightly different definition from the other three. This makes it a little clearer as to what the original means. These words were:..."

This is the same case for the word "sanctification" as we read it in English.

Referring to a Secular Dictionary, esp. one NOT addressing the original Greek (or Hebrew) word can be a far cry from deriving TRUE intent or meaning of the word. English, for example, does not have all of the words old Greek, for example, has and thereby a continuity of a word-for-word translation is impossible. In the translation process the translators (who ARE fluent in the original Greek and/or Hebrew) convey the meaning of the word through its contextual use and application. The best a lay person of the faith can do is pray for insight from the Holy Spirit within and utilize a Strongs or otherwise EXHAUSTIVE CONCORDANCE of the Bible and examine the use of the word in various locations of the Bible: to examine the CONTEXTUAL use of the the word. This is just what the source did in the earlier link which I provided for the different uses of the word "sanctification" of which you choose to disagree. Of course, another way to learn what the Bible is saying is to find a highly qualified mentor or teacher of the Bible God's Word and allow them to convey its intent, but always verified by your submission to the Holy Spirit within and your own Bible study with at least a concordance.

If you are still lost think about one's use of the English language and its homonyms like "squash" or "draft" or "bark" or "jam" or "mine" or... . If you were a foreigner who did not understand English very well and isolated the word and looked it up in a dictionary it it would be impossible to derive its intended meaning as multiple meanings will be given. One can ignorantly or bias-ly choose to make it say what they want it to say by selecting an unintended meaning from the dictionary or go back and read its contextual use in association with all of the wording and grammar of the sentence or relevant surrounding sentences and/or paragraphs (this is CONTEXTUAL use) and discover the actual intended meaning.

Read more: Different Types Of Love From The Bible: A Christian Study

Don't all the different meanings of the word "love" still boil down to...love?
Don't all the definitions of sanctity still boil down to holy and clean?

 

[Monksailor]

Don't all the different meanings of the word "love" still boil down to...love?
Don't all the definitions of sanctity still boil down to holy and clean?

Clearly, NOT. You must not have read the link(s) I provided or lived very long relative to decades. That is OK. You will learn that "I love you" can mean an assortment of things. Several of them are VERY painful to discover esp if discovered after having committed to such a "love" "till DEATH do us part" before man and God who HATES divorce. It is critical to learn the different understandings of love as early as possible in life. If one desires to not do so and think that all love is the same this one is due for much pain and heart break. Love, life, is not simple, we have to prudently devote our undivided attention to it. There is no quick and easy online resource which can provide the information we need for our personal and unique relational situations. Such resources can only provide peripheral and generalized and standardized information which may work or most likely NOT work. Even if someone experienced the same relational transaction/exchange their advice is most likely moot because that transaction occurred between two very different individual personalities or characters than you two. The different transaction-al dynamics of the two separate relationships are exponentially deviant. One can make what works for one work for another but it will be only an improvisation with "adjustments" and not a custom fit and, what works for one person can also have the opposite effect for the other. I had a friend once who could not get their constantly stewing-over spouse to open up and allow them in to help so they did what they had seen and been told worked for others. This person said something to the "stewer" which they knew would get them to blow up which as they had been told would open up the valve of expression and ventilation. As a result, this "open-upper" was almost blinded and the relationship was damaged. Most relational, if not all, advice online is only a guess or worse, as I have encountered here once, someone carrying a vendetta from a painful experience of their own and transferring part of it to the spouse of a person here. This person was making all kinds of un-grounded assumptions against the spouse and clearly looking for an opportunity to vent their hatred for someone in/out of their life while feigning their attempt to "help" another. This person probably would have even said that they were giving advice in "love" while not REALLY concerned at all about trying to help restore a broken relationship with which this person was struggling and desiring to restore.

Sanctity is different from sanctification. The former is a STATE of being and the later, a PROCESS in the context of our OP. The OP in our case is dealing with the PROCESS of sanctification, the SECOND type of sanctification given in the first link I gave earlier, a PROGRESSIVE or EXPERIENTIAL sanctification; as God's Word points out below, the process of "being sanctified." During this process, between conversion and death/rapture we struggle with sin ascribing toward the final and eternal state given in paragraph three. I will give the second paragraph of that link here which describes , I believe, the sanctification our OP is addressing which includes a multiplicity of SCRIPTURAL references. The first sentence below is merely a transitional sentence reiterating the firstly/formerly described type of sanctification and linking it with the type focused on in this second paragraph. The verses in this paragraph, other than the first, refer to this type of sanctification, I believe, of the OP:

"While we are positionally holy (“set free from every sin” by the blood of Christ, Acts 13:39), we know that we still sin (1 John 1:10). That’s why the Bible also refers to sanctification as a practical experience of our separation unto God. “Progressive” or “experiential” sanctification, as it is sometimes called, is the effect of obedience to the Word of God in one’s life. It is the same as growing in the Lord (2 Peter 3:18) or spiritual maturity. God started the work of making us like Christ, and He is continuing it (Philippians 1:6). This type of sanctification is to be pursued by the believer earnestly (1 Peter 1:15; Hebrews 12:14) and is effected by the application of the Word (John 17:17). Progressive sanctification has in view the setting apart of believers for the purpose for which they are sent into the world: “As you sent me into the world, I have sent them into the world. For them I sanctify myself, that they too may be truly sanctified” (John 17:18–19). That Jesus set Himself apart for God’s purpose is both the basis and the condition of our being set apart (see John 10:36). We are sanctified and sent because Jesus was. Our Lord’s sanctification is the pattern of and power for our own. The sending and the sanctifying are inseparable. On this account we are called “saints” (hagioi in the Greek), or “sanctified ones.” Prior to salvation, our behavior bore witness to our standing in the world in separation from God, but now our behavior should bear witness to our standing before God in separation from the world. Little by little, every day, “those who are being sanctified” (Hebrews 10:14, ESV) are becoming more like Christ." See at: What is sanctification? What is the definition of Christian sanctification? | GotQuestions.org

I do hope that has helped. It took much valuable time. If you have further questions please address them with someone else here. I must go. May the Lord bless you with Truth revelation.

 

[Phil W]

Clearly, NOT. You must not have read the link(s) I provided or lived very long relative to decades. That is OK. You will learn that "I love you" can mean an assortment of things. Several of them are VERY painful to discover esp if discovered after having committed to such a "love" "till DEATH do us part" before man and God who HATES divorce. It is critical to learn the different understandings of love as early as possible in life. If one desires to not do so and think that all love is the same this one is due for much pain and heart break. Love, life, is not simple, we have to prudently devote our undivided attention to it. There is no quick and easy online resource which can provide the information we need for our personal and unique relational situations. Such resources can only provide peripheral and generalized and standardized information which may work or most likely NOT work. Even if someone experienced the same relational transaction/exchange their advice is most likely moot because that transaction occurred between two very different individual personalities or characters than you two. The different transaction-al dynamics of the two separate relationships are exponentially deviant. One can make what works for one work for another but it will be only an improvisation with "adjustments" and not a custom fit and, what works for one person can also have the opposite effect for the other. I had a friend once who could not get their constantly stewing-over spouse to open up and allow them in to help so they did what they had seen and been told worked for others. This person said something to the "stewer" which they knew would get them to blow up which as they had been told would open up the valve of expression and ventilation. As a result, this "open-upper" was almost blinded and the relationship was damaged. Most relational, if not all, advice online is only a guess or worse, as I have encountered here once, someone carrying a vendetta from a painful experience of their own and transferring part of it to the spouse of a person here. This person was making all kinds of un-grounded assumptions against the spouse and clearly looking for an opportunity to vent their hatred for someone in/out of their life while feigning their attempt to "help" another. This person probably would have even said that they were giving advice in "love" while not REALLY concerned at all about trying to help restore a broken relationship with which this person was struggling and desiring to restore.

Sorry, but I won't start to think that love can mean anything but love, no matter who or what says otherwise.

Sanctity is different from sanctification. The former is a STATE of being and the later, a PROCESS in the context of our OP. The OP in our case is dealing with the PROCESS of sanctification, the SECOND type of sanctification given in the first link I gave earlier, a PROGRESSIVE or EXPERIENTIAL sanctification; as God's Word points out below, the process of "being sanctified." During this process, between conversion and death/rapture we struggle with sin ascribing toward the final and eternal state given in paragraph three. I will give the second paragraph of that link here which describes , I believe, the sanctification our OP is addressing which includes a multiplicity of SCRIPTURAL references. The first sentence below is merely a transitional sentence reiterating the firstly/formerly described type of sanctification and linking it with the type focused on in this second paragraph. The verses in this paragraph, other than the first, refer to this type of sanctification, I believe, of the OP:

Wow, you have gone and complicated something so clear.
Sanctification happens when the blood of Christ is applied to our bodies, at our "immersion" into Christ and into His death.
It is done.
We will continue to grow in grace and knowledge, but will never need to or be more clean, holy, set apart, consecrated, or atoned for than the very first day in Christ.
Were your supposition true, you are inserting unclean, partially holy, a little set apart, sorta' consecrated, somewhat atoned for people into Christ.
That isn't happening.

"While we are positionally holy (“set free from every sin” by the blood of Christ, Acts 13:39), we know that we still sin (1 John 1:10).

You have cited the status of those who walk in darkness, but have omitted the status of those walking in the light.
All their old sin is gone and they won't be sinning again if they want to claim they are still in the light-God.

That’s why the Bible also refers to sanctification as a practical experience of our separation unto God. “Progressive” or “experiential” sanctification, as it is sometimes called, is the effect of obedience to the Word of God in one’s life. It is the same as growing in the Lord (2 Peter 3:18) or spiritual maturity. God started the work of making us like Christ, and He is continuing it (Philippians 1:6). This type of sanctification is to be pursued by the believer earnestly (1 Peter 1:15; Hebrews 12:14) and is effected by the application of the Word (John 17:17). Progressive sanctification has in view the setting apart of believers for the purpose for which they are sent into the world: “As you sent me into the world, I have sent them into the world. For them I sanctify myself, that they too may be truly sanctified” (John 17:18–19). That Jesus set Himself apart for God’s purpose is both the basis and the condition of our being set apart (see John 10:36). We are sanctified and sent because Jesus was. Our Lord’s sanctification is the pattern of and power for our own. The sending and the sanctifying are inseparable. On this account we are called “saints” (hagioi in the Greek), or “sanctified ones.” Prior to salvation, our behavior bore witness to our standing in the world in separation from God, but now our behavior should bear witness to our standing before God in separation from the world. Little by little, every day, “those who are being sanctified” (Hebrews 10:14, ESV) are becoming more like Christ." See at: What is sanctification? What is the definition of Christian sanctification? | GotQuestions.org

I do hope that has helped. It took much valuable time. If you have further questions please address them with someone else here. I must go. May the Lord bless you with Truth revelation.

I am not interested in the ways of those who accommodate sin as part of being free from sin.

 

[Monksailor]

Don't all the different meanings of the word "love" still boil down to...love?
Don't all the definitions of sanctity still boil down to holy and clean?

While I have been out working I thought of another angle from which you might be speaking about "love." All the many forms of worldly or unGodly love are manifested with one primary concern whether it is a conscious or an unconscious: what am I going to get out of it. The most base form of "love" will steal another's soul, so-to-speak, just for a few moments of sensual pleasure or a signed contract or even a marriage vow, if they believe they are that desperate. The "love-giver" is mostly, if not all, concerned about what they have decided WHAT they need and "love" the person for WHAT they offer and are not even concerned about what they themselves bring to the table for the other. This "love" is almost animalistic or barbaric in nature. Near the higher order of worldly love is the 50/50 averaging relationship. Unhealthy or narcissistic relationships are excluded. But, if one will not keep up their share and make the other do it all or most of it, the relationship is on the rocks and history if something isn't done quickly to reverse the shortfall. Agape, Christian love, is Christ-centered and NOT self-centered. It loves even in spite of abuse or receiving nothing in return. Agape love always loves the other for WHO they are with all of their faults and for THEIR good, first. 1 Corinthians 13 NIV describes this AGAPE love in detail.

Point in short: love can be the types which are primarily concerned about WHAT one gets out of the relationship or primarily concerned about WHO the other person is and what can be done to encourage, serve, build, and uplift towards God's purpose for them. None is perfect, and we all struggle to emulate Agape love 100%, 50% of the time. We cannot do it on our own but drawing upon God we can; more and more=sanctification of this OP.

 

[Monksailor]

Sorry, but I won't start to think that love can mean anything but love, no matter who or what says otherwise.


Wow, you have gone and complicated something so clear.
Sanctification happens when the blood of Christ is applied to our bodies, at our "immersion" into Christ and into His death.
It is done.
We will continue to grow in grace and knowledge, but will never need to or be more clean, holy, set apart, consecrated, or atoned for than the very first day in Christ.
Were your supposition true, you are inserting unclean, partially holy, a little set apart, sorta' consecrated, somewhat atoned for people into Christ.
That isn't happening.


You have cited the status of those who walk in darkness, but have omitted the status of those walking in the light.
All their old sin is gone and they won't be sinning again if they want to claim they are still in the light-God.


I am not interested in the ways of those who accommodate sin as part of being free from sin.

Please share us your meaning of "LOVE" as there are so many. You can not reasonably, logically, or rationally get away with simply saying love is "love."

You are ignoring a multitude of Scripture which I have given which clearly informs us that we CHRISTIANS ARE in a PROCESS of BEING SANCTIFIED. If you choose to ignore God's Word, you are not seeking the Truth.

 

[Emsmom1]

Phil W- do you mean if someone is a true Christian they won’t sin again (after they believe)?

 

[Phil W]

Please share us your meaning of "LOVE" as there are so many. You can not reasonably, logically, or rationally get away with simply saying love is "love."

Do unto others as you would have them do unto you.

You are ignoring a multitude of Scripture which I have given which clearly informs us that we CHRISTIANS ARE in a PROCESS of BEING SANCTIFIED. If you choose to ignore God's Word, you are not seeking the Truth.

Were that the case, the blood of Jesus Christ was wasted on the cross.
It is the only atoning, sanctifying substance for us in the universe.
You are opining that two week old Christians are only partially atoned for or set apart for Godly work.
With that in mind, how long does it take for one to be cleansed from their sins?
The only thing that is a process is our growth in grace and knowledge.
But we start our reborn lives totally sanctified.
Either that or those reborn of God's seed are not wholly reborn.

 

[Phil W]

Phil W- do you mean if someone is a true Christian they won’t sin again (after they believe)?

Rules of this site prohibit me from saying that truth.
It's actually after they repent of sin.
You know, "turn from".

 

[Emsmom1]

Rules of this site prohibit me from saying that truth.
It's actually after they repent of sin.
You know, "turn from".

Are you saying that you haven’t sinned since you were saved- like not even a bad thought?

 

[Phil W]

Are you saying that you haven’t sinned since you were saved- like not even a bad thought?

Salvation won't be assured till the day of judgement, though that is my hope, to the glory of God.
I have not sinned since since my "turn from" sin.

 

[Emsmom1]

Salvation won't be assured till the day of judgement, though that is my hope, to the glory of God.
I have not sinned since since my "turn from" sin.

When was that? (In terms of how long ago you turned from sin)

 

[Phil W]

When was that? (In terms of how long ago you turned from sin)

Over a decade ago...to the praise and glory of God.
God made a narrow path to walk on, and in the light there is no stumbling.

 

[Emsmom1]

That’s interesting. I grew up in church and went to a Christian school but no one ever suggested Christians were (or could be) sinless. Is this a belief of a particular church or did you come to it on your own?

 

[Phil W]

That’s interesting. I grew up in church and went to a Christian school but no one ever suggested Christians were (or could be) sinless. Is this a belief of a particular church or did you come to it on your own?

I was raised Catholic, to start with.
At twenty-five years of age I started to get interested in the bible, and was hearing all sorts of things about a rapture.
On the way out of work one day I saw a man sitting in a staircase reading his bible and I said "I'm starting to get interested in the bible too!"
He invited me to a mid-week service his church held.
I got baptized in a creek that night, after hearing their deacon defend life without sin to another, not so open minded, visitor who was intent on justifying sin in the life of believers.
The deacon allowed the man to rant for a while but then said he should "shut up" and let the other visitor speak (me).
One of the things that was covered was 1 Peter 3:21, and baptism's necessity for "a good conscience towards God".
I wanted that kind of conscience more than any thing and said..."I think I should be baptized."
They took me out and baptized me in the name of Jesus Christ for the remission of past sins, and I was on my way!
When I think back on how it all came about, I can think of a dozen little things I now consider miracles that led me to that staircase.
And I thank God for each one.
Our church is called "The Church By Christ Jesus (Eph 3:21)"
A name from the first century after Christ.

 

[Radagast]

1. From what I understand, sanctification is a life-long journey, but do different people progress at different rates?

It certainly seems so.

2. Whose "effort?" Ours, God's, or God's + ours?

Both, I think.

3. How/when/where does the Holy Spirit come into play?

Constantly. Sanctification is all about the Holy Spirit working inside us.

4. Is there a difference between a bad habit and a sin?

A "bad habit" is usually a habitual sin.

BTW, this is the classical Reformed view on how sanctification fits in:

 

[ripple the car]

BTW, this is the classical Reformed view on how sanctification fits in:

Radagast; interesting, thank you. So, the Reformed view states that man does work and will, personally, in the process of Sanctification, and that it is not God alone working in and through that person, but also they, themselves, making a willful and chosen effort?

 

[Phil W]

Radagast; interesting, thank you. So, the Reformed view states that man does work and will, personally, in the process of Sanctification, and that it is not God alone working in and through that person, but also they, themselves, making a willful and chosen effort?

I must ask you. Gracia, do you think those born of God's seed are sanctified?
What is your definition of sanctification?
If it is: made holy, set apart, consecrated, atoned for, or pure, how can one born of God not be sanctified from the very start of their new lives?
We will grow in grace and knowledge as we age, but we start out holy and atoned for...right?

 

[ripple the car]

I must ask you. Gracia, do you think those born of God's seed are sanctified?
What is your definition of sanctification?
If it is: made holy, set apart, consecrated, atoned for, or pure, how can one born of God not be sanctified from the very start of their new lives?
We will grow in grace and knowledge as we age, but we start out holy and atoned for...right?

Hey, Sir. I consider salvation to be a life long process in which God's grace saves us through faith in Christ, and through our works of obedience and love done in Christ, as we live for Him, in Him, and because of Him. It's a journey.

 

[Phil W]

Hey, Sir. I consider salvation to be a life long process in which God's grace saves us through faith in Christ, and through our works of obedience and love done in Christ, as we live for Him, in Him, and because of Him. It's a journey.

So you equate salvation with sanctification.
Personally, my salvation won't be assured till the day of judgement, but I was reborn sanctified; washed, cleansed, and made holy by the blood of the Lamb.
Hebrews 10:10, 14 attest to this POV.

 

[ripple the car]

So you equate salvation with sanctification.
Personally, my salvation won't be assured till the day of judgement, but I was reborn sanctified; washed, cleansed, and made holy by the blood of the Lamb.
Hebrews 10:10, 14 attest to this POV.

Hey, Phil. Yes, what many Christians would describe as "sanctification", I would equate as part of the salvation journey.