Pro-Life Protesting Behavior

[christalee4]

And if they do we have laws to deal with that, it is called murder.

As for abortion past viability that to is in my view murder unless a clear medical reason can be documented and supported. Clinc doctors are bias toward the abortion they dont get paid if the woman chooses not to kill her child.

So do you think women who have abortions should be tried as murderesses, and the doctors who perform them?

If so, should the millions of women who have had abortions be tried for past murder, in that the statute of limitations exists for a certain number of years? And if they indeed are guilty of murder, how do you propose to try them all, and execute them for murder?

 

[Angel4Truth]

I don't see how killing babies has anything to do with this thread; fetuses are not babies.

According to the bible they are already life so yes they are babies. You dont have to believe the bible about it but I do.

If a pregnant woman were hit by a drunk driver and her unborn baby died its considered a baby. If the same woman drops by the abortion clinic to rid herself of her 'fetus' then its not a baby.

Its very convenient that if the unborn is wanted its a baby and if it isnt its basically a peice of living moving meat but thats about it. And so many cannot even begin to see the double standard.

 

[KomissarSteve]

According to the bible they are already life

No it doesn't.

 

[MikeMcK]

Stop treating the women as objects, who don't have minds or souls.

No one is doing that, except maybe the abortionist.

Women, as those who carry potential life, are not breeding wombs, nor inanimate life forms who exist to make babies. They have minds. They have souls and decisions. And by God, they got the vote. Too bad. You can't turn back time.

Huh? When did I ever say that women shouldn't be allowed to vote?

You can try to obscure the issue all you like, but it's still about the baby.

 

[TinkaBella]

The problem is that it isn't about their body. It is about the life of another human being.

If they were to decide to, say, have a nose job or to buy a new pair of shoes, that's one thing. Those things affect their own body and no one else's.

But when they choose to have their baby killed, then that is taking the life of another human being.

See, they aren't killing a baby if it's not developed yet. They could just as easily miscarry (god's abortion?) in those early weeks. I'm not talking post-viability, which I'm against for most reason except health of mother/child, but there is no way a just fertilized egg can be considered in the same context as a fully formed and born baby. I think a woman has the right to determine if she will grow that child or not, especially if she never wanted it to begin with. And no more "she shouldn't have had sex" talk, that's been adressed already.

 

[Hunterkirk]

So do you think women who have abortions should be tried as murderesses, and the doctors who perform them?

If so, should the millions of women who have had abortions be tried for past murder, in that the statute of limitations exists for a certain number of years? And if they indeed are guilty of murder, how do you propose to try them all, and execute them for murder?

If the abortion happens after point of viability (we can argue what that is at a later point), that is the child could easily and safely be born and live, but the child is instead killed in a abortion proceedure... Yes I would call that Murder.

Oh I was under the impression that late term abortion was very rare... now you are saying that MILLIONS of women are having late term abortions? Well I am confused either it is rare or it is common place.

 

[MooCar93]

honor is a quality that is usually earned - so it doesnt apply - basic respect has nothing to do with oking a choice to sin. Can you show me in the bible where it says to honor or respect a choice to sin?

Again, nobody is talking about respecting women for having abortions. We are talking about respecting women for being fellow human beings with the right to make their own decisions in life. This is not something that has to be earned, at least not IMO.

 

[Angel4Truth]

No it doesn't.

Please translate the following then since you do not believe the bible says such:

Pslams 139: 13. For You have formed my inward parts; You have covered me in my mother's womb.
14. I will praise You, for I am fearfully and wonderfully made; Marvelous are Your works, And that my soul knows very well.
15. My frame was not hidden from You, When I was made in secret, And skillfully wrought in the lowest parts of the earth.
16. Your eyes saw my substance, being yet unformed. And in Your book they all were written, The days fashioned for me, When as yet there were none of them.

Jeremiah 1:5 "Before I formed you in the womb I knew you; before you were born I sanctified you; and I ordained you a prophet to the nations.''

 

[Angel4Truth]

Again, nobody is talking about respecting women for having abortions. We are talking about respecting women for being fellow human beings with the right to make their own decisions in life. This is not something that has to be earned, at least not IMO.

I see so we should respect our childrens decisions if they want to commit suicide , take drugs and murder someone.

We should respect the adult choice to be a drunk and do nothing about it. I gotcha.

The problem is that you seem to have a hard time seperating that we must respect what people do to respect THEM as a person. These are not the same issues but you desire to state that if we do not respect someones choice to SIN that we cannot possibly respect THEM.

 

[KomissarSteve]

Please translate the following then since you do not believe the bible says such:

Pslams 139: 13. For You have formed my inward parts; You have covered me in my mother's womb.
14. I will praise You, for I am fearfully and wonderfully made; Marvelous are Your works, And that my soul knows very well.
15. My frame was not hidden from You, When I was made in secret, And skillfully wrought in the lowest parts of the earth.
16. Your eyes saw my substance, being yet unformed. And in Your book they all were written, The days fashioned for me, When as yet there were none of them.

Jeremiah 1:5 "Before I formed you in the womb I knew you; before you were born I sanctified you; and I ordained you a prophet to the nations.''

God planned us out before birth. That doesn't mean that before birth, we are alive, much less humans. Perhaps God didn't intend for some of us to survive to become humans at birth.

Let me turn the question around to you - why do you think this implies that we can be considered humans before birth?

 

[Angel4Truth]

Are you seriously suggesting that God planned for women to abort their babies?

 

[KomissarSteve]

Are you seriously suggesting that God planned for women to abort their babies?

I'm suggesting nothing of the sort. I'm suggesting that the Scriptures are not as easy to interpret as you suggest.

 

[SallyNow]

[]



I am not a very passionate person, which makes me an excellent pro-life activist. I do not normally get exited or loose my temper about anything so why would you expect me to get passionate about this thread? Anyhow, I was adressing the original question of whether the demonstrator's tactics accomplished anything. I stated that I did not think the "harlot " comment would accomplish anything. I would never say anthing like that to anyone and I doubt if anyone of my fellow pro-lifers would. It was a nasty comment.

Everyone is capable of being nasty, including so-called "pro-lifers".

We do treat all women entering "our" abortion clinic on Saturday morning as abortion bound because Saturday is abortion day at the mill. The women normally have on baggy pants and have someone else driving them. They are very often crying. These are red flags for abortion intent. On the slim (very slim - this place is an ABORTION clinic) chance that someone is not there for an abortion - and we hand them abortion literarature when they stop - there is no harm done.

Wait, is this a clinic that only performs abortions? Or is it a regular clinic or an OBGYN ("women's") clinic that only performs abortions on Saturdays? Also, it is wrong-headed to assume someone entering a clinic on a Saturday is heading for an abortion - I know plenty of young women (and men) who go to walk-in clinics on Saturdays for regular exams because school and/or work interferes with regular medical clinic hours, and/or they just haven't found a doctor's office in their area. Many of those women going into the clinic may just be going to get regular exams. Even in that case, it would be very stressful to have to be bugged by people giving out flyers. Some of them may be finding out they have a miscarriage... or are sterile... or have become pregnant because of a date rape... or who just are very stressed because of an unusual PAP smear (not uncommon!) or a precancerous mole.

The same could be said of any abortion mill, if a lady sees some literature and she is going there for some other purpose - so what?

So what? SO WHAT? A person going into a medical clinic is going for three reasons: a regular exam, a prescription refill, or because of a medical problem. The last thing they need are people bugging them, handing out flyers, stressing them out over a medical issue!

Anti-abortion protesters should understand this: abortion is a medical issue between a doctor and a patient. A protester doesn't know the individual circumstances of the case. They don't even know why a person is going into the clinic. A man or woman may be entering it to find out any number of tragic things and adding more stress is cruel and useless.

I do not know what "most girls" think or what their motivations are. I do know that some are not absolutely sure and some are just worried or scared. We are there to educate them and offer an alternative, and some do take us up on our offers. The ones that change their minds make our efforts worthwhile.

What those women need are information on adoption, and the knowledge that the adoptive parents will be good parents, not just rich ones. That is, they need to know that solid middle-class families can afford medical services, the initial overly-priced adoption fees, and so on.

Actually, most (if not all) of the people who pray/counsel at the abortion mill we go to do participate in several activities. I was the Respect Life coordinator at my parish and our group sells roses and collects baby items every year for an aid organization. We have also held baby showers for pregnant women who have chosen to not kill thier unborn children. Several of the people also volunteer at crisis pregnancy centers. All of us are faithful Catholics who support the charity efforts of our Church. We also distribute polictical/legislative information at the parishes.

Baby showers? So cute little baby items. What about the nitty-gritty of life, such as health insurance, or money to tide over the mother during her maternity leave? Diapers? Water bills? How about the absent fathers? I guess they don't get anyone yelling at them or expecting them to raise a child for the rest of their lives, are they?

Our activities outside of the abortion mill are effective as we usually have at least one turnaround a week. Just this last Saturday a young lady drove in , looked at our literature and drove out. She had planned on having an abortion and changed her mind. One of the workers came out last year and told us that we were driving away the clinic's business .

Did you she tell you that she was going to have an abortion? Or could she have been going for a GYN exam?

We also distribute informative literature to the cars that are stopped for the train. We usually get to hand out about 35 peices on a Saturday morning. we really do reach alot of people with abortion info.

Just what most places need - more pollution. Because once those kids are born, they don't deserve to live in an area with clear air and lots of trees... they only have rights before they are born!

Even if we did not have turnarounds, our efforts would be benificial because the little humans being slaughtered will at leas thave someone to pray for them. The prayers for the mothers, fathers, abortionists and clinic workers will also do some good.

You can pray anywhere and it will just as valuable. What those "little human beings" need are adoptive - not foster - families. For most families, adoption is out of the question because of the intial price tag of adoption. Perhaps a better use of the time on Saturday mornings would be helping solid families raise money for the initial costs of adoption.

 

[Angel4Truth]

I'm suggesting nothing of the sort. I'm suggesting that the Scriptures are not as easy to interpret as you suggest.

So then you wont be answering with any kind of interpretation of the verses I posted thenother than the people being spoken to are not even human (id like to know what you believe they are). I see. I believe that what they state are pretty much self evident and do not require further "interpretation" myself.

 

[KomissarSteve]

So then you wont be answering with any kind of interpretation of the verses I posted thenother than the people being spoken to are not even human (id like to know what you believe they are). I see. I believe that what they state are pretty much self evident and do not require further "interpretation" myself.

Well, you're making a pretty far-fetched interpretation there yourself. Neither of those passages state that "life begins at conception," so no matter how comforting I'm sure it is to you to delude yourself into thinking that your reading of the Scriptures is self-evidently the truth, sans interpretation, I'm afraid it's nothing of the sort.

It's your personal opinion. You're putting God in a box by implying that your interpretation must be correct.

 

[Angel4Truth]

No , they claim the life began long before conception , but if you would like another verse , i can give you one that says the life is in the blood and a "fetus' has blood therefore has life. you are the one putting God in a box by saying He cannot get the right ideal out without putting it in words you like - like "life begins at conception". Did you know that arguments from silence are the very weakest ones in existance?

you keep claiming my "interpretation" is faulty when i didnt give an "interpretation" i gave the verses and asked you to tell me what you beleive they mean and you refuse to do it while continuing to claim mine is wrong.

Well if i am wrong, then correct me by answering my question- if you cannot then im guessing its because you already know they are pretty self evident and you just dont like what they say. I sure wouldnt keep saying your wrong your wrong without showing how you were wrong.

Whose deluded? You wont even TRY to answer me. so i am wrong because you said so? LOL

 

[TinkaBella]

Are you seriously suggesting that God planned for women to abort their babies?

Sure why not? God works in mysterious ways. Perhaps there is a lesson to be learned through it all. Have you ever seen those women who used to be pro choice and and are now pro life, or the ones who have had abortions then publicly turn on abortion providers? People make hero's out of them. Maybe that was planned by God.

Or maybe God doesn't exist and people live with their own choices and learn from their mistakes.

 

[KomissarSteve]

No , they claim the life began long before conception ,

No they don't. That's your interpretation. Sorry to burst your bubble.

you keep claiming my "interpretation" is faulty when i didnt give an "interpretation" i gave the verses and asked you to tell me what you beleive they mean and you refuse to do it while continuing to claim mine is wrong.

Actually, I already did tell you what I think they mean. Remember when I said that God plans out our destinies from long before we're born?

 

[Angel4Truth]

Um your last line is what i said. You made a claim they exist but not as humans but have failed to tell us as what or even attempt to interpret the verses you claim do not mean God sees us as life before we are even born.

Gods word will always mean more to me than yours will and considering your "opinion" on it isnt biblically supported at all - i think we both know how much weight its going to carry with someone willing to back that opinion with Gods word.

So much for bursting bubbles. Tell me do you enter debates for informational and communication exchange or to take cheap shots? I would avoid terms like bursting bubbles if you want to be taken seriously.

 

[TinkaBella]

How can life begin before conception? And if there is life before conception then abortion can't be killing because its just maintains that state of pre-conception life. Uhh...I think?