Protestantism and "Outside of Church There is No Salvation"

Unofficial Reverand Alex

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From what I've heard from discussions I've been in on salvation, there's a belief that I believe is far too simplistic, but many hold to:

If you believe in Christ, your fate for heaven is sealed, and you will be saved when you die. If you don't believe in Christ, you can't be saved, and you go to hell.

This is generally supported by verses like John 14:6 ("...No one comes to the Father except through me"), and the belief in Sola Fide (salvation by faith alone).

To match the style of the OP, I'm not taking a stance, just listing what many believe.

God be with us all.
 
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Albion

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This is a discussion so don't accuse me of anything.

I know that Protestants believe in an invisible Church so does that mean there is no possible non-Christians can be saved?
It depends on the denomination. Generally speaking, the answer would be yes. But it does depend upon the person's commitment to Christ. I suppose there is a possibility of an individual believing while, however, technically belonging to some non-Christian faith in a non-Western country or something like that.
 
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Albion

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I didn't know one can see the invisible church, do I need a pair invisible glasses to know who is all there?



Did someone say that the invisible church can be seen?

The members of the invisible church can of course be guessed at, and they are visible.
 
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Jonaitis

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Well, according to what I know, the invisible Church is made of all Trinitarian Believers

I've heard some things about them too, Trinitarian is one of them, but there are some others who doubt those claims.
 
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Philip_B

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Ecclesiam nulla salus
Outside the Church there is no salvation

The use of this expression has a long history in the Church and has been used with various shades of meaning.

Augustine explicitly used the idea, however not so much as an exclusivist idea as an inclusivist idea. He also spoke of sheep without and wolves within. The venerable Bede discusses the Church as the Ark of Salvation, which like the Ark of old saved those within, while those without perished. The general tenor of the discussion by the fathers is largely an inclusivist idea, distinguishing the Church (as that was all there was for Christians to belong to) from those outside the Church.

In the West the idea developed a more exclusivist idea in the post schism period. This was allied with a developing understanding (in the West) that Church was defined by communion with the Ancient See of Rome. This may be allied to an overemphasis of the role of the Son in the Procession of the Holy Spirit (filioque).

The Eastern view clearly never embraced such an understanding of the Church, and remained/s solidly biblical in its understanding of the procession of the Holy Spirit and its rejection of the filioque. In Eastern theology there is an acceptance of the vastness of God's love, and whilst they are given to great precision in the finest theological points, the eternal state of a given human being is inefable (unable to be told). As such the East has retained a more inclusive understanding of the term.

Vatican II and the Post Vatican II Church has also gone about the work of understanding the term perhaps now to infer that anyone who is saved is ultimately a member in some sense of the Church. In the Spirit of Vatican II they are moving / have moved to a more inclusive understanding of the term.
 
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com7fy8

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I know that Protestants believe in an invisible Church so does that mean there is no possible non-Christians can be saved?
I think different Protestants believe in different things.

I would say the church of Jesus is visible, but what makes someone a Christian in the church is invisible.

One needs to trust in Jesus for salvation > Ephesians 1:12.

But, also, we need how our Father personally corrects us in our character > how God Himself does this. Hebrews 12:4-14

And with Jesus we become gentle and humble in His gentle and quiet love >

"rather let it be the hidden person of the heart, with the incorruptible beauty of a gentle and quiet spirit, which is very precious in the sight of God." (1 Peter 3:4)

And we personally submit to how our Father guides us in His own peace ruling in our hearts >

"And let the peace of God rule in your hearts, to which also you were called in one body; and be thankful." (Colossians 3:15)

So, if what I am offering is so > you might have an interesting time finding out how many Protestants are gentle and quiet in all-loving love while personally obeying how our Heavenly Father rules us with His own peace in our hearts.

And if people have not heard the Gospel, it is likely you do not personally know any of these people, so you can see if they are living in God's own peace in submission to Him. So, how can you say, from experience?

The Bible does say, though, that Jesus says no one comes to the Father except through Jesus > John 14:6. And Jesus knows. But, also, Jesus did say He had more sheep to bring in. And ones have different ideas about this.
 
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Not David

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Ecclesiam nulla salus
Outside the Church there is no salvation

The use of this expression has a long history in the Church and has been used with various shades of meaning.

Augustine explicitly used the idea, however not so much as an exclusivist idea as an inclusivist idea. He also spoke of sheep without and wolves within. The venerable Bede discusses the Church as the Ark of Salvation, which like the Ark of old saved those within, while those without perished. The general tenor of the discussion by the fathers is largely an inclusivist idea, distinguishing the Church (as that was all there was for Christians to belong to) from those outside the Church.

In the West the idea developed a more exclusivist idea in the post schism period. This was allied with a developing understanding (in the West) that Church was defined by communion with the Ancient See of Rome. This may be allied to an overemphasis of the role of the Son in the Procession of the Holy Spirit (filioque).

The Eastern view clearly never embraced such an understanding of the Church, and remained/s solidly biblical in its understanding of the procession of the Holy Spirit and its rejection of the filioque. In Eastern theology there is an acceptance of the vastness of God's love, and whilst they are given to great precision in the finest theological points, the eternal state of a given human being is inefable (unable to be told). As such the East has retained a more inclusive understanding of the term.

Vatican II and the Post Vatican II Church has also gone about the work of understanding the term perhaps now to infer that anyone who is saved is ultimately a member in some sense of the Church. In the Spirit of Vatican II they are moving / have moved to a more inclusive understanding of the term.
The Orthodox Church believes in Salvation through the Church but they don't say where the limits are.
 
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grasping the after wind

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This is a discussion so don't accuse me of anything.

I know that Protestants believe in an invisible Church so does that mean there is no possible non-Christians can be saved?

I believe Jesus told us that with God anything is possible.
 
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SkyWriting

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It depends on the denomination. Generally speaking, the answer would be yes. But it does depend upon the person's commitment to Christ. I suppose there is a possibility of an individual believing while, however, technically belonging to some non-Christian faith in a non-Western country or something like that.

Yes. All are considered.
1 Samuel 16:7
But the Lord said to Samuel, “Do not look on his appearance or on the height of his stature, because I have rejected him. For the Lord sees not as man sees: man looks on the outward appearance, but the Lord looks on the heart.”
 
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hedrick

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Protestants have a range of beliefs. Despite the traditional Catholic doctrine, current Catholic thought doesn't actually exclude non-Catholics from salvation. Indeed recent popes have implied that there's a possibility for non-Christians.

Some Protestants think only Christians can be saved, but many think it's possible for non-Christians to be saved. It's very unusual for Protestants to limit salvation to their own church or family of churches.

The main way in which Protestants criticize Catholics in this area is that conservative Protestants (who think salvation is limited to Christians) sometimes criticize Catholics for thinking there's a possibility for non-Christians.
 
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redleghunter

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This is a discussion so don't accuse me of anything.

I know that Protestants believe in an invisible Church so does that mean there is no possible non-Christians can be saved?
Are you asking if someone does not have Christ as their Lord and Savior they cannot be saved?
 
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redleghunter

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Well, according to what I know, the invisible Church is made of all Trinitarian Believers
Romans 8: NASB

15For you have not received a spirit of slavery leading to fear again, but you have received a spirit of adoption as sons by which we cry out, “Abba! Father!” 16The Spirit Himself testifies with our spirit that we are children of God, 17and if children, heirs also, heirs of God and fellow heirs with Christ, if indeed we suffer with Him so that we may also be glorified with Him.
 
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Not David

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Romans 8: NASB

15For you have not received a spirit of slavery leading to fear again, but you have received a spirit of adoption as sons by which we cry out, “Abba! Father!” 16The Spirit Himself testifies with our spirit that we are children of God, 17and if children, heirs also, heirs of God and fellow heirs with Christ, if indeed we suffer with Him so that we may also be glorified with Him.
What's your point?
 
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