Prove it or remove it challenge

[-57]

That it will affect exactly the same DNA? Pretty low. That it will affect the same trait, which is what we're talking about -- quite high. There are usually lots of mutations that can affect a single trait should they occur. Since I've previously given you several examples for which we can actually identify the multiple mutations, you should already know this fact.

It's easy to make that claim....but as you know, simple claims don't cut it.

BTW: I'm still waiting for all those post that you claimed showed us how mutations add up.....Sounds like you might be willing to retract that claim? Yes?

 

[sfs]

It's easy to make that claim....but as you know, simple claims don't cut it.

Which is why you've been provided with the math in several different way, and multiple examples of exactly what you claim can't happen. So once again, tell me why a second beneficial mutation can't occur for the same trait. Give a try -- present some evidence that they can't, or some kind of logical argument.

BTW: I'm still waiting for all those post that you claimed showed us how mutations add up.....Sounds like you might be willing to retract that claim? Yes?

Well, I have to give you this: you are amusing. That was a joke, right?

 

[-57]

Which is why you've been provided with the math in several different way, and multiple examples of exactly what you claim can't happen. So once again, tell me why a second beneficial mutation can't occur for the same trait. Give a try -- present some evidence that they can't, or some kind of logical argument.


Well, I have to give you this: you are amusing. That was a joke, right?

I understand you can't answer the question. So, now you try to turn the table. Nope. It doesn't work that way. You said you can show how mutations accumulate...and have failed on numerous occasions to show how.

 

[VirOptimus]

I understand you can't answer the question. So, now you try to turn the table. Nope. It doesn't work that way. You said you can show how mutations accumulate...and have failed on numerous occasions to show how.

It must then be trivial for you to show that the toe is incorrect. So, please do!

 

[sfs]

I understand you can't answer the question. So, now you try to turn the table. Nope. It doesn't work that way. You said you can show how mutations accumulate...and have failed on numerous occasions to show how.

Which means that no, you have no argument to make. You've been told that given the mutation rate, multiple mutations for the same trait must occur, and you've been told that they have been observed to accumulate, and your only response is to claim that the question hasn't been answered. I think it's pretty clearly true that we can't show you how mutations accumulate, since you don't want to know how they do.

 

[digitalgoth]

Thanks for the reply....but like others you get the coloring book award. All you said was mutations occur and get passed along. Big deal. You still haven't overcome the hurdles I presented.

Perhaps the problem is people are presenting you with the "coloring book" level is because it appears you don't understand the basic science?

What are these "hurdles" that makes the concept so difficult?

 

[Subduction Zone]

Your burden of proof is with regard to your statements about WLC's arguments. Please pick one and proceed with your refutation or withdraw the comment.

Alright I claimed that others had torn his Kalam cosmological argument to shreds. Instead of acting like a jerk why didn't you do the right thing and ask for evidence:

 

[Subduction Zone]

An extremely thorough refuting:

 

[Loudmouth]

I understand you can't answer the question.

I did answer the question.

The human genome is 3 billion bases large and the mutation rate is about 50 mutations per person per generation. It only requires 180 million births to get that one mutation, assuming that there is only one possible mutation.

Of course, if we are looking for just a beneficial mutation, then the number of offspring is reduced drastically.

Are you going to respond or not?

 

[Loudmouth]

I understand you can't answer the question. So, now you try to turn the table. Nope. It doesn't work that way. You said you can show how mutations accumulate...and have failed on numerous occasions to show how.

How can they not accumulate?

 

[Subduction Zone]

An another example of the Kalam being refuted.

In short they all point out that the Kalam Cosmological argument is quite often uses and equivocation fallacy and arguments from ignorance.

 

[-57]

It must then be trivial for you to show that the toe is incorrect. So, please do!

I apologize..this thread is quite lengthy and you probably didn't see this post.

 

[-57]

Which means that no, you have no argument to make. You've been told that given the mutation rate, multiple mutations for the same trait must occur, and you've been told that they have been observed to accumulate, and your only response is to claim that the question hasn't been answered. I think it's pretty clearly true that we can't show you how mutations accumulate, since you don't want to know how they do.

Will you please provide us with the answer?

 

[Loudmouth]

I apologize..this thread is quite lengthy and you probably didn't see this post.

You apparently didn't see the opening post in this thread, which thoroughly refutes your argument.

http://www.christianforums.com/threads/how-mutations-accumulate.7934250/

 

[Loudmouth]

Will you please provide us with the answer?

I already answered it.

The human genome is 3 billion bases large and the mutation rate is about 50 mutations per person per generation. It only requires 180 million births to get that one mutation, assuming that there is only one possible mutation.

Of course, if we are looking for just a beneficial mutation, then the number of offspring is reduced drastically.

Are you going to respond or not?

 

[Subduction Zone]

I apologize..this thread is quite lengthy and you probably didn't see this post.

Why did you run away when some offered to do so?

 

[-57]

Perhaps the problem is people are presenting you with the "coloring book" level is because it appears you don't understand the basic science?

What are these "hurdles" that makes the concept so difficult?

It appears you also missed this post.

 

[-57]

I already answered it.

The human genome is 3 billion bases large and the mutation rate is about 50 mutations per person per generation. It only requires 180 million births to get that one mutation, assuming that there is only one possible mutation.

Of course, if we are looking for just a beneficial mutation, then the number of offspring is reduced drastically.

Are you going to respond or not?

How does the above post of yours answer the question?

 

[Subduction Zone]

One more where an actual physicist refutes the Kalam:

Slight language warning.

 

[Subduction Zone]

It appears you also missed this post.

Strawman arguments and misconceptions on your part are not "hurdles".