Question

[Aibrean]

By the way...technically there is no "better chance". The prisoner would and the Atheist wouldn't. Assuming you believe in the words of the Bible.

 

[Zecryphon]

Anyone else get the feeling we're not gonna hear from Sobob again? He has 1 post and now we're three pages into this and he has not responded to anything posted. Hmmm?

 

[Aibrean]

Maybe he was really an atheist? *snicker*

 

[Tu Es Petrus]

By the way...technically there is no "better chance". The prisoner would and the Atheist wouldn't. Assuming you believe in the words of the Bible.

I believe in the words of the Bible, but I disagree with that sort of absolutism. God judges the hearts of men, not us.

It is possible that those who, through no fault of their own, do not know the Gospel of Christ or his Church, but who nevertheless seek God with a sincere heart, and, moved by grace, try in their actions to do his will as they know it through the dictates of their conscience, may also achieve eternal salvation. It is less likely, but it is possible

 

[Aibrean]

I'm referring to the exact phrasing of the post. An Atheist by definition does not believe in God. Thus, they wouldn't be seeking him.

I see no scripture saying an unbeliever would be saved.

 

[MrJim]

Anyone else get the feeling we're not gonna hear from Sobob again? He has 1 post and now we're three pages into this and he has not responded to anything posted. Hmmm?

Yo Zec, where ya been?

 

[JustAsIam77]

I believe in the words of ythe Bible, but I disagree with that sort of absolutism. God judges the hearts of men, not us.

It is possible that those who, through no fault of their own, do not know the Gospel of Christ or his Church, but who nevertheless seek God with a sincere heart, and, moved by grace, try in their actions to do his will as they know it through the dictates of their conscience, may also achieve eternal salvation. It is less likely, but it is possible

I can find no biblical support for this view. Would you please provide scripture and verse to support it?

Thank you.

 

[Tu Es Petrus]

I'm referring to the exact phrasing of the post. An Atheist by definition does not believe in God. Thus, they wouldn't be seeking him.

I see no scripture saying an unbeliever would be saved.

So let me ask you: Lets say a little boy is a Muslim, living in some dusty village, and Islam is all he knows. Lets say this little boy dies, but he was always a good boy. You think God will send that little boy to hell over something he had no control of?

I can find no biblical support for this view. Would you please provide scripture and verse to support it? Thank you.

My support is common sense, and a God not only of justice but also of great mercy.

 

[Aibrean]

Yes. Islam does not show Jesus as the Son of God.

Whoever believes in the Son has eternal life, but whoever rejects the Son will not see life, for God's wrath remains on him.

What is the point of the Great Commission if everyone can be saved without knowing Jesus?

 

[Floatingaxe]

So let me ask you: Lets say a little boy is a Muslim, living in some dusty village, and Islam is all he knows. Lets say this little boy dies, but he was always a good boy. You think God will send that little boy to hell over something he had no control of?

Little children are welcome in the Kingdom. He wouldn't have been good, as no one is good, but the blood of Jesus would cover him and those also who are born intellectually challenged. God has a way for them who cannot understand the Gospel or mindfully appreciate what sin is or repent, due to young age or mental incapacity.

 

[Aibrean]

Little children are welcome in the Kingdom. He wouldn't have been good, as no one is good, but the blood of Jesus would cover him and those also who are born intellectually challenged. God has a way for them who cannot understand the Gospel or mindfully appreciate what sin is or repent, due to young age or mental incapacity.

We can hope but there is no Biblical evidence to substantiate that unbaptized, unbelieving children will enter the kingdom of God. To the original post - if he knows Islam, he can also know Christianity. You set that so the boy is of an age of accountability (in regards to Floatingaxe's statement).

 

[Tu Es Petrus]

So let me ask you: Lets say a little boy is a Muslim, living in some dusty village, and Islam is all he knows. Lets say this little boy dies, but he was always a good boy. You think God will send that little boy to hell over something he had no control of?

Yes. Islam does not show Jesus as the Son of God.....

So you think God will send some poor little boy to hell for something that wasn't his fault. Thats quite a horrible thought. I guess we are all fortunate that you are not God, because God would never damn someone for something they had no control of.

.....What is the point of the Great Commission if everyone can be saved without knowing Jesus?

If the little boy in my scenario is saved, it will be because of Jesus, even though he may not be aware of it.
I tell you this: You will see children in heaven of all faiths, and you will see judgemental Bible thumpers burning in hell because they knew not the mercy of God nor did they show that mercy to others.

 

[Aibrean]

By your logic, you would assume that an adult that never knew of the gospel would also go to heaven as they also would have no control over it.

I AM JUST TELLING IT HOW IT IS IN THE BIBLE!

 

[Floatingaxe]

We can hope but there is no Biblical evidence to substantiate that unbaptized, unbelieving children will enter the kingdom of God. To the original post - if he knows Islam, he can also know Christianity. You set that so the boy is of an age of accountability (in regards to Floatingaxe's statement).

A small child who has no capacity to appreciate himself in need of a Saviour will be received. Jesus Himself said not to forbid the children to come to Him--He won't forbid them, either.

If a child is old enough to appreciate what he is taught about Allah, that would be a gauge that indicates he could know Jesus, but I'm not sure about the concept of sinfulness and redemption--it's not an Islamic concept.

Baptizing children means nothing. It just gets them wet.

 

[Aibrean]

Then little children were brought to Jesus for him to place his hands on them and pray for them.

In context, this is for the blessing of Jesus. How can they be blessed if they do not know? As I said, there is no Biblical substantiation.

Let the little children come to me, and do not hinder them, for the kingdom of heaven belongs to such as these.

Such as these. NOT these specifically. He is referring to the innocence (and I do not mean spiritual innocence), openness, trust, receptivity, and humility of a child. The preceding parable references the rich man who didn't come to Jesus with those characteristics.

John 3:18
Whoever believes in him is not condemned, but whoever does not believe stands condemned already because he has not believed in the name of God's one and only Son.

I do not want to damn children to hell. I'm not saying I do...I'm just saying the Bible isn't clear on where those that are born into ignorance go but he is definitely clear on where people go who don't believe.

Psalm 51
Surely I was sinful at birth, sinful from the time my mother conceived me.

 

[JustAsIam77]

My support is common sense, and a God not only of justice but also of great mercy.

Again, please provide scripture and verse to support your position, other than common sense:


"I believe in the words of the Bible, but I disagree with that sort of absolutism. God judges the hearts of men, not us.

It is possible that those who, through no fault of their own, do not know the Gospel of Christ or his Church, but who nevertheless seek God with a sincere heart, and, moved by grace, try in their actions to do his will as they know it through the dictates of their conscience, may also achieve eternal salvation. It is less likely, but it is possible"

Thanks

 

[Aibrean]

If everyone in the whole world was an infant, would we need a savior?

 

[ReformedChapin]

So you think God will send some poor little boy to hell for something that wasn't his fault. Thats quite a horrible thought. I guess we are all fortunate that you are not God, because God would never damn someone for something they had no control of.



If the little boy in my scenario is saved, it will be because of Jesus, even though he may not be aware of it.
I tell you this: You will see children in heaven of all faiths, and you will see judgemental Bible thumpers burning in hell because they knew not the mercy of God nor did they show that mercy to others.

There is no such thing as a poor little boy. There is only evil sinners who need grace.

Children in heaven of all faiths? huh?

You catholics and your semi palegian doctrine. Augustine would be rolling in his grave.

 

[Aibrean]

^ I don't think he's a traditional Catholic.

 

[Floatingaxe]

Psalm 51
Surely I was sinful at birth, sinful from the time my mother conceived me.

It was the adult David who realized that.