Profiling

[Inspired]

Originally posted by quizzler
You know, as a Christian we profile. Its not wrong. you have to profile, to know who is needing Jesus.

So you look at a person and say hmmmm thier Arabic they need Jesus?

Or do you stereotype and judge people to come to the conculsion they need Jesus?

 

[Extirpated Wildlife]

Originally posted by Inspired
So you look at a person and say hmmmm thier Arabic they need Jesus?

Unless i actually know them, i might think they do. Then get to know them and find out they might already know Him. But if they are muslim, yes they do need to know Christ.

 

[cenimo]

OK....profiling and not profiling...theorhetical situation....cops have morning briefing...Chief of Police says mayor is very upset with profiling and threatens police with harrassment charges if they question somebody and it leads nowhere...

later that day, cop sees somebody that he knows doesn't "look right", so cop let's it go, considering warnings...

that person the cop let go kills somebody or group of people or sets off a bomb.....

so now where is the hearm in profiling?

 

[two feathers]

what if, in another theoretical situation, the cops are so busy profiling that a person who doesn't fit a "profile" goes and kills somebody or a group of people or sets off a bomb...

 

[Janice]

Hopefully they wouldn't be "busy profiling." I mean, how could you be "busy profiling?" Isn't it just a matter of making a judgment based on the way the person is looking and acting? Or yes, the way they are dressed or the group they are with?

And unfortunately, with the present threats to national security by a certain group of people, we would be pretty stupid to say that we can't take a harder look at people from that group.

 

[Brimshack]

I wonder if it occured to anyone to start profiling white males after Timothy McVeigh laid his claim to fame?

 

[Blindfaith]

If, if, if........

We can go on theoretical examples all day and all night....

Guess what.....our world and the way we live has changed.  Deal with it.

 

[lithium.]

Originally posted by blindfaith
Guess what.....our world and the way we live has changed.  Deal with it.

I agree.. Our lifes has changed and we have to do some things to keep freedom and keep people from dieing so I agree with profiling. You know that if it was white men that did what happened on 9/11 white men would be profiling right now also.

 

[cenimo]

two feathers ....... possible but an extreme ....let's say that it was believed some of the faction of the Tokyo subway bombers were in NYC...what's the right move? to tell the transit police to check out anyone who looks Japanese (ut-oh, profiling!), or to tell the transit police to leave anyone who looks Japanese alone? With that many lives at stake worrying about who gets offended should be no consideration at all. End of story.

Brimshack...

please go to google, search OKC and Carol Howe before sharing your knowledge about OKC with the world....not that McVeigh was innocent, but he certainly was no lone terrorist....there are a lot of former law enforcement in that area that were either not allowed to testify or fired for refusing to hush up about what they saw...
all the controversy over profiling does is hinder the police because of the whims of a bunch of dreamers....as blindfaith said, things have changed, deal with it...deal with it realisitically

 

[Doctrine1st]

Originally posted by seesaw
You know that if it was white men that did what happened on 9/11 white men would be profiling right now also.

If a bunch of Eric Rudolphs had done this, I highly doubt they would start profiling WASP men. They are profiling by race and origin. If they were white, I can maybe see them profiling by affiliation, which I would imagine is the normal channel (in theory).

D1st

 

[coastie]

Profiling works!

Profiling doesn't work!

Profiling is bad!

Profiling is a needed tool by police officers!

That's why this is such a great debate! Niether side is wrong!

 

[alphatronics]

Originally posted by quizzler
I think that profiling is a good thing. What about you?

No.

 

[alphatronics]

Originally posted by coastie
Profiling works!

Profiling doesn't work!

Profiling is bad!

Profiling is a needed tool by police officers!

That's why this is such a great debate! Niether side is wrong!

I'm glad you provide so much to the conversation.

 

[Blindfaith]

Oh my.......

Was that a slam there Alphatronics?

 

[fin]

Profiling is racism. Didn't we Americans learn our lesson during the Civil Rights movement? It is a disgrace that after all our country has been through we still consider racial profiling a viable method of fighting crime.

Should it be innocent untill proven Arab or Black?

 

[Blindfaith]

We didn't have the problem of terrorist attacks during the '50's either.  The times have changed......as have the needs......

 

[fin]

Times have changed but how does that make immoral actions right?

The fact that racist ideas are being seriously considered scares me. As a nation are we so stupid that we would return to the spiritual prison that we only recently escaped from?

 

[datan]

Its not necessary racism. You have limited resources, and you want to catch the bad guys. You have to look at what kind of poeple the bad guys have been, and who the bad guys are likely to be. If over the last decade most of the acts of terrorism around the world have been perpetrated by people of a certain group (eg. Chechnya, Israel, Indonesia, Africa, the US), then perhaps you should pay more attention to people from those certain group, since statistically chances are that the next event will have something to do with the same group of people who did the last ten events. You have to identify your threat model and act on it. Your 86 year-old-great-grand-mother travelling with grand-daughter + kids isn't a threat to the aircraft's security. Asking the ex-vice president to please take of his shoes or the 80+ year old senator to please strip is called a complete wast of time (or the military type guy, although some people have been know to have "forgotten" that they were carrying guns). If you let it be know that you are directing more of your resources on the given threat model, then that itself is a deterrent, which is really what this is all about. Nobody seriously expects to catch a hijacker going through the metal detector with a gun in his waistbelt. The metal detector is there so that the hijacker won't do such a thing. Having said that, I am of the personal opinion that it is a waste of time and resources devoting so much attention to airport security for the simple fact that the terrorists will try something else, if only because they know that their chances of an encore are really low (change in pilots, passengers' attitudes to hijackers for example). In short, if you think your next terrorist is likely to be an Islamic extremist, that's who you should be more concerned with.

 

[Blessed-one]

can't be helped....
it really depends on the situation. In terms of terrorism, profiling may be the most effective way in catching the man. Investigation is quite scientific, so naturally that's what is to be done when it comes down to science. However, we know that there're also white men who're actually with the terrorists group, so profiling cannot completely ruled out people of other races either, so yes, in a sense profiling is good, but if you narrowed it down too much, it may just as well backfire on you.

 

[Wolseley]

Profiling based on ethnicity is unpleasant, surely; but common sense has to play a hand as well. For example:

In 1972 at the Munich Olympics, athletes were kidnapped and massacred
by:
(a) Olga Corbutt
(b) Sitting Bull
(c) Arnold Schwartzeneger
(d) Muslim male extremists mostly between the ages of 17 and 40

In 1979, the U.S. embassy in Iran was taken over by:
(a) Lost Norwegians
(b) Elvis Presley
(c) A tour bus full of 80-year-old women
(d) Muslim male extremists mostly between the ages of 17 and 40

During the 1980's a number of Americans were kidnapped in Lebanon by:
(a) John Dillinger
(b) The King of Sweden
(c) The Boy Scouts
(d) Muslim male extremists mostly between the ages of 17 and 40

In 1983, the U.S. Marine barracks in Beirut was blown up by:
(a) A pizza delivery boy
(b) Pee Wee Herman
(c) Geraldo Rivera
(d) Muslim male extremists mostly between the ages of 17 and 40.

In 1985 the cruise ship Achille Lauro was hijacked, and a 70 year old
American passenger was murdered and thrown overboard by:
(a) Papa Smurf
(b) Davy Jones
(c) The Little Mermaid
(d) Muslim male extremists mostly between the ages of 17 and 40.

In 1985 TWA flight 847 was hijacked at Athens, and a U.S. Navy diver was
murdered by:
(a) Captain Kidd
(b) Charles Lindberg
(c) Mother Teresa
(d) Muslim male extremists mostly between the ages of 17 and 40

In 1988, Pan Am Flight 103 was bombed by:
(a) Scooby Doo
(b) The Tooth Fairy
(c) Butch Cassidy and The Sundance Kid
(d) Muslim male extremists mostly between the ages of 17 and 40

In 1993 the World Trade Center was bombed the first time by:
(a) Richard Simmons
(b) Grandma Moses
(c) Michael Jordan
(d) Muslim male extremists mostly between the ages of 17 and 40

In 1998, the U.S. embassies in Kenya and Tanzania were bombed by:
(a) Mr. Rogers
(b) Hillary Clinton
(c) The World Wrestling Federation
(d) Muslim male extremists mostly between the ages of 17 and 40

On 9/11/01, four airliners were hijacked and destroyed and thousands of
people were killed by:
(a) Bugs Bunny, Wiley E. Coyote, Daffy Duck, and Elmer Fudd
(b) The Supreme Court of Florida
(c) Mr. Bean
(d) Muslim male extremists mostly between the ages of 17 and 40

Earlier this year, the United States fought a war in Afghanistan against:
(a) Enron
(b) The Lutheran Church
(c) The NFL
(d) Muslim male extremists mostly between the ages of 17 and 40

Also earlier this year, reporter Daniel Pearl was kidnapped and murdered by:
(a) Bonnie and Clyde
(b) Captain Kangaroo
(c) Billy Graham
(d) Muslim male extremists mostly between the ages of 17 and 40

And just within the last two months, US Marines on a training exercise in Kuwait were attacked and one Marine was killed, by:
a) Ozzie and Harriet
b) Bob the Builder
c) Spongebob Squarepants
d) Muslim male extremists mostly between the ages of 17 and 40

Any patterns here that might justify profiling? Gee, I don't know; what do you think???