proving evolution as just a "theory"

[_-iconoclast-_]

Something besides your opinion, that can be independently verified.

Such as?

What would convince you?

 

[_-iconoclast-_]

Apply Hume's maxim.

Ahhh...

How do i apply humes maxim to a personal experience?







"Unfortunately, all we know about god, is what people say about"


"That no. testimony is sufficient to establish a miracle, unless the testimony be of such a kind, that its. falsehood would be more miraculous, than the fact, which it endeavours to establish:"

How so we apply hume maxim to the statement you made previous

 

[The Times]

R

It doesn't work that way. Your god isn't real. Jesus isn't real. It's a delusion.

How about I say: Vishnu is king. Does that invalidate my previous typing?

This is a prime example of mystical, magical thinking.

Let me kindly explain to you, but first bare with me for a little while.....

You said.....

I love my Lord Jesus.

Then in the post above you further stated....

How about I say: Vishnu is king. Does that invalidate my previous typing?

The answer in short is no, it does not invalidate your previous typing.

Let me explain how, why, where and when.

There was the story of Elijah and his God, the God of Israel and the priests of Baal, along with the people of Israel who were no longer saying The LORD, he is the God; the LORD, he is the God.

Did that invalidate their once held belief in the Lord, after they incanted after Baal? No!

If you read the story, the Baal Priests asked in the name of Baal and nothing happened, yet when Elijah asked in the name of the Lord, the miracle was shown to the people of Israel, so that they re-acknowledged the Lord, by saying The LORD, he is the God; the LORD, he is the God. (1 Kings 18:39)

When you said....

I love my Lord Jesus.

Where you said it on Christian Forums, before others.....

You acknowledged the name of Jesus.

Now, even though, you did not believe in the name when and where you said it, the miracle will follow whenever the name of Jesus is acknowledged as a testimony, even by a non believer and that my friend is guaranteed.

You friend, have put the Lord to the challenge and have inadvertently knocked on his door, so that you have put him to the challenge....so what challenge are we talking about?

The challenge of proving you wrong, because you are saying "it doesn't work that way. Your god isn't real. Jesus isn't real. It's a delusion."

This leads us to the why and the how.

Scripture tells us and also the many countless witness testimonies across all generations, who have called upon the name of Jesus, the following....

for, “Whoever shall call upon the name of the Lord will be saved.”
How then shall they call on Him whom they have not believed? And how shall they believe on Him of whom they have not heard? And how shall they hear apart from preaching? And how shall they preach unless they are sent? As it has been written: “How beautiful are the feet of those proclaiming good news of good things!” (Romans 10

The why is because you want answers by calling upon the name of the Lord, so that the challenge is on and you are about to be swept of your feet.

The how is when you fall rock bottom, you will be approached and that is a surety.

When you said his name, where you said it on Christian Forum, why you said it and how the answer will be given to you after knocking on the Lord's door of grace, will be your testimony to others mark my words, after you come to embrace Jesus as your Lord and saviour.

For many zealous men, like Saul of tarsus who wanted to kill Christians and had chased them from city to city, was changed after being struck down and he became the champion of the non Jewish followers of Jesus Christ.

Just consider how today's technological fanatics have a cult like following for say Apple products and yet, even though many use their products religiously, the world has not across all nations embraced it, for many users even are not followers of Apple, yet with billions of dollars of marketing to make known the product and to love the product and to be addicted to the product, you have finite numbers of followers and this will not guareenteed Apple will stay in business or increase its popularity in the next 2000 years, let alone the next 10 years.

Christianity my friend had not the privilege of billions of dollars in marketing compaigns, nor did they have the technology of today to spread the name of Jesus into the hearts of all the people of the world, from all nations and languages. We have the name tested and put to the challenge for 2000 years and counting and you my friend are only one from countless many who have put the Lord to the challenge and will one day champion many to Jesus Christ.

If Apple couldn't through money, advertisements and technology get a world wide cult like following of their Apple Logo and cannot guareentee their very existence 2000 years, let alone 10 years from now, then how did a homeless man, Jesus Christ of Nazareth conquer the hearts of the people's of the world for the last 2000 years and counting.

I have taken the liberty to write this to you and others, for the hope that is not seen, but one that will be made known to every ounce of your being, and that experience will be more real than all the passing facades of life that are external to one's purpose, one's joy and inner peace. That is why Jesus is called the Prince of peace.

I mean you and others well my friend. In this regard, please do call upon his name, you will not be left hanging or disappointed and that is guareenteed and tested throughout all generations and of all the peoples of the world, for the last 2000 years and counting.

 

[Bugeyedcreepy]

I love my Lord Jesus.

Hmm ... not much of a test.

I don't know. But I know how to know and to experience the Lord Jesus Christ. @Tinker Grey certainly, I believe has got the right mindset to explore the unknown for him, how exciting, isn't it?

It doesn't work that way. Your god isn't real. Jesus isn't real. It's a delusion.

How about I say: Vishnu is king. Does that invalidate my previous typing?

This is a prime example of mystical, magical thinking.

Where you said it on Christian Forums, before others.....

I love my Lord Jesus.

You acknowledged the name of Jesus.

Now, even though, you did not believe in the name when and where you said it, the miracle will follow whenever the name of Jesus is acknowledged as a testimony, even by a non believer and that my friend is guaranteed.

Really? Is that it? is that all I have to do and my personal belief doesn't factor??

I love my Lord Jesus Christ!

Great, now how will I know when this magical incantation will work? How long will I have to wait? Just to be sure, I also said the above out loud, just in case it's a spoken thing - are you sure it doesn't have to be uttered in hebrew, or something similar? I only really know and said it in english... We can at least get some sort of scientific consensus if we can get definitive results from this regardless of our beliefs, if I knew this was a thing, I'd have said it sooner.

 

[Herman Hedning]

Say I Love My Lord Jesus Christ. Just say it.

And then say "There is no god except God, and Muhammad is his prophet", just to cover all bases.

 

[HitchSlap]

R

Let me kindly explain to you, but first bare with me for a little while.....

You said.....



Then in the post above you further stated....



The answer in short is no, it does not invalidate your previous typing.

Let me explain how, why, where and when.

There was the story of Elijah and his God, the God of Israel and the priests of Baal, along with the people of Israel who were no longer saying The LORD, he is the God; the LORD, he is the God.

Did that invalidate their once held belief in the Lord, after they incanted after Baal? No!

If you read the story, the Baal Priests asked in the name of Baal and nothing happened, yet when Elijah asked in the name of the Lord, the miracle was shown to the people of Israel, so that they re-acknowledged the Lord, by saying The LORD, he is the God; the LORD, he is the God. (1 Kings 18:39)

When you said....



Where you said it on Christian Forums, before others.....

You acknowledged the name of Jesus.

Now, even though, you did not believe in the name when and where you said it, the miracle will follow whenever the name of Jesus is acknowledged as a testimony, even by a non believer and that my friend is guaranteed.

You friend, have put the Lord to the challenge and have inadvertently knocked on his door, so that you have put him to the challenge....so what challenge are we talking about?

The challenge of proving you wrong, because you are saying "it doesn't work that way. Your god isn't real. Jesus isn't real. It's a delusion."

This leads us to the why and the how.

Scripture tells us and also the many countless witness testimonies across all generations, who have called upon the name of Jesus, the following....

for, “Whoever shall call upon the name of the Lord will be saved.”
How then shall they call on Him whom they have not believed? And how shall they believe on Him of whom they have not heard? And how shall they hear apart from preaching? And how shall they preach unless they are sent? As it has been written: “How beautiful are the feet of those proclaiming good news of good things!” (Romans 10

The why is because you want answers by calling upon the name of the Lord, so that the challenge is on and you are about to be swept of your feet.

The how is when you fall rock bottom, you will be approached and that is a surety.

When you said his name, where you said it on Christian Forum, why you said it and how the answer will be given to you after knocking on the Lord's door of grace, will be your testimony to others mark my words, after you come to embrace Jesus as your Lord and saviour.

For many zealous men, like Saul of tarsus who wanted to kill Christians and had chased them from city to city, was changed after being struck down and he became the champion of the non Jewish followers of Jesus Christ.

Just consider how today's technological fanatics have a cult like following for say Apple products and yet, even though many use their products religiously, the world has not across all nations embraced it, for many users even are not followers of Apple, yet with billions of dollars of marketing to make known the product and to love the product and to be addicted to the product, you have finite numbers of followers and this will not guareenteed Apple will stay in business or increase its popularity in the next 2000 years, let alone the next 10 years.

Christianity my friend had not the privilege of billions of dollars in marketing compaigns, nor did they have the technology of today to spread the name of Jesus into the hearts of all the people of the world, from all nations and languages. We have the name tested and put to the challenge for 2000 years and counting and you my friend are only one from countless many who have put the Lord to the challenge and will one day champion many to Jesus Christ.

If Apple couldn't through money, advertisements and technology get a world wide cult like following of their Apple Logo and cannot guareentee their very existence 2000 years, let alone 10 years from now, then how did a homeless man, Jesus Christ of Nazareth conquer the hearts of the people's of the world for the last 2000 years and counting.

I have taken the liberty to write this to you and others, for the hope that is not seen, but one that will be made known to every ounce of your being, and that experience will be more real than all the passing facades of life that are external to one's purpose, one's joy and inner peace. That is why Jesus is called the Prince of peace.

I mean you and others well my friend. In this regard, please do call upon his name, you will not be left hanging or disappointed and that is guareenteed and tested throughout all generations and of all the peoples of the world, for the last 2000 years and counting.

Been there. Done that.

 

[rjs330]

If you don't think that when some people say "every word of the bible is true", they can't possibly mean that literally, you haven't been on this site long enough.

Also, some of the contradictions are extremely blatant.
NU 25:9 24,000 died in the plague.
1CO 10:8 23,000 died in the plague.

JG 4:21 Sisera was sleeping when Jael killed him.
JG 5:25-27 Sisera was standing.

1SA 31:4-6 Saul killed himself by falling on his sword.
2SA 1:2-10 Saul, at his own request, was slain by an Amalekite.
2SA 21:12 Saul was killed by the Philistines on Gilboa.
1CH 10:13-14 Saul was slain by God.

2SA 24:9 The census count was: Israel 800,000 and Judah 500,000.
1CH 21:5 The census count was: Israel 1,100,000 and Judah 470,000.

The third one is a personal favorite, because of how convoluted the attempts at explaining it away are. They can be as ridiculous as suggesting he fell on his sword as an enemy soldier shot at him with arrows or hacked at him with their own sword, and this was all done through the will of god.

Those who who are anti bible love to try and find supposed contradictions to show how the bible can't be trusted. Yet there is an answer to every supposed contradiction. Here's one.
Why do 1 Corinthians 10:8 and Numbers 25:9 disagree?

As far as Saul is concerned the bible describes how he died. The Amalakite was simply lying to David. It's not that difficult really.

But those who don't want the Bible to be true will do anything try and discredit it. But then that shouldn't surprise anyone. Since the bible teaches us about God and Christ and the only way to salvation the enemy must do all in his power to convince everyone it's a false document to keep people from believing. As Jesus said men love the darkness rather than the light.

 

[HitchSlap]

Those who who are anti bible love to try and find supposed contradictions to show how the bible can't be trusted. Yet there is an answer to every supposed contradiction. Here's one.
Why do 1 Corinthians 10:8 and Numbers 25:9 disagree?

As far as Saul is concerned the bible describes how he died. The Amalakite was simply lying to David. It's not that difficult really.

But those who don't want the Bible to be true will do anything try and discredit it. But then that shouldn't surprise anyone. Since the bible teaches us about God and Christ and the only way to salvation the enemy must do all in his power to convince everyone it's a false document to keep people from believing. As Jesus said men love the darkness rather than the light.

Is this what you tell yourself?

 

[rjs330]

Where does Scripture teach that Jesus understood all true things? I suspect you will respond that Jesus is God and His knows all things. Well, it is clearly not that simple. Jesus Himself says that only the Father knows the time that Jesus will return.

So there is at least one thing that Jesus does not know. Why not more?

The Bible says Jesus was the creator. So I think he would know. It's all about being God and knowing who.God is.

 

[rjs330]

No expert would agree that something has to reproducible or testable (in the present) in order to be considered to be science. We can't reproduce or test (from scratch) the big Bang theory, but it most certainly is science.

Evolution is science.

Science says the big bang theory is science. It doesn't mean it actually falls under true scientific theory. Evolution doesn't meet that criteria either.

 

[rjs330]

Is this what you tell yourself?

It's what the Bible says in 1Peter

speaking of these things in all his letters. Some of his remarks are hard to understand, and people who are ignorant and whose faith is weak twist them to their own destruction, just as they do the other scriptures.

 

[HitchSlap]

It's what the Bible says in 1Peter

speaking of these things in all his letters. Some of his remarks are hard to understand, and people who are ignorant and whose faith is weak twist them to their own destruction, just as they do the other scriptures.

Cool.

 

[sfs]

Science says the big bang theory is science. It doesn't mean it actually falls under true scientific theory.

Where "true scientific theory" is "what rjs330 thinks is science". Where did you get the idea that you were the arbiter of what counts as science?

 

[rjs330]

I've probably asked this before, but could you please point me to some of the scientific papers you've written? Because you'd sure better have some kind of expertise in science to be making that kind of judgment. Somebody would have to be pretty confused if he didn't know have any background in science but was still telling scientists how to do their job. Right?

All you have to do is look at the scientific definitions. They have been posted on here a couple of times. Evolution does not make the criteria required according to the definitions themselves. Neither does the big bang.

 

[expos4ever]

The Bible says Jesus was the creator. So I think he would know. It's all about being God and knowing who.God is.

I agree that it seems hard to believe that God the Father would not know the "how" of creation.

Doesn't the text say that all things were created through Jesus, not by Jesus. That is a significant difference.

Either way, the point is moot - there is overwhelming evidence for evolution, and we Christians can either adapt our theology or be (rightly) seen as irrational and close-minded.

 

[Belk]

It's not either. It's a belief. A belief system that drives the theory. It's not based upon real science which can be tested and observed. It can't be because we do not observe anything transforming by evolution into something it's not already. It can't be tested because you can't test to transform something into something else.

Then why does the scientific and academic communities accept it as science? Why have they accepted it as a science for over a 150 years? Why has it become the theory that underpins the science of biology?

 

[rjs330]

I agree that it seems hard to believe that God the Father would not know the "how" of creation.

Doesn't the text say that all things were created through Jesus, not by Jesus. That is a significant difference.

Either way, the point is moot - there is overwhelming evidence for evolution, and we Christians can either adapt our theology or be (rightly) seen as irrational and close-minded.

You strike at the heart of the matter. We should not adapt our theology according to the beliefs of this world We should adapt our beliefs to what the Bible says. When the world belief system contradicts scripture we should hold fast to the scripture not the world. Remember the wisdom of the world is worldly not Godly and is foolishness.

 

[rjs330]

Then why does the scientific and academic communities accept it as science? Why have they accepted it as a science for over a 150 years? Why has it become the theory that underpins the science of biology?

That's a good question. Why do they attribute it as science when it doesn't even fit their own definitions?

 

[sfs]

All you have to do is look at the scientific definitions. They have been posted on here a couple of times. Evolution does not make the criteria required according to the definitions themselves. Neither does the big bang.

There are two things you don't understand here. First, evolution does fit every reasonable definition of science I've seen. If you think otherwise, you probably don't understand the definitions. Second, if the entire community involved in science -- scientists, funders, publishers, universities, national academies, etc. -- thinks evolution is part of science and evolution doesn't fit some definition of science, then that definition is wrong. Definitions describe how people use words, and the way the scientific world uses the word "science" includes evolution.

 

[USincognito]

Science says the big bang theory is science. It doesn't mean it actually falls under true scientific theory. Evolution doesn't meet that criteria either.

How do you know this? Do you have some familiarity with science that actual scientists lack?