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proving evolution as just a "theory"

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doubtingmerle

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Since links NEVER provide any evidence for what they say, I have quit reading them. Why don't you cut and paste the evidence your link provided.

I will say dogmatically now they did not offer anything but opinions. Now is a good chance to prove me wrong.
With all due respect sir, I once was where you are now. I once argued on the net for creation. The difference between you and me is that I clicked on links.

I tell the story at Did We Evolve?.
 
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Jimmy D

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Mutations only affect genes. Genes determine characteristics. Characteristics determine species. The offspring can only acquire a characteristics that is in the gene pool of its parents. Land animals do not have a gene for fins or a blowhole. Therefor pakicetus can never have a kids with fins and a blowhole.

Now give me an example of a mutation that caused a change of species.

You are aware that cetacean's blowholes are homologous to the nostrils of land based mammals right?

What gene are you talking about?
 
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omega2xx

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When exactly?

I don't know exactly and don't care. Everyone except Noah and his family died in the flood. All nations are the product of his 3 sons. There are 3 basic skin colors; black, yellow and white. Theologians have traced the the black races to Ham; the yellow races to Shem and the Caucasian races to Jepheth.

Can I prove what I believe? No and no one can prove what they believe about when nations began. We are all in the boat of faith, rowing in different directions.
 
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omega2xx

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With all due respect sir, I once was where you are now. I once argued on the net for creation. The difference between you and me is that I clicked on links.

I tell the story at Did We Evolve?.

With all due respect sir, I was once where you are now although I never accepted evolution as an explanation for all living things coming for one source. Not only is that beyond logic, it is not biologically possible.

I read the links evolutionist offered for many years, but since they NEVER included the HOW, I have quit reading them. If your link included the how, cut and paste it and I will discuss it.
 
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omega2xx

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You are aware that cetacean's blowholes are homologous to the nostrils of land based mammals right?

That is evolution bolony. Necessary but still bolony. proved me wrong and provide the science that makes it possible.

[/QUOTE]What gene are you talking about?[/QUOTE]

Any gene you want to mention. Do you really believe pakicetus had a gene for fins? Do you believe a land animal surviving very well on land has a need to enter a more hostile environment?

Do you believe pakicetus wading in sea water eating fish caused him to become a whale? If you do, I have some prime land in Florida I would like to sell you.
 
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omega2xx

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omega2xx

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I don't know if it's taken out of context or not. But given the history creationists have with taking quotes out of context is why I'd like to see the original context.

Your opinion is noted. It probably stems from your lack of understanding the context, or like the one now in question, you don't even know the context.

If you don't have it, that's fine. But don't expect anyone to take it particularly seriously then.

They should take it seriously if the know the context and can prove it is wrong. You dismiss it without knowledge. Is that an intelligent thing to do?

First of all, we're not taking theology. We're talking science. It helps to learn the difference.

I haven't mentioned theology, sdo why do you accuse me of doing it?

Second, a singular quote taken from who knows what doesn't refute anything.

If it is true, one i enough. It is not "who know what." It is from a well qualified evolutionists who is better qualified than you are to understand mutations.

And if you understood the process of evolution, you'd understand its inherently recursive in nature; IOW, change builds on change.

It always amusing that when I reject evolution it is because I don't understand it. FYI I had 3 ology courses in college that discussed evolution, I passed all of them. Any 5th grader with average intelligence can understand the TOE

If you understood genetics and mutations, you would become a creationists.
 
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tas8831

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I've already agreed with every statement here,

And these statements do not refer to Uber. He engages. He also seems to be an instructor who is short on time and probably could use every shortcut he can get. He leaves for long stretches and then plays catch-up within a few hours as far as I've noticed.

And the problem is that this is NOT what you did. You instead used plagiarism as a sague [sic] to abandon the topic and just keep calling him a plagiarizer from then on. As a member who was just reading along I probably wouldn't have even commented if you called him a plagiarizer but then resumed the topic.

Probably because you don't get what is behind the act of plagiarism.

Remember Monica Crowley? Fox News darling, Trump lover. Was pegged to be an advisor of some kind for Trump, citing her 'expertise' due to her having received a PhD. Then someone scanned her dissertation and found that she had plagiarized a bunch. tsk tsk tsk. No longer a Trump advisor.


I sit on a college honor committee. Students suspected of cheating or plagiarism come to this committee. If we find them guilty, they go before a student honor committee.
Students plagiarize for 3 main reasons in my experience - they procrastinated to the point that, out of desperation, they copy-paste from the internet or a friend; they start out trying to do the work themselves, they soon discover they are in over their head and copy-paste; they want to try to impress their instructor, but realize that their own writing is falling short of their desires, so they copy-paste.
And if we find the accused guilty, the student honor committee generally fries them - even students realize how sleazy plagiarism is.
That is why it annoys me so much in discussions like this - it is lazy and dishonest and is often used to try to 'impress' those that that the plagiarist suspects will not know any better.

If you instead "Asked him to explain" which you claim is your follow up move, yet it was not. It looked like a red herring to me, topic was abandoned under the guise of outrage towards plagiarism...where was you follow up move to press him for explanations towards the plagiarized material??

Fair enough. But again I wish it wasn't used to end the discussion.

What discussion?

It was presented as a major 'gotcha' - Uber simply assumes that whatever his heroes wrote is 100% true and accurate - did you not see his lead-in posts? Taunting and condescending?

"You could find all major phyla arriving in a period of only 40-50 million years (known as the Cambrian Explosion) utterly destroying the Neo Darwinian gradualism inference.

Did you mean to call attention to the recalcitrant fact of those data, or their knock down capability? Opps. [sic] "​

and


"So you are unfamiliar with the findings since the late 1980s and respond with "50 million years seems like a long tme [sic] to me."

30-seconds of research is all I ask. Not even one college class. It's so simple.

Think we are way past opps [sic] here. "

And that one was, in fact, to this comment - from me:


"How so?

Do you not think 50 million years is along time?


Are you ignoring the Precambiran on purpose?

Oops..."​


And then out came the plagiarism.




Why waste time with a plagiarizer?

Especially one that should 1. know better and 2. tries to justify it?


Where was his move to explain why the plagiarized material was so important? Why did he ignore the actual citations I provided showing that HIS source was behind the times?

Why the double standards?
 
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omega2xx

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And if someone posts a quote, then it is up to them to prove that it is relevant and not taken out of context.

Would you please do this for the quote you provided in post 4926?

Unless you can proved it is not relevant it is relevant. What makes it relevant is that it is true unless you can prove it is not, and you can't. If it is true, the context will show it to be. If you understood mutations you would know his statement was true.
 
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xianghua

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Uh, no, that is not all that is really said in 29+ Evidences for Macroevolution: The Scientific Case for Common Descent.

The one page you quoted from shows that all life has the same basic structures for basic functions, indicating a common source. You might argue that common source is a common creator, but then why do creatures not share other things in common? For instance, Cytochrome C is a common protein in animals, but there are many different codes for making this protein. The closer animals are together in the evolutionary tree, the closer their codes are for making this protein. If a common creator used the exact same basic structures for all life, why would he not use the exact same structures for making Cytochrome C?

have you checked the phylogeny of Cytochrome b?:

Cytochrome_b_tree_Andrews_1998_0.img_assist_custom.PNG


do you see something weird in this image?

(image from nsce site).
 
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omega2xx

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I agree.

That is why I am now an atheist. Creationists never present evidence for their beliefs. They just attack evolution in their desperation.

After the kind is proved thousands of times every day. That refutes evolution.

I do have to wonder how many times this sort of thing needs to be copy-pasted:
https://books.google.com/books?id=y... mutations in protein-coding regions,&f=false

Once is enough and your link did not include any scientific evidence.

"As our closest relatives, they (chimpanzees) tell us special things about what it means to be a primate and, ultimately, what it means to be a human at the DNA level."

DNA does not link species, it separated them into their exact species. Our DNA will show we are not related biologically but that we are the same species.

And especially:

"This evidence [DNA similarities] alone does not, of course, prove a common ancestor; from a creationist perspective, such similarities could simply demonstrate that God used successful design principles over and over again. As we shall see, however, and as was foreshadowed above by the discussion of "silent" mutations in protein-coding regions, the detailed study of genomes has rendered that interpretation virtually untenable—not only about all other living things, but also about ourselves."

What is a silent mutation? How does it provide the means for a change of species? The only tenable truth is that evolution is genetically impossible.

Characteristics are not in gene pools. Alleles are. and alleles are variants of genes produced via mutation.

That simply isn't true.

Learn some biology.

Take your won advice.



Utter nonsense.

It shows the opposite.

Talk is cheap. Provide your evidence. Just make sure it is scientific and can be verified.
 
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Jimmy D

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That is evolution bolony. Necessary but still bolony. proved me wrong and provide the science that makes it possible.

It's a commonly known fact, cetacean's blowholes are homologous to the nostrils of land based mammals. What did you think they are?

Do you know where the "blowhole" is in a whale embryo?



FYI

homologous -

having the same relation, relative position, or structure.
  • Biology
    (of organs) similar in position, structure, and evolutionary origin but not necessarily in function.
    "a seal's flipper is homologous with the human arm"
 
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omega2xx

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I'm still waiting to find out what these discoveries from the last fifty years that refute evolution are.

If you make a statement like this you are expected to provide examples to back it up otherwise you are just trolling.

Please be specific.

DNA for one. Others will be listed in what Nobel prizes have been given for,

How does it show that we are not related to "apes", please be specific.

Do you really not undnerstnd that each species has different DNA?
 
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omega2xx

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It's a commonly known fact, cetacean's blowholes are homologous to the nostrils of land based mammals. What did you think they are?

Do you know where the "blowhole" is in a whale embryo?

Do you know where it is when the embryo become a whale?



FYI

homologous -

having the same relation, relative position, or structure.
  • Biology
    (of organs) similar in position, structure, and evolutionary origin but not necessarily in function.
    "a seal's flipper is homologous with the human arm"

To say a seal flipper is homologous with a human arm is evo mumbo jumbo. Necessary but still mumbo jumbo.

To have a fin the parents must have a gene for fins. Otherwise the kid will have a leg. It is amusing but sad the way evolutionist fundamentalist will distort real science to give the faithful followers of Darwin, hope they have not believed in vain.
 
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Jimmy D

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To have a fin the parents must have a gene for fins. Otherwise the kid will have a leg. It is amusing but sad the way evolutionist fundamentalist will distort real science to give the faithful followers of Darwin, hope they have not believed in vain.

LOL

What is this nonsense supposed to mean?
 
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Jimmy D

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Do you really not undnerstnd that each species has different DNA?

Obviously I do.

I am also aware that the genomes of extant hominidae have been exhaustively mapped and compared. The conclusion drawn from studying the similarities and differences is that we are related, so my question remains unanswered, what makes you think that we are not related to apes?
 
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pitabread

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A YEC timeline would or should be based on the Bible. The Bible says all nations were started by Noah's 3 sons

That's nice. I'm talking about actual archeological timelines versus when YECs claim the flood occurred (~2300 BC). The above civilizations predate that.
 
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