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The authoritative part of the church. Not sure if you mean something mystical, using the capital C, if so, you must define it properly.So, then, the Apostles are outside the Church?
Your opinion. In my opinion, you have it reversed and wrong. And now, back to evidence.You have it exactly reversed and wrong. It is a failure to recognize the Authority of the Church, especially when in council, that has spawned the many errors and divisions in the Church.
Evidence? My comment is more than illustrated by the thousands of varying denominations all claiming Sola Scriptura.Your opinion. In my opinion, you have it reversed and wrong. And now, back to evidence.
There are basically just about dozen of denominations. The practice of many churches to simply invent a name to distinguish themselves from the church that is in the next street (mainly an American thing), does not mean much. The basics are still somewhere among the dozen of elementary denominations.Evidence? My comment is more than illustrated by the thousands of varying denominations all claiming Sola Scriptura.
Why? I have been to several denominations (Czech, German, Swiss or UK origin) and no problem at all.Even five is too many.
I do not come here primarily to argue. I come here to build conversations. i come here to relate.# represents "number". #1 refers to your (1) and so on.
I am a person and this is a public forum. So both apply, namely when we discuss possible logical connection between some verses and some doctrine. The connection must be demonstratively there, or else its just some random verse that has some subjective similarity to the topic, but thats all.
I tried to understand why you connect a seemingly random verse (the only common thing was Mary) to the doctrine we talk about. You seem to see some relevant connection, I do not. Therefore I asked you to present your logic which leads from the verse to the doctrine, in simple steps.I do not come here primarily to argue. I come here to build conversations. i come here to relate.
I understand the number system. But I perceive the effect of your post so as to shut down the conversation. It appeared you just wanted to win an argument.
I think this comes close to a description of your doctrinal position.The NT is not a product of a church, but a product of (inspired) apostles. They have the authority, not some vaguely defined "church". Church(es) only recognized and accepted this authority of Scriptures.
If we shift the authority to church, we can get into many errors, as happened frequently in history.
Right, okTherefore I asked you to present your logic which leads from the verse to the doctrine, in simple steps.
I do not think that its a "very low view of the church". Neither do I think that a typical protestant view of the church is low.And then the very low view of the church, as a typical protestant view.
I will only say, there is much more to it, and especially what the church is.First Jesus Christ, second apostles, third our individual or collective reasoning.
You can say that, sure. One liners in posts are not exhaustive encyclopedias. For the conversation to be readable, we must concise our thoughts into some simple core, related to the context and topic.I will only say, there is much more to it, and especially what the church is.
Hm, do you realize that the Catholic Church actually calls itself, the one holy apostolic church ? But then, apostolic succession is another theme in itself. Do you have a view on the selection of Mathias as an apostle in Acts 1? I have heard it said, that this was a flawed action. Do you have a view?You can say that, sure. One liners in posts are not exhaustive encyclopedias. For the conversation to be readable, we must concise our thoughts into some simple core, related to the context and topic.
The body of Christ, the kingdom of God, is not low just because it stands on the shoulders of apostles and the head is Christ.
I do not have a specific view of Mathias. It rather seems that the 12th apostle chosen by God was Paul, though.Hm, do you realize that the Catholic Church actually calls itself, the one holy apostolic church ? But then, apostolic succession is another theme in itself. Do you have a view on the selection of Mathias as an apostle in Acts 1? I have heard it said, that this was a flawed action. Do you have a view?
But anyway, for the study of ecclesiology, have a light start here: Ecclesiology - Wikipedia
For me, it is not at all about buildings and decorations, it is about how the body of Christ functions under God. But I also get that such is the present meaning of the word.
maybe you can provide a link to his views?I do not have a specific view of Mathias. It rather seems that the 12th apostle chosen by God was Paul, though.
Regarding ecclesiology, check the book De ecclesia, by Jan Hus.
I am afraid I do not have any prepared links summarizing his views.maybe you can provide a link to his views?
I do not believe that.I believe that Acts 1 provides the pretext for how bishops are chosen even today, and of all, the pope. So the pope holds an apostolic role.
I have no problem with protestant denominations, as mentioned in the posts above.Which is a fact, by the way, @myst33.
I have no problem with protestant denominations, as mentioned in the posts above.
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