Question About God

[daniel777]

nice analogy.

 

[JustThatGuy]

God had to give us a way to choose him. If there was no rules, there was no way to tell that we really loved him. If there is only one road, it is the only road you can go on, right? He doesn't want people to love him because they have to, he wants us to choose to love him.

 

[appletreeblossom]

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[snoopy500]

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Thank you

 

[secretshadows618]

God is supposed to be all knowing right? And he is also supposed to be all loving?

Why did he let there be the forbiden fruit in the garden of eden? Why does he let people sin? He KNEW Eve would take one of the forbiden fruit. He MADE her. If he was really all knowing and loving then he wouldn't let people sin.

In fact, he creates people, KNOWING that they will be sinners and go to hell. How could you say that people are not born condemned? He creates them. He knows they will sin. He condemnes them.
How is this fair?

Its all about free will like everyone keeps saying... If God took out free will then we'd be like robots just programmed to live out life as He set us to. We'd have no choices no decisions. Life would be meaningless. He tells us life will be difficult for us here on earth but He also says He'll make up for it Heaven.

secretshadows

 

[TanteBelle]

I think the best way anyone has described this to me was a few years back in youth group. So I'll share. It's like I have two cans of pop, root beer and diet coke, I leave them out for my brother to choose one. However, I know my brother very well and I know that he loves root beer and will choose the can of root beer not the diet coke. He comes along and picks up the can of root beer, did I make him choose it, no, I still gave him the option and the free will to choose between the two, but I knew he would pick the root beer. So, God doesn't write out our future, but he knows us so well that he knows what decisions we'll make.

I have to disagree with that analogy. We are born carnal with a carnal mind and nature. What does the Bible say about that?

Rom 8:7 Because the carnal mind is enmity against God: for it is not subject to the law of God, neither indeed can be.

We are born as the fool in Psalms 14 who says in his heart, "No God! I don't want a God to serve!" It is only through the grace of God that we subject ourselves under Him and unto His word. We are born as enemies to God.

 

[snoopy500]

I have to disagree with that analogy. We are born carnal with a carnal mind and nature. What does the Bible say about that?

Rom 8:7 Because the carnal mind is enmity against God: for it is not subject to the law of God, neither indeed can be.

We are born as the fool in Psalms 14 who says in his heart, "No God! I don't want a God to serve!" It is only through the grace of God that we subject ourselves under Him and unto His word. We are born as enemies to God.

I completely disagree with this

Going back to what CC said,god does know our future,like how we will die,what people we might meet,ect. He knows that. He always know,can we change what might happen? Well of course we can. We hav e control over what we do but natural things like death or something,well that sometimes could be evry hard to change or even put off. I like the idea that CC had there with the pop,very good example

 

[TanteBelle]

I completely disagree with this

Going back to what CC said,god does know our future,like how we will die,what people we might meet,ect. He knows that. He always know,can we change what might happen? Well of course we can. We hav e control over what we do but natural things like death or something,well that sometimes could be evry hard to change or even put off. I like the idea that CC had there with the pop,very good example

I simply said what scripture says. It is a simple fact. We are born carnal and carnality is an enemy to God. It can't be a matter of what we would like or what would appeal to us, but a matter of us choosing to forsake the old man, put him on the cross, and choose a new life in Messiah.

 

[snoopy500]

I simply said what scripture says. It is a simple fact. We are born carnal and carnality is an enemy to God. It can't be a matter of what we would like or what would appeal to us, but a matter of us choosing to forsake the old man, put him on the cross, and choose a new life in Messiah.

he clearly was put on the cross for us. I mean,that was a big sacafrice. I adknowledge you saying that but even though i am christian i do not agree with absoloutly everything in the bible,and that i don't exactly agree with. I got my own opnion on that

 

[tpk]

he clearly was put on the cross for us. I mean,that was a big sacafrice. I adknowledge you saying that but even though i am christian i do not agree with absoloutly everything in the bible,and that i don't exactly agree with. I got my own opnion on that

actually, I would have to disagree with you on one point here. I believe that the Bible comes directly from God. While man wrote it, He inspired it. So either you believe everything it says, or don't believe any at all. When you pick and choose what to believe, that's when cults form. Not saying you're part of a cult, but I would say that if it's in the Bible, it's from the word of God. Just saying...

 

[TanteBelle]

I personally don't see how one can be 'Christian' if they don't even believe in the source of Christianity.

 

[snoopy500]

i see where your coming from guys. idk really,i just don;t agree with that i guess. I hate cults btw,i watched alot about that in religion class and i disagree with all that

 

[TanteBelle]

I don't mean to offend mate, but it does sound like you are confused.

 

[Azureknight 773]

GOD did not TELL EVE to eat that fruit, he instructed her to do Exactly the opposite... it was out of her FREE WILL that she did that. GOD could have easily made us robots forced to love, submit, and obey his every command. BUT that's just not How our loving, caring GOD works.. HE wants us out of our free will to love him and live righteously, in communion with him. Our GOD is not a tyrant that works forcefully that is WHY we have choice, and he lets us sin.

He knows we will sin, that is why he HIMSELF had to HUMBLE himself to the point of putting himself into a human body..and die for our sins..so OUR sins would be covered and we could stand before him blameless...

Oh men! You're reply full of sense just beats me from posting it... Anyways I AGREE WITH YOU!

 

[solarwave]

God is supposed to be all knowing right? And he is also supposed to be all loving?

Why did he let there be the forbiden fruit in the garden of eden? Why does he let people sin? He KNEW Eve would take one of the forbiden fruit. He MADE her. If he was really all knowing and loving then he wouldn't let people sin.

In fact, he creates people, KNOWING that they will be sinners and go to hell. How could you say that people are not born condemned? He creates them. He knows they will sin. He condemnes them.
How is this fair?

Im gunna take another view of this that I dont think anyone else has yet. I dont believe that the creation story literally happen how it says in Genesis. By this I mean it is an analogy but the meaning of the story is still true.

1)WHY does God let people sin? Because if God were to stop us sinning it would take away our free will. We would be no more than very well made puppets. To be free we have to be able to choose evil over good, if we are stopped every time we arn't all that free.

2)Freedom gives us a chance to do more good than could be done otherwise and to show higher morals than would be possible without evil. Without evil there is no mercy, no forgiveness, less love and no relationship with God by choice which I think is the whole point.

3)There is more value in freedom with evil than no freedom without evil.

4) Does God create us? In one sense yes, but in another sense we are created by the free will of our parents and others before them.

5) Does God condemn us? I believe we have free will. Therefore God knows what we will do, but He doesn't make us do it.

6) God made the world knowing there would be evil in it and that people would go to hell. But is it not possible that this is the best world that could be created while at the same time allowing free will and other higher goods (eg:mercy, etc).

I hope that makes sense and helps

By the way, hey TanteBelle, long time no talk

 

[liesje]

even though i am christian i do not agree with absoloutly everything in the bible,and that i don't exactly agree with.

Woh big time out there! If you can't believe all of the bible, then why believe any of it? Just like an historian looking at a source, if there is a part that is untrustworthy, the whole source is untrustworthy. How can you say that you don't agree with parts of the Bible when ultimately it is the word of God? You may not like parts of it, but that's different.

 

[snoopy500]

Woh big time out there! If you can't believe all of the bible, then why believe any of it? Just like an historian looking at a source, if there is a part that is untrustworthy, the whole source is untrustworthy. How can you say that you don't agree with parts of the Bible when ultimately it is the word of God? You may not like parts of it, but that's different.

better said. Im sorry for daying that now. I do believe in everything,but well said,some parts i don't like but it is what it is

 

[TanteBelle]

By the way, hey TanteBelle, long time no talk

LOL! Were you trying to get me to debate that all over again! LOL! G'day mate! I tried to send you a PM or visitor message, but you didn't seem to have either working! And thanks for the rep for the discussion, debate, thingo. Whatever you wanted to call it!

better said. Im sorry for daying that now. I do believe in everything,but well said,some parts i don't like but it is what it is

It's called learning. The Bible will seem hard to understand and even contrary to itself, but once you understand alot of things, everything else falls into place. Which is where the test goes. Do you look at it and toss it out the window because it seems wrong? or do you place the reasons for it looking wrong on your lack of understanding and then set out to learn?

 

[solarwave]

LOL! Were you trying to get me to debate that all over again! LOL! G'day mate! I tried to send you a PM or visitor message, but you didn't seem to have either working! And thanks for the rep for the discussion, debate, thingo. Whatever you wanted to call it!

No, no ,no, lets not get into that same debate again lol.

If you tryed to send it a while ago then it could have been while I was banned.... but it wasn't my fault, I was just caught in the cross-fire of everyone else getting banned. Lol

 

[TanteBelle]

No, no ,no, lets not get into that same debate again lol.

If you tryed to send it a while ago then it could have been while I was banned.... but it wasn't my fault, I was just caught in the cross-fire of everyone else getting banned. Lol

LOL! I was teasing you galah!!!

Oh righto, well, that could have been it!