Question

[Hentenza]

But he loves us he you make exceptions for people you love. Does god have no mercy? An why is he not worthy he led a morally excellent life. Do all denominations agree with you?

Again, you are using a subjective view of what morally excellent is. You really don't know inwardly the lives of those that outwardly present a morally excellent life. I am sure you have heard of the expression "having skeletons in the closet".

 

[TimMorgan]

Is it impossible to be both a morally excellent person and a nonchristian?

 

[Hentenza]

But i've found some contradictions in the text for example We should fear God (Matthew 10:28)
We should love God (Matthew 22:37)
There is no fear in love (1 John 4:18)
and yes it's easy for me to say but god is perfect he should be able to

do all denominations believe this

There is no contradictions between those. Context is important. Tim, I used to be an atheist. I was for many years. Since I accepted the Lord I have found that many of the things that I use to consider contradictions were merely things that I did not understand. The scriptures are rich in teachings. There hasn't been a time yet where I have not learned something new by rereading the bible. It is simply amazing.

God is indeed perfect. He lacks nothing.

 

[Hentenza]

Is it impossible to be both a morally excellent person and a nonchristian?

In the eyes of the Lord, yes, it is impossible. However, and as I stated before, no one in this earth actually knows the heart of a person. Only God knows the heart.

 

[TimMorgan]

There is no contradictions between those. Context is important. Tim, I used to be an atheist. I was for many years. Since I accepted the Lord I have found that many of the things that I use to consider contradictions were merely things that I did not understand. The scriptures are rich in teachings. There hasn't been a time yet where I have not learned something new by rereading the bible. It is simply amazing.

God is indeed perfect. He lacks nothing.

How can you be so sure of yourself

 

[Sketcher]

Is it impossible to be both a morally excellent person and a nonchristian?

It's not about your moral performance, since nobody is morally good enough to enter Heaven. It's about whether you're under God's amnesty plan or not, and it's easy to get under that plan. If you are not humble enough to admit your own sins and your own unworthiness, how could you presume to think that God would let you into his house. It is not our merit that saves us, but his grace, and he will give his grace to those who will confess and renounce their sins, believe in Jesus and what he did, and then submit their lives to him. We then live good lives in order to honor what He so graciously did for us, because none of us deserves it.

 

[Hentenza]

Is it impossible to be both a morally excellent person and a nonchristian?

In the eyes of the Lord, yes, it is impossible. However, and as I stated before, no one in this earth actually knows the heart of a person. Only God knows the heart.

 

[TimMorgan]

So it doesn't matter how we spend our life as long as we belive in god? is that what you're saying

 

[Hentenza]

How can you be so sure of yourself

Because I believe that God is the uncause cause of the universe. There can only be one uncaused cause and it has to be perfect since there can not be two perfect beings otherwise one would lack something and that would be contradictory.

 

[TimMorgan]

2 questions
1. why do you believe in god more than say shiva
2. why would someone so perfect make us so flawed and downright evil

 

[Hentenza]

So it doesn't matter how we spend our life as long as we belive in god? is that what you're saying

Actually, no. The true believer will still sin because we are still imperfect however, the true believer does not live in sin meaning that his/her life progressively becomes less and less sinful. This process is called sanctification and it is a life long process.

 

[TimMorgan]

I'm sorry but the thing that's really making me lose faith in god is that you an't be nonchristian and go to heaven. If this is the case I think i'll go to hell instead

 

[Hentenza]

2 questions
1. why do you believe in god more than say shiva

Hinduism and Christianity are mutually exclusive so both can not be true. After studying both I am convinced that the Christian God is the true God. In addition, I do have subjective proof by way of what the Lord has done for me so far.

2. why would someone so perfect make us so flawed and downright evil

God actually made us in His image and He called His creation good, however, we, by our free choice, chose to defy God. Evil is not a creation but an absence of good. Man simply chooses evil.

 

[Hentenza]

I'm sorry but the thing that's really making me lose faith in god is that you an't be nonchristian and go to heaven. If this is the case I think i'll go to hell instead

Well, that of course will be your choice. I can not make you believe. You must do that all on your own.

Let me ask you a question, why is it fair for God to accept those who have rejected him and have continually sinned against Him?

ETA: Also, what if you actually believed and then God worked through you to save some of your atheist friends? Would you discount this possibility?

 

[Sketcher]

So it doesn't matter how we spend our life as long as we belive in god? is that what you're saying

If we believe in God, we are obligated to follow him. We can either honor Christ's sacrifice or we can crap on it. Living a good life for God is honoring it. Living a selfish and sinful life is crapping on it.

 

[TimMorgan]

Twistedsketch your being far to aggressive if I offended you I apologize. Hentenza I thought that everyone sinned against him? and it's fair to let them in if they have led a good life even if they have rejected him. I apologize but I need to go to bed perhaps we can continue this discussion later

 

[Sketcher]

Twistedsketch your being far to aggressive if I offended you I apologize.

You did not offend me, and it was not my intention to be far too aggressive. I apologize if my manner has offended you.

 

[Hentenza]

Twistedsketch your being far to aggressive if I offended you I apologize. Hentenza I thought that everyone sinned against him? and it's fair to let them in if they have led a good life even if they have rejected him. I apologize but I need to go to bed perhaps we can continue this discussion later

The difference is that God does not charge us with the sin because of Christ's work in the cross. Remember that Christ died for our sins so that those that believe in Him would be saved. On the other hand, when an unbeliever sins that sin is still charged to him because he has not yet accepted the gift of salvation.

I will be delighted to continue this conversation with you. I certainly understand your position since I once had questions just like you.

 

[Michael Turner]

I'm sorry but the thing that's really making me lose faith in god is that you an't be nonchristian and go to heaven. If this is the case I think i'll go to hell instead

Hello Tim,

It can be difficult to deal with. Anytime we try to impose a fallen human standard of justice upon a perfect God we are going to run into frustrations. Back in the garden of Eden our ancestors made a regrettable choice. They sought to be like gods and decide good and evil for themselves. This separated us from divine righteousness and we've suffered as a race ever since. To this day we have grave difficulties with God's perfection and standards, proof that the curse still lies deep within us.

Take a look around. In this world of billions of people we all have sin in common. Every last one of us. There is no exception, no one holy man sitting on a desert island that never stumbled in deed or character. We have all fallen short of our original design and the earth along with us.

That you would express hesitancy to submit to God because of others who neglect him is somewhat natural in one sense. All of us have or had that impulse to some extent in our lives. Only some have been reborn and have been given new life in Christ who enables us to repair our relationship with God. This redemption is the most prized blessing in the world as it contains the key to eternal life and reconciliation with our Maker.

But as far as those who reject it, there is no great injustice. Ultimately, everyone gets what they want. Everyone in Christ wants nothing more than to escape the clutches of sin and become a new creation, serving God eternally. Everyone else...well, they don't want to be conformed to God and would rather live otherwise. The problem with that, however, is that life without God's grace is hell, literally. But again, make no mistake, everyon gets exactly what they want.

So while there is still breath in your chest I would sincerely ask you to examine these things. Nothing we believe actually affects truth and reality. Either I am right or I am wrong (and the same goes for you). Invest in a Bible and start reading for yourself. See whether the words are of man or of God.

I pray that the Lord allows you to discern the difference and that it leads you to everlasting life my friend.

Blessings...

 

[CruciFixed]

Hi, I hope you are sincere in your questioning because I find myself answering this question often only to be left behind withiut the other person to respond:

This is what it is okay like as best as someone like me can describe it. Man was not ever created for Heaven in the first place. Our "Kingdom" was to be Earth and we were supposed to rule over the land, the creatures etc (contrary to what Peta preaches the animals are actually ours...not to beat the hell out of but to use naturally) ANYHOO
We were not ever going to Heaven in the first place. He put one thing on Earth for him. It sounds silly to the finite human mind, right? Why would God..infinite and forever need one thing on Earth for himself? I mean he put us here and the animals. He had one thing for Himself here on Earth...the tree of knowledge. Different people have different takes on this story but I'm going with my idea okay?
So he told Adam not to eat it or he will surely die. FAIR and square that was a warning. Adam was created as a fully grown man and God didn't just poof him here, abandoned him like a child in the woods then pop back and start shaking his fingers...No God gave Adam the ability to name all the creatures of the Earth and rule of the Earth to play King on Earth. He also gave him something else, eternal life. The only thing Adam had to do was avoid that one tree...use a little thing called self control. God gave Adam a woman and allowed him to name her. He named her Eve. Eve was told by Adam not to eat the fruit of that specific tree that it was forbidden. The serpent told her that basically God, her loving creator, was a deceiver and did not want her to be like Him so she should eat it.
Well Eve decides to choose the snake's advice over God's advice. That's slap one in the face. God the creator of all things, including the serpent (AKA Satan is disguise) was betrayed by His own Creation.

Do you have any children? Its truly heart breaking for us as finite humans when our children break our rules. God gave everything to man and our ancestors broke his laws and probably his heart too. He owns all of this. EVERYTHING you see is God's.

Well even at that point God didn't allow dead people into Heaven, it just didn't happen. He kinda sent all the people including Abraham (do you know that story), Noah, Moses, etc into hell. They did awesome deeds if you consider all the work Noah did awesome I mean. They did great things for the world and still God sent them to hell. The thing is humans don't have RIGHTS to heaven and that's the problem with universalism. It pretty much states you get a right to heaven if you are by human standards "good enough"
Though the Bible tells us no one is good enough or deserving.

You know what the worst part of it all is? We are in such an indebted state we don't even realize it. We allow our heads to get blown up by our good deeds.

Do you know who fixed the mess that is sin? The One who never deserved to go to Hell to begin with. The One who created it all. The infinite One who is so loving He wants to share His home with undeserving, constantly misbehaving, bad little kids. Does God...all perfect and loving, creator of all things, and morally perfect deserve Hell?

If you can answer that for me I will get back to you. I have a story no matter how you answer .