Questions about Judas Iscariot

[98cwitr]

Judas was predestined to betray Christ. His soul was always damned...from the beginning of time.

Acts 1:16
New International Version (NIV)
16 and said, “Brothers and sisters,[a] the Scripture had to be fulfilled in which the Holy Spirit spoke long ago through David concerning Judas, who served as guide for those who arrested Jesus.

 

[Bluelion]

Agreed...not comparing and contrasting, but just a thought that popped in my mind. I guess the following holds true

Hebrews 10:26
New International Version (NIV)
26 If we deliberately keep on sinning after we have received the knowledge of the truth, no sacrifice for sins is left,

but what does that mean? I don't believe a person can lose salvation, maybe its like in judas case knowing God is good and choosing evil instead. The offering was gone because it was reject knowing full well Jesus is the way to Life and if the person chose that, they would change, but they did not want it.

If its saying if you sin after saved well we all are in trouble. Then who would be left even Paul sinned. That was not he plan. it speak of those who God shows them complete truth, and literally they are standing there and can eat the fruit of life or the fruit of death, and they throw the fruit of life and eat death. Now that there is no excuse for. That is evil to the core and not anything from God. There simply is no humanness left in the person who eats death.

just my thoughts.

 

[Bluelion]

Judas was predestined to betray Christ. His soul was always damned...from the beginning of time.

Acts 1:16
New International Version (NIV)
16 and said, “Brothers and sisters,[a] the Scripture had to be fulfilled in which the Holy Spirit spoke long ago through David concerning Judas, who served as guide for those who arrested Jesus.

it was going to happen however judas still was given the best chance he could possibly have. I have thought what if that was me, I am so i glad that was not me. What was judas faults money power, this is what he wanted. He wanted to rule. what were the other apostles one difference, they open there hearts to Jesus. They trusted him. If judas would have asked just once, Lord how can I be saved, will you save me. God would have saved him. judas did not ask. Does God reject any one who in there heart ask these words, God save me. no he saves them. On the cross the theif what did he do?He asked save me, and was saved. It really was that simple for judas. Ask, Jesus said it ask and you shall receive.

 

[alex2165]

Judas Iscariot was predestined to be an Apostle of Christ and not a traitor. Word predestined can be interpreted in two different ways.

Being predestined without free will by default, or being predestined with a free will to have a choice.

John 9.1-13
Jesus healed a blind from birth man on the Sabbath

1.As He walked along, He saw a man blind from birth.
2.His disciples asked Him, “Rabbi, who sinned, this man or his parents that he was born blind?” 3.Jesus answered, “Neither this man nor his parents sinned, he was born blind so that GOD’S works might be revealed in him.

In this case a man was predestined by GOD to be born blind by default, in order to reveal on him the power of GOD. Bible has many places like this where certain plans of GOD have been predetermined or predestined by default.

But in some cases predestination has been given with a free will and choice. Saul, first king of Israel, was predestined by GOD to be a king of Israel, but he fail the Lord and was replaced.

Some of the prophets have been predestined to be a prophet, but some of them also fail their mission and died. (1Kings 13.11-32)

And so the Judas, he was chosen and predestined to be Apostles of Christ, but he fail and died, just like those who fail the Lord.

But word destined or predestined sometimes has been used in the Bible as FORSEEN or as FOREKNOWLEDGE, means seen the future. So Judas was FORSEEN by GOD, by the prophets, and by Jesus Christ, that a certain man would betray Him, but still, to Judas had been given a free choice to chose, to betray or not to betray Jesus. And Jesus gave him plenty of time to turn away from his plan.

1Peter 1.1-2
1.Peter, an Apostle of Jesus Christ, to those who reside as aliens, scattered throughout Pontus, Galatia, Cappadocia, Asia, and Bithynia, who are chosen,
2.according to the foreknowledge of GOD the Father, by the sanctifying work of the Spirit, that you may obey Jesus Christ and be sprinkled with His blood. May grace and peace be yours in fullest measure.

Many of us did not been destined or predestined by default to be drug users, alcoholics, liars, thief, murderers, and criminals of all sorts, but we became like it in some point of our life.
And far not all people are being predestined to become Christians, but GOD FOREKNOWLDGE and FORSEEN those who are His and who are not.

Above all, Judas' betrayal of Christ made no difference in Christ’s crucifixion and death, because Jesus already has been predetermined and destined by His Father to be crucified, but not by default.

And even having free will to comply or to reject the Father’s will, Jesus went through with it in order to fulfill the will of His Father, and offered Himself to Him as a Guilt Offering for the sins of humanity.

So with Judas or without him, Jesus would do what He already decided to do. Jesus could easily, without help of Judas or anybody else, could easily handed Himself over to the chief priests and be crucify anyway, in one way or another, and this actually is not even the issue.

The issue is that Judas was out of place and became unwanted, unwelcome, and unnecessary player in the death of Christ, because Christ will be crucified no matter what and nothing can stop it.

So Judas simply fell the victim of his own indifference, ignorance, and greed, but was not in anyway was predestined by default to betray.

If GOD predestined Judas by default to be a traitor, then how it can be justified from the point of view of GOD’S justice and righteousness?

James1.13-14
13.Let no one say when he is tempted, 'I am being tempted by GOD'. GOD cannot be tempted by evil, and He Himself does not tempt anyone.
14.But each one is tempted when he is carried away and enticed by his own lust.

1John 2.16
16.For all that is in the world, the lust of the flesh, and the lust of the eyes, and the boastful pride of life, is not from Father but is from the world.

Ephesians 4.24
24.and put on the new self, which in the likeness of GOD has been created in righteousness and holiness of the truth.

Ecclesiastes 7.29
29.I have found only this, that GOD made men upright, but they sought out many devices.

 

[JM]

John 17:12 "While I was with them in the world, I kept them in thy name: those that thou gavest me I have kept, and none of them is lost, but the son of perdition; that the scripture might be fulfilled." King James Version, 1611

Judas was lost on purpose. It was his destiny.

jm

 

[Pastor Don]

I often wondered about two correlations in the Judas story. The first was the way it plays out the temptation that Christ went through in the desert where the devil asked Him to jump from the highest pyre so the angels would save Him and Jesus responded that He would not test God in such a manor. Judas was trying to make Judas do that very same thing and this seems appropriate since the devil was running the show. Perhaps the wilderness was merely a precursor to what was to come... Judas did not act to destroy Jesus but to make Jesus start the rebellion. I believe that when Jesus did not respond like Judas hoped he would, he panicked and then saw the stupidity of his actions.

The second part of the story is about his repentance. Was he sorry because of what he did or was he sorry because he could not give back the money to absolve himself of his part of Jesus' death? Judas was not a stupid man. He had seen how the Sanhedrin sought to punish Christ. Perhaps crucifixion was beyond the scope of what he thought they were capable of, however he knew that he was taking a gamble with Jesus' life. He was banking on Jesus pulling a miracle of some sort. Of course this is all speculation and we only have a small piece of information to look at.

It is a warning though... even the closest to Jesus can be turned against Him. We have to always stand steadfast. Evil spirits cannot enter where the Holy Spirit resides. Stay frosty and wear your armor.

 

[98cwitr]

Judas did not act to destroy Jesus but to make Jesus start the rebellion. I believe that when Jesus did not respond like Judas hoped he would, he panicked and then saw the stupidity of his actions.

Can you show this with scripture please or is this some sort of inference?

The way I read the account, Judas carried little about Christ when compared to himself, until the truth hit him and he was so overcome he killed himself.

 

[Bluelion]

I often wondered about two correlations in the Judas story. The first was the way it plays out the temptation that Christ went through in the desert where the devil asked Him to jump from the highest pyre so the angels would save Him and Jesus responded that He would not test God in such a manor. Judas was trying to make Judas do that very same thing and this seems appropriate since the devil was running the show. Perhaps the wilderness was merely a precursor to what was to come... Judas did not act to destroy Jesus but to make Jesus start the rebellion. I believe that when Jesus did not respond like Judas hoped he would, he panicked and then saw the stupidity of his actions.

The second part of the story is about his repentance. Was he sorry because of what he did or was he sorry because he could not give back the money to absolve himself of his part of Jesus' death? Judas was not a stupid man. He had seen how the Sanhedrin sought to punish Christ. Perhaps crucifixion was beyond the scope of what he thought they were capable of, however he knew that he was taking a gamble with Jesus' life. He was banking on Jesus pulling a miracle of some sort. Of course this is all speculation and we only have a small piece of information to look at.

It is a warning though... even the closest to Jesus can be turned against Him. We have to always stand steadfast. Evil spirits cannot enter where the Holy Spirit resides. Stay frosty and wear your armor.

you been watching to many movies. That is the spin Hollywood likes to put on it. Jesus said one of you is a devil. judas was a devil from the very start, he never belong to Jesus. It was not he was turned, he never was. One of God's children can never be turn because Jesus lives in them. Is any one so strong they can move God? As far as i know there is nothing and no one stronger than God, and He can not be moved.

I am sick of this whole idea, oh a person can be turned, they can lose salvation. Can any one conquer God? Can any one take what is God's. No to both. Ahh but some will say a person can then reject Him, God would never except them in the first place knowing everything He would know they would reject Him. How does a person Give all there self to God then take that back, How is it Christ dies covers the sin and then that is not enough and is some how taken back. Its insane it can not be done. God did not let Jesus die in vain.

stop judas worshiping.

 

[revrobor]

be grateful? to some one who betrayed our God and reject him. That is satanism.

You are very confused. Here is thought every thing God who knows all new what satan and judas would do so he just wrote it into His plan and let them do it?

something is really off with your comments.

If you don't understand that God sent Jesus to Earth to suffer and die so we might live with Him forever then you are the one who is confused.

 

[Bluelion]

If you don't understand that God sent Jesus to Earth to suffer and die so we might live with Him forever then you are the one who is confused.

what does that have to do with judas.

 

[revrobor]

what does that have to do with judas.

Judas was an instrument used to start that process. If he hadn't done what he did God would have found someone else to do it.

 

[Bluelion]

Judas was an instrument used to start that process. If he hadn't done what he did God would have found someone else to do it.

and you know God's thoughts?

So we should be grateful for evil, judas betraying God. Are you really going to defend judas? are you kidding me. You call me confused funny, you call evil good.

Funny I thought God took all the credit for saving us. you need to read your bible.

 

[98cwitr]

Should we be grateful for the Tree of Knowledge, since God placed it in the garden?

 

[Bluelion]

Should we be grateful for the Tree of Knowledge, since God placed it in the garden?

No 98 but according to him we should be grateful for Adams sin.

I am not grateful for the tree or what i learned from it, but for God who saved me from the sin of it, and teaches me. I am grateful for God and all He does.

 

[98cwitr]

No 98 but according to him we should be grateful for Adams sin.

I am not grateful for the tree or what i learned from it, but for God who saved me from the sin of it, and teaches me. I am grateful for God and all He does.

well stated The Tree brought about the need for the Law, which Paul tells us gave the devil an opportunity to exploit it.

 

[JM]

In the Garden Adam and Eve had a Law. It was "do not eat the fruit of the tree." It was a Law of works and was restated through Moses at Sinai (do and live). We know from the plain reading of scripture that no one can earn eternal life so Adam and Eve's reward for obedience was to stay in the Garden.

All mankind is covenanted to God by the covenant of works (do and live) or by grace which is why mankind is declared sinful, it's based on covenantal obedience to God. The believer stands before God in Christ, who fulfilled the demands of God the Father for perfect obedience and was the perfect propitiation for our sin as well. I hope that makes sense. Gotta run.

Yours in the Lord,

jm

 

[Bluelion]

well stated The Tree brought about the need for the Law, which Paul tells us gave the devil an opportunity to exploit it.

Yes but now the Law frees us, and no longer condemns us.

 

[98cwitr]

Yes but now the Law frees us, and no longer condemns us.

Same Law, new covenant or different law because new covenant?

 

[Bluelion]

Same Law, new covenant or different law because new covenant?

Same Law, New covenant the penalty of breaking the Law Has been removed. The purpose of the Law has been fulfilled, which was to bring glory to God and keep us until he came, now Jesus keeps us and we obey the Law out of Love.

The Law free us, ever wonder what Paul meant when he spoke that. Next time you are tempted recite the Law which you are tempted to break, and watch the spirit tempting you flee. This is what Jesus did in the wilderness. Everything written is for a reason. Every thing Jesus did was to lead us.

 

[OzSpen]

Judas was an instrument used to start that process. If he hadn't done what he did God would have found someone else to do it.

Bob, I know the context is Judas, but are you suggesting that God finds some people to kill, slaughter, maim, effect the Holocaust, etc? Does God do all evil in the world? Is He the effective cause of all of it?