Public Apology from Erwin

USincognito · Jun 25, 2005

Twenty pages in, I doubt I'm adding something anyone hasn't said already, but I'd like to offer the suggestion that Requests for Edit and Unofficial Warnings should be the first course of action instead of Official Warnings.

For transgressions that really are minor or due to the poster sincerely thinking what they wrote was within bounds a RfE or UW saying "Come on man, that's across the line, please edit it" is better for overall Forum culture than "Rusty bayonet. Pass Revoked."

(If any of you have seen Band of Brothers I'm referencing Capt. Sobel)

StarSapphire · Jun 26, 2005

I, too, have ran into problems with staff. I did not flame anyone, but was treated as if I had, given a warning over it, and just because staff cannot handle the truth. I just have one request, that the moderators and administrators thoroughly understand The Nicene Creed before they boot people off this board, or even before they begin moderating at all. I stopped donating to this site over it, so until things get better, this is the way it will stay.

herev · Jun 26, 2005

Erwin said:
Hi

It has come to my attention that some moderators have been particularly heavy-handed in their moderation and acting outside of our moderating guidelines.

For example, some posts or threads have been deleted when they do not break our rules. Deleting of posts and threads are the LAST resort.

We have over 100 staff so you can understand that keeping track is difficult.

Obviously we have fallen short of providing proper training.

For the members who have been affected, accept my direct and personal apology.

We are dealing with staff training at the moment.

Also, I agree that we have TOO MANY forum rules.

As part of the reforms I am proposing we will be consolidating this.

As discussed, the reforms will be introduced ideally by early next month.

Thanks for your patience.

well done, Dr. Loh

Illuminatus · Jun 26, 2005

herev said:
well done, Dr. Loh

Yes. So let's all let the man work, and wait for the reforms, as opposed to beating dead horses.

FreeinChrist · Jul 7, 2005

Erwin said:
Also, I agree that we have TOO MANY forum rules.

As part of the reforms I am proposing we will be consolidating this.

What do you mean by too many forum rules, exactly?

Truly Blessed · Jul 8, 2005

I just want to say Thank You Erwin - May God Richly Bless You In Your Walk With Him .

And I am disgusted with everybody who has taken advantage of this thread just to complain, complain, and complain .

Mod's Keep Up The Good Job .

TB

Bevlina · Jul 8, 2005

Thanks TB. We do our best. Our very best.

Plan 9 · Jul 8, 2005

Please allow me to offer my Beating a Dead Horse smiley for the use of all:

Also, I have a more upbeat thread to which I invite everyone to contribute, but please be aware that only positive feedback is welcome there:
http://www.christianforums.com/t1772697-staff-what-can-we-members-do-to-make-your-jobs-easier.html

Plan 9 · Jul 8, 2005

oops! Here's the link to my Beating a Dead Horse smiley.
http://sevenofnine.cherrytaco.com/Miscellanea/Emoticons/beatingdeadhorse.gif

PACKY · Jul 8, 2005

21 pages and 210 posts!!!!!

thats one heck of a apology!!!!

~Lady Trekki~ · Jul 8, 2005

Thanks for the apology Erwin! I think it shows your a fair person willing to do whatever it takes to make this forum the best Christian forum on the web.

My personal opinion is that I'm glad we have rules...I probably wouldn't last long here without them. Every forum has rules, and it's not that hard to follow them when you have the right attitude.

I haven't been here that long, so I'm not sure what issues people have against some of the mods here. But I AM a mod on another forum, so I know how hard it can be to make the right calls. It's not always that cut and dry, and they have to watch out for everybodies interests. If you haven't walked in a mods shoes, you really shouldn't judge them so harshly. I mark it down to maturity when all people can think to do is complain.

Still...mods should be fair-minded and not power hungry. Unfortunately, some people are not meant to be in positions of power because they don't have the maturity they need to handle it.

Hi TB! Are you leaving the forum? What happened? How come I cant send you a personal message?? Don't leave!!

jesusfreak4888 · Jul 8, 2005

Even though this doesnt go for me....That is SO VERY nice of you to apologize to people.........and that in my eyes makes you seem like such a nice person....God Bless you erwin
Ben

Seven of 9 · Jul 28, 2005

I will be hoping for the best!

Texas Lynn · Aug 27, 2005

Thanks to Erwin.

I have not been participating lately, voluntarily absent for several months. Recently had some PMs w/ a senior staffer who's respectable advising me of the topic of this thread.

Can't address recent issues, but I can say at the time I ceased daily participation here things were awful. Some very inappropriate people had power. Attempts to advise higher-ups of this were met with deaf ears. Not only were politically incorrect people targeted and persecuted, they had no voice in the secret council. Criticism was met with an icy "you are attacking my family!" sort of attitude from mid-level management.

Recently when I perused CF for the first time in months I noticed some of the mean individuals toward which I referred above were no longer on staff. That was encouraging, as is this.

I wish all well. The hurt and pain from previous actions by CF staff will always be there. However, life goes on.

It appeared previously convoluted rules were instituted to minimize conflict, yet with the result there was no communication. It appeared to some one ideology was targeted, to others, another. There was micromanagement, and merely not being politically correct resulted in your name being written in the corner of the chalkboard so to speak (metaphor for archaic method of classroom punishment in grade school).

It seems the best communication is wonderfully anarchic. People should be allowed to say what they want as long as insults are avoided, and punishments for that should be meted out equally.

Lastly, any ideological requirements, written or unwritten, for service on staff should be summarily dropped post haste.

Thanks again, Erwin, and best to you.

belladonic-haze · Aug 27, 2005

Erwin said:
Hi

It has come to my attention that some moderators have been particularly heavy-handed in their moderation and acting outside of our moderating guidelines.

For example, some posts or threads have been deleted when they do not break our rules. Deleting of posts and threads are the LAST resort.

We have over 100 staff so you can understand that keeping track is difficult.

Obviously we have fallen short of providing proper training.

For the members who have been affected, accept my direct and personal apology.

We are dealing with staff training at the moment.

Also, I agree that we have TOO MANY forum rules.

As part of the reforms I am proposing we will be consolidating this.

As discussed, the reforms will be introduced ideally by early next month.

Thanks for your patience.

Well, the fun of rules is we can break them. ......and a deleted post is not a disaster.....I had a few deleted.....2 I believe......and guess what...I am still alive and kicking. Humans make mistakes....both posters and mods. That makes being here so much fun...

Kaylee4Christ · Aug 27, 2005

Thank you, Erwin.

Kaylee

Crazy Liz · Sep 29, 2005

Erwin said:
Hi

It has come to my attention that some moderators have been particularly heavy-handed in their moderation and acting outside of our moderating guidelines.

For example, some posts or threads have been deleted when they do not break our rules. Deleting of posts and threads are the LAST resort.

We have over 100 staff so you can understand that keeping track is difficult.

Obviously we have fallen short of providing proper training.

For the members who have been affected, accept my direct and personal apology.

We are dealing with staff training at the moment.

Also, I agree that we have TOO MANY forum rules.

As part of the reforms I am proposing we will be consolidating this.

As discussed, the reforms will be introduced ideally by early next month.

Thanks for your patience.

ISTM we have more rules after the reform than before.

drstevej · Sep 29, 2005

Crazy Liz said:
ISTM we have more rules after the reform than before.

Not really. It looks that way because before many were scatterted throughout the other fora.

After consolidation there are fewer. It's just that the main list is larger and the forum rules are gone.

Chrysalis Kat · Sep 29, 2005

belladonic-haze said:
Well, the fun of rules is we can break them. ......and a deleted post is not a disaster.....I had a few deleted.....2 I believe......and guess what...I am still alive and kicking. Humans make mistakes....both posters and mods. That makes being here so much fun...

Well... the problem with that is you can be given an OW for something minor and your "no big deal deleted posts" become justification for an OW on the grounds you've had too much staff contact. Regardless of the fact there is no connection between the issues discussed in those 'contacts' and the post that resulted in an OW.
That's doesn't make for much fun at all.

Chrysalis Kat · Sep 29, 2005

Texas Lynn said:
Thanks to Erwin.

I have not been participating lately, voluntarily absent for several months. Recently had some PMs w/ a senior staffer who's respectable advising me of the topic of this thread.

Can't address recent issues, but I can say at the time I ceased daily participation here things were awful. Some very inappropriate people had power. Attempts to advise higher-ups of this were met with deaf ears. Not only were politically incorrect people targeted and persecuted, they had no voice in the secret council. Criticism was met with an icy "you are attacking my family!" sort of attitude from mid-level management.

Recently when I perused CF for the first time in months I noticed some of the mean individuals toward which I referred above were no longer on staff. That was encouraging, as is this.

I wish all well. The hurt and pain from previous actions by CF staff will always be there. However, life goes on.

It appeared previously convoluted rules were instituted to minimize conflict, yet with the result there was no communication. It appeared to some one ideology was targeted, to others, another. There was micromanagement, and merely not being politically correct resulted in your name being written in the corner of the chalkboard so to speak (metaphor for archaic method of classroom punishment in grade school).

It seems the best communication is wonderfully anarchic. People should be allowed to say what they want as long as insults are avoided, and punishments for that should be meted out equally.

Lastly, any ideological requirements, written or unwritten, for service on staff should be summarily dropped post haste.

Thanks again, Erwin, and best to you.

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Public Apology from Erwin

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