• Starting today August 7th, 2024, in order to post in the Married Couples, Courting Couples, or Singles forums, you will not be allowed to post if you have your Marital status designated as private. Announcements will be made in the respective forums as well but please note that if yours is currently listed as Private, you will need to submit a ticket in the Support Area to have yours changed.

Question for nonamericans:

Status
Not open for further replies.

quantumspirit

evangelical humanist
Jul 21, 2004
1,225
79
52
Minnesota
✟1,798.00
Faith
Atheist
Marital Status
Single
Politics
US-Democrat
Do you have fears of the hard-right Bush administration, of how this would affect your country? Less security and privacy, that Bush and his hacks would find a way to seek economic leverage over your country?

Has it already affected affairs where you live? I know that the EU constitution was defeated, but were there a lot of negative ads against it? Does our corporate elite have as much control over your media as it does ours?

While we're on the topic of corporate control of media, how about the scandal involving the Liberal party of Canada? So far I have only heard one side of the story on that matter. I have not heard anything by Liberal party congresspersons, or the chair of the Liberal party. Was there something going on, but someone out there seized the day and blew it way out of proportion?
 

TheReasoner

Atheist. Former Christian.
Mar 14, 2005
10,294
684
Norway
✟37,162.00
Country
Norway
Gender
Male
Faith
Atheist
Marital Status
Married
quantumspirit said:
Do you have fears of the hard-right Bush administration, of how this would affect your country? Less security and privacy, that Bush and his hacks would find a way to seek economic leverage over your country?

To an extent. The US more or less controls the internet, so the crazed laws Bush is coming with in regards to that does affect us.

Other examples are US attempts to change our music laws for instance. They feel that it is too permissive for the user. Among things they have wanted to change here are; We are allowed to rip/copy copy protected CDs. They didn't like that. Furthermore; We are allowed to copy music to family and friends (not p2p or such) - and the artists are payed through a post in the state budget.
Thankfully, they failed in both attempts. The USA has also had their companies try to enforce US laws here on other occasions. A prime example is the case against Jon Lech Johansen, or DVD-Jon when he broke the CSS. (copy protection on DVDs)
There are probably plenty of other examples, and I fear that not all of them has failed for the USA, but IT is my field of work, so that's obviously where I have the most info :p

Has it already affected affairs where you live?

Yes. See above.

I know that the EU constitution was defeated, but were there a lot of negative ads against it?

Hm. As we are not a part of the EU, it didn't really get that much focus here. Sadly.

Does our corporate elite have as much control over your media as it does ours?

Because our media is to a large extent satelite broadcasted, quite a bit is American media. Thankfully, natively European media does seem a lot less biased in favour of American corporations than American media is.
 
Upvote 0

Oliver

Senior Member
Apr 5, 2002
639
23
52
Visit site
✟23,492.00
Faith
Agnostic
Marital Status
Married
quantumspirit said:
Do you have fears of the hard-right Bush administration, of how this would affect your country? Less security and privacy, that Bush and his hacks would find a way to seek economic leverage over your country?

I don't think the Bush administration has changed much concerning the economic leverage of the US: the US have been very aggressive in that respect ever since WWII. It is true that we've seen a few moves under this administrations (like quotas on european steel or canadian wood), but nothing exceptional compared to other administrations.

One thing that stands out as a real change is perhaps the attitude towards environmental issues (Kyoto, or a few decisions concerning your own environmental agency), but even then the difference is more in the communication around those issues than in the actions themselves: I feel like previous administrations were much more diplomatic in their approach of both domestic issues and foreign politics, while the current administration is very open that it wants to be perceived as very tough (by americans electors), and is much more confrontational in the foreign policy department.

This last point (foreign policy) is the only one that I think has a major impact on our lives: the lack of diplomacy and misunderstanding of some issues related to terrorism have the potential to directly affect the security of everyone around the world, and the war in Iraq is IMO such a move. Just to speak about Europe, I think that people in Madrid and London have learned it the hard way.

Consequences (beneficial or not) of a change in the US foreign policy will however mainly be felt in the long run, so we'll have to wait and see to draw objective conclusions.

quantumspirit said:
Has it already affected affairs where you live? I know that the EU constitution was defeated, but were there a lot of negative ads against it? Does our corporate elite have as much control over your media as it does ours?

I don't think the US had much of an impact on the rejection of the EU constitution. But if it had one, I'd say it's not in the way you imply: the more aggressive (both economicaly and politicaly, if those are english words) the US government is, the more europeans will be convinced that they need to cooperate to be able to weight against it. The opinion of the US government and of the US public concerning this issue was almost unheard of, if I remember correctly.

edit: I wonder if I understood your question concerning the EU constitution correctly :scratch:

quantumspirit said:
While we're on the topic of corporate control of media, how about the scandal involving the Liberal party of Canada? So far I have only heard one side of the story on that matter. I have not heard anything by Liberal party congresspersons, or the chair of the Liberal party. Was there something going on, but someone out there seized the day and blew it way out of proportion?

Didn't hear about it.
 
Upvote 0

CCGirl

Resident Commie
Sep 21, 2005
9,271
563
Canada
✟34,870.00
Faith
Seeker
Marital Status
Married
Politics
CA-Others
While we're on the topic of corporate control of media, how about the scandal involving the Liberal party of Canada? So far I have only heard one side of the story on that matter. I have not heard anything by Liberal party congresspersons, or the chair of the Liberal party. Was there something going on, but someone out there seized the day and blew it way out of proportion?

I will present this fairly balanced timeline and explanation of events from the CBC, without all the rhetoric and opinions.(emphasis added)

Federal sponsorship scandal
CBC News Online |
GOMERY REPORT


There had been rumours and whispers about a fund that had been set up in the wake of the 1995 referendum on Quebec sovereignty to help promote federalism. The money was supposed to be used to raise Canada’s profile in Quebec.

The fund was run by the Public Works Department, headed at the time by Alfonso Gagliano, then Prime Minister Jean Chrétien’s Quebec lieutenant.

But it wasn’t clear how the money was handed out: there were no application forms for this fund that was supposed to help pay the costs of social and cultural events and programs. There were rumours that the money was little more than a vehicle to reward loyal Liberal supporters.

By the early spring of 2002, Chrétien was forced to address the issue. The Globe and Mail – under the Access to Information Act – tried to find out why the government paid $550,000 to Groupaction Marketing for a report that could not be found. No one at Public Works or the company could explain it.

Chrétien asked Auditor General Sheila Fraser to see what she could find out. She learned enough to launch a full investigation – and to ask the RCMP to get involved as well.

On Feb. 10, 2004, Fraser released her audit of the federal sponsorship program.

The scathing report used words such as "scandalous" and "appalling" to describe how the Liberal government abused the system.

She found that $100 million was paid to a variety of communications agencies in the form of fees and commissions and said the program was basically designed to generate commissions for these companies rather than to produce any benefit for Canadians.



Officials in Canada's Public Works Department "broke just about every rule in the book" when it came to awarding contracts to Groupaction Inc., Fraser said.

Prime Minister Paul Martin ordered a public inquiry into how the sponsorship program was handled. He fired Gagliano, who had been appointed ambassador to Denmark. Five days later, Martin promised to resign if there was evidence that he knew about fraud in the program.

Two weeks after Fraser’s report was released, Martin suspended the heads of three Crown corporations: Michel Vennat, president of the Business Development Bank of Canada, Via Rail president Marc LeFrançois and Canada Post president André Ouellet. The report showed that five Crown corporations and agencies – the RCMP, VIA Rail, the Old Port of Montreal, the Business Development Bank of Canada and Canada Post – played a role in transferring money through questionable means.

All three men would eventually be fired.

The revelations from the unravelling scandal would cost the Liberals dearly in the election of June 28, 2004: their majority evaporated and – for the first time in 25 years – Canada had a minority government.

By September, Justice John Gomery would begin hearing testimony at the inquiry into the scandal.

On Feb. 8, 2005, former prime minister Jean Chrétien appeared before the Gomery inquiry. He vigorously defended the federal sponsorship program as an important part of the battle against Quebec sovereigntists in the wake of the 1995 referendum.

Mistakes were made, Chrétien conceded, and people who stole money should be punished.

Two days later, Prime Minister Martin – the man who called the inquiry – gave his testimony. He appeared a year to the day after he ordered the inquiry. It was the first time since Canada was six years old that a sitting prime minister testified before a public inquiry.

After Chrétien and Martin completed their testimony, the inquiry shifted to Montreal, where it would get to the "meatier" side of the story. Witnesses would include some of the people at the heart of sponsorship scandal.

Among them would be Jean Brault who ran Groupaction, an advertising company that was paid millions doing work for the government under the sponsorship program; Paul Coffin, who ran another advertising company that did well under the program; and Chuck Guité, who ran the program for the government.

But there would be complications – all three men faced criminal charges, accused of defrauding the government out of millions of dollars under the sponsorship program. Gomery would order a ban on the publication of their testimony because their appearances before the inquiry were scheduled for a few weeks before the beginning of their trials.

Coffin would later plead guilty to six counts of fraud. The trial of Guité and Brault would be delayed until the spring of 2006 and eventually the publication bans would be lifted.

Gomery’s Nov. 1, 2005, report is the first – and probably the more interesting – of two reports to come from his inquiry. The “who-knew-what-when” document will be followed by a “how-do-we-prevent-it-from-happening-again” report. That one is due in February 2006.

Prime Minister Martin has promised to call an election within 30 days of the release of that report.

This is a link showing who knew what, and when. Notice it does NOT implicate the current Prime Minister Paul Martin!

Jean Chrétien, former prime minister:

He launched the sponsorship fund as a way to raise the profile of the federal government within Quebec in the wake of the 1995 sovereignty referendum, and thus convince Quebecers that remaining in Canada was worthwhile.

Jean Pelletier, Chrétien's former chief of staff:

The report said Pelletier, for whom Chrétien was "personally" responsible because he was a political appointee, essentially acted as a cabinet minister as far as the sponsorship program was concerned, playing a key role in distributing funds to parts of Quebec where Chrétien perceived the separatist threat was particularly strong. "Mr. Pelletier failed to fulfill that responsibility, in that he did not give adequate direction to the subordinates in [Public Works] to whom he was delegating the task of administrating a new program."
Alfonso Gagliano, former public works minister, senior Liberal organizer in Quebec:

He had claimed that Guité ran the program and they rarely discussed it, let alone decided which projects would receive funding. "Contrary to his testimony to the effect that his participation was limited to providing political input and making recommendations about events and projects to be sponsored, Mr. Gagliano became directly involved in decisions to provide funding to events and projects for partisan purposes, having little to do with considerations of national unity," wrote Gomery. "The evidence is overwhelming that Mr. Gagliano was a hands-on manager who took a great interest in the sponsorship program and an active part in its direction."

Chuck Guité, Public Works bureaucrat in charge of sponsorship program from 1996-99.

This "man without scruples" comes in for a large chunk of Gomery's criticism, for breaking government tendering rules, for directing contracts to friends, for dealing harshly with a whistleblower, and for accepting consulting fees from Quebec advertising agencies after leaving government.

Jean Brault, president of Groupaction Marketing Inc.

His company and its subsidiaries managed $89.5 million worth of sponsorship projects, allowing the company's net revenues to rise from $314,000 in 1994 to almost $1.5 million five years later, at the height of the program, the forensic audit conducted for the inquiry found. Brault and his wife drew salaries of almost $4 million between 1992 and 2001, and collected dividends of $2.7 million.

I am including a link with a short explanation of how Canada's Political Sytem works!

Hope this helps!
 
Upvote 0

cavymom

Well-Known Member
Jan 25, 2005
1,082
85
55
✟24,175.00
Faith
Christian
Marital Status
Married
I think people in Canada laugh at Bush more than fear him because he tends to think that he can tell any country what to do. Bush hasn't come to visit Canada except that one time when he tried to fast-talk us concerning trade/lumber.

I think Canadians should look into joining the EU because of close ties with Britian (the government and queen and all). If Canada began doing business in euros instead of dollars it would help strengthen the euro and shift power from the US towards the European Union. That way there would be more power for Canadians to settle trade disputes concerning lumber etc etc.

As far as the Liberal scandal goes, most politicians at that level are scandalous and it gets hard to hide the skeletons in the closet. We just have to learn how to vote for the least scandalous candidate that can do the most for Canada.

OTTAWA - President Bush sought Tuesday to patch up relations with Canada after years of bickering, flying here for tough hemispheric and global talks amid boisterous demonstrations from opponents of the U.S. led-war in Iraq.

Bush's trip here was the first official visit by a U.S. president in nearly 10 years and his meeting with Prime Minister Paul Martin was akin to a political dance; Bush wanted to avoid any missteps that could amplify anti-Americanism north of the U.S. border.

But his unpopularity in some Canadian quarters was unmistakable. Some of the several hundred protesters near the Parliament building were polite. "Please leave," read one sign along Bush's highly secured motorcade route. But others near where Bush and Martin met held placards that branded Bush an "assassin." A truck parked near the motorcade route was emblazoned with the phrase "Bush is a war criminal." Another placard simply commanded, "Go Home ... " and included an expletive.

Relations between the Bush administration and Canada got off to a rocky start when Bush, a new president, chose Mexico instead of Canada as the first country he'd visit. Trade disputes and the war in Iraq further soured the friendship.

Martin, Canada's former finance minister and a wealthy shipping magnate, however, has repeatedly expressed a desire to rebuild U.S.-Canada relations, which cooled under his predecessor, Jean Chretien. The dialogue became even more strained when Chretien decided against sending troops to Iraq - a decision supported by more than 80 percent of Canadians.
www.redorbit.com
 
  • Like
Reactions: TheReasoner
Upvote 0

vimto

Active Member
Dec 23, 2005
48
4
69
✟15,189.00
Faith
Calvinist
Athene said:
I'm from the UK, enough said. :(


I'm not at all sure that it is enough said.

I'm also in the UK and I admire Bush and thank our God for him.

On Europe - People are worried about Europe getting to be a superstate - undemocratic and removed form the people. When the people vote you should listen and respect their decission and not seek to undermine it. Cutting theo van Gough's head off in public and pinning koranic verses to his chest was not a good thing to do, but it provided a wake up call in many ways and changed the mood in mainland Europe prior to the vote.

Do you remember 9/11? That changed things... and I'm shocked to hear some Americans on this site with such anti-american sentiment in their blood.
......but never-the-less. sister-in-Christ, warm regards, for we are all going to heaven. Thank the Lord it is our hearts not our political views that count under the cross.
 
Upvote 0

Ophis

I'm back!
Sep 21, 2005
1,440
72
39
Manchester, England
✟24,464.00
Faith
Atheist
Marital Status
Single
Politics
UK-Conservative
vimto said:
I'm not at all sure that it is enough said.

I'm also in the UK and I admire Bush and thank our God for him.
Really? Why?

vimto said:
Do you remember 9/11? That changed things... and I'm shocked to hear some Americans on this site with such anti-american sentiment in their blood.
You can be against a particular American government without being anti-American, and it is shameful how the current US government has confused the two.
 
Upvote 0

mindlight

See in the dark
Site Supporter
Dec 20, 2003
14,279
2,997
London, UK
✟1,009,278.00
Country
Germany
Gender
Male
Faith
Christian
Marital Status
Married
quantumspirit said:
Do you have fears of the hard-right Bush administration, of how this would affect your country? Less security and privacy, that Bush and his hacks would find a way to seek economic leverage over your country?

Has it already affected affairs where you live? I know that the EU constitution was defeated, but were there a lot of negative ads against it? Does our corporate elite have as much control over your media as it does ours?

While we're on the topic of corporate control of media, how about the scandal involving the Liberal party of Canada? So far I have only heard one side of the story on that matter. I have not heard anything by Liberal party congresspersons, or the chair of the Liberal party. Was there something going on, but someone out there seized the day and blew it way out of proportion?

There has been a close military relationship between Britain and America since WW1 and for Britain this has been particularly close since Suez exposed our dependency on the USA in 1956. Although we did not support them in Vietnam and it was not till Thatcher that the recent rosy relationship took off. I think the British are pragmatists. The relationship with America is crucial for our defence, important for our economic well being and a consequence of intertwined cultures and history and language. We supported Clinton and we support Bush - if you elect Hilary next time we will support her because she is the American president. Such is the actual relationship between the two countries. That different American presidents may abuse our relationship is sometimes clear. BUsh is no diplomat but he has been a man of his word with us. We supported Iraq at the time though the way its been handled has caused many to doubt since.

Media moghuls are anglo american such is the symbiotic relationship nowadays. So I cannot see media being manipulated for the advantage fo nations but there is a rich class who often try to manipulate it for their purposes and not always successfully.

Canada is closer to America than it likes to admit
 
Upvote 0

tocis

Warrior of Thor
Jul 29, 2004
2,674
119
55
Northern Germany
✟25,966.00
Faith
Other Religion
Marital Status
Married
quantumspirit said:
Do you have fears of the hard-right Bush administration, of how this would affect your country? Less security and privacy, that Bush and his hacks would find a way to seek economic leverage over your country?

Considering that not too long ago a certain Mr Rumsfeld asked our secretary of defence "when will you finally double your defence budget?!", I'd say that the only question is: how much influence do we permit?
Unfortunately, as much as some of us condemn at least certain actions of the current US government, the US are also still an important partner for Germany. Looks like a lose/lose situation to me. :sigh:

quantumspirit said:
Has it already affected affairs where you live? I know that the EU constitution was defeated, but were there a lot of negative ads against it?

Ads? Kind of. Not (much of them) corporate-sponsored, however - if memory serves. Many Germans were - and still are - of the opinion that EU laws and regulations have done much damage already, so it's not surprising that they don't hold much love for at least the current EU. I dare say that they don't condemn the whole idea... just the current status quo. :scratch:
 
Upvote 0

coyoteBR

greetings
Jan 18, 2004
1,523
119
50
✟2,288.00
Faith
First, let me say I have nothing against the people of USofA. But Bush, that's another matter enterelly.

A brief of Bush x Brazil questions:

1: ALCA x MercoSul. I grant everybody knows what ALCA was supposed to be. Now, before ALCA, there was a pact between the "South Cone" countries: Brazil, Argentina, Paraguay, Urugay, Chile. This ecconomic block was starting to grow, attracting more countries. Under the recent Argentinian Brankrupt, Brazil became the only leader of the region, and we were ready to advance MercoSul. In the official ALCA meetings, it seemed the idea was everyday more distant. So, what Bush administration did? Started to make very atractive deals one-to-one, with smaller countries first, and key partners after, to secure a positive vote for his interests on the following MercoSul/ALCA meetings.
The plan didn't worked because, well, Chávez is a madman, but reminded the people of latin America that an alternative is possible. And now we have some inteligent, reasonable people against ALCA in key places, like Chile.

2. "War on Terror". Now, according to international agreements, USofA soldiers were forbidden to make exercices on several South American countries, including Brazil and Argentina. This is so true that the exchange of experince between Brazilian and USA armies used to happen only inside ships, far away from the coast.
Now, with the rumours Bin Laden may have used the Thrice frontier area (Brazil/Paraguay/Argentina) to his business, Bush decided to buldoze the Law and, in exchange of serious money, build a Guantanamo-like basis in Paraguay, near our frontier. Overnight, Brazil won a Frontier with USA. With heavy weaponary.

3. Embraer Super Tucanos. Brazilian Embraer is not only the leader on regional planes in the world, but also produces one of the best planes for militar training avaliable: the Super Tucano. Now, Bush administration is trying to stop the selling of 25 Super Tucanos to Venezuela, arguing it has north-american technology in it (fallacy), and waving a possible contract with USArmy in return. Also on target is the selling of the same place to Colombia.
Bush also tried to do the same with Spain, but they will sell their planes to Venezuela no matter what.
 
  • Like
Reactions: TheReasoner
Upvote 0

coyoteBR

greetings
Jan 18, 2004
1,523
119
50
✟2,288.00
Faith
Ah, just checked the news, add to #3:
Brasília - The board of directors of the Brazilian Aeronautics Company (Embraer) declared its "disappointment over the change of plans" concerning the sale of aircraft to the United States Army. On Friday (13), Embraer announced the suspension of plans to assemble ERJ 145 airplanes, in partnership with Lockheed Martin, in Florida.
 
Upvote 0

Willa

Active Member
Nov 22, 2005
31
1
50
San Diego, CA
✟22,656.00
Faith
Protestant
Marital Status
Married
I'm Chinese living in America, definitely like Bush though he does have a fair share of shortcomings. Economic leverage? The free-trade idealogy has made many Asian countries prosperous, especially China. Chinese get work and earn better and better wages, while Americans get cheaper and cheaper products, it's win-win.

Not to mention all the technology the Chinese are learning from American corporations. Chinese telecom companies are already selling wireless infrastructure in the US (albeit only small scale now), handset manufacturers are getting ready to export, so are Chinese automobile manufacturers (in a few years).

Sometimes he (also Congress, which is independent of the Bush administration) does cater to the far right and move towards protectionism like the steel tariff, texile quote, and the pressure on the Chinese to float its currency (I actually think they handled it quite well, since I believe the Chinese does need to float the Yuan, so a little pressure as what was done was alright, but too much pressure would be another story). Nevertheless, the benefits far out-weight these little annoyances.
 
Upvote 0
Bush is only hard-right if you are hard-left. Politically, he is about where JFK was in the 60s.

He is pretty liberal on spending and on growing government. He doesn't mind the government intruding into your life.

I'm a libertarian-leaning christian republican. Voting for Bush was not the easiest thing to do.

If a fiscally conservative "less-government" candidate showed up in either party that was strong on human rights and on personal responsibility, I think they would get a good following.
 
Upvote 0

TheReasoner

Atheist. Former Christian.
Mar 14, 2005
10,294
684
Norway
✟37,162.00
Country
Norway
Gender
Male
Faith
Atheist
Marital Status
Married
JVD said:
Bush is only hard-right if you are hard-left. Politically, he is about where JFK was in the 60s.

He is pretty liberal on spending and on growing government. He doesn't mind the government intruding into your life.

I'm a libertarian-leaning christian republican. Voting for Bush was not the easiest thing to do.

If a fiscally conservative "less-government" candidate showed up in either party that was strong on human rights and on personal responsibility, I think they would get a good following.
No. Bush is hard right if you are anything but American. Sorry to say so, but all your politicians are. Your left wing people are far right as well! The differences between your two parties you so eloquently clal large and make a huge fuzz out of is just like minor fluctuations and differences of oppinion within one of our tens of parties. We have difficulty seeing why we should regard you as a democracy for this among other reasons...
Bush´s policies are not the policies I would vote for at all. It is however policies I would fight against. Refusing to ban torture. Going to war for the reasons he has. Weakening international relations to the rest of the world, alienating the USA as well as cutting taxes like he has, increased military fundings, and the way he is attacking natural reserves - treasers for all of humanity that can never be re-made - in the quest for more oil for your cars... These are not the good fruits the bible speaks of. I cannot understand how anyone can support this man. I know this is my own conclusion, but it is not based on nought. If anyone can, please let him show me why Bush is such a good president! Show me what he is doing that is beneficial to humanity, because so far I cannot see anything majorly good about his reign.
 
  • Like
Reactions: USincognito
Upvote 0

Ophis

I'm back!
Sep 21, 2005
1,440
72
39
Manchester, England
✟24,464.00
Faith
Atheist
Marital Status
Single
Politics
UK-Conservative
JVD said:
If a fiscally conservative "less-government" candidate showed up in either party that was strong on human rights and on personal responsibility, I think they would get a good following.
Not in Britain. You're pretty much describing our Conservative party, but they've lost the last three elections.
 
Upvote 0

Horab

Active Member
Feb 15, 2006
76
14
Calgary
✟265.00
Faith
Seeker
hi all

i live in Canada but have lived in the USA and yeah, the scandal is serious here, the Liberal Party was very corrupt, but that's okay, they lost power a couple of weeks ago.

In eastern Canada, they are way more liberal. the media here thinks Bush is far-right and scary but nobody pays them attention except the American media.

there is a trend away from socialism...


-Horab
 
Upvote 0
Status
Not open for further replies.