Praying for the Sick

Souldier · Apr 7, 2015

ByTheSpirit said:
Your version of the truth on this subject is highly suspect...

Why is it? does it contradict what the apostles said? No, it agrees with what they said. They say that to walk by faith not sight means to look toward heaven instead of earthly things. Im only trying to keep the teaching pure. I dont see why thats wrong. You can show other scriptures that support your beliefs and i wont debate against them as long as they are in the proper context. Im only trying to stay within the bounds of context, to the best of my ability, while also using it to search for truth. That seems like a good thing.

Messy · Apr 7, 2015

Souldier said:
What is the SoP?

http://www.christianforums.com/t7846693/

Souldier · Apr 7, 2015

Messy said:
http://www.christianforums.com/t7846693/

Thank you. I will study it and see if i am breaking any rules.

Souldier · Apr 7, 2015

After reading the SOP, i dont know that i am breaking any rules. I have never dinied that spiritual gifts may still be given to members of the Church. I only try to prove things by scripture. I believe that if something is true then scripture will not contradict it.

I believe i follow these rules:

Spirit-Filled, Pentecostal and/or Charismatic believers can be from any denomination. They are those who believe that all the various spiritual gifts (or charisms) listed in the New Testament (including but not limited to the manifestations gifts found in I Corinthians 12:8-10) are active in the Church today and desirable in the life of the individual believer, for the edification of the Body of Christ. It is not required that the individual exercises/exhibits any specific spiritual gift(s)

2. No Promotion of works, observances or water baptism as a means to gain salvation or righteousness, or any other merit, or as mandatory to Christian living. Baptism however may be discussed as a sign of obedience to Christ.

Definition of discussion:
: the act of talking about something with another person or a group of people : a conversation about something
: a speech or piece of writing that gives information, ideas, opinions, etc., about something

Souldier · Apr 7, 2015

Does this rule suggest that receiving healing is not a merit that is mandatory to Christian living? If so then perhaps we may want to consider if its against the rules to question another's faith in Christ if they do not receive healing..

2. No Promotion of works, observances or water baptism as a means to gain salvation or righteousness, or any other merit, or as mandatory to Christian living. Baptism however may be discussed as a sign of obedience to Christ.

ByTheSpirit · Apr 7, 2015

Souldier said:
Does this rule suggest that receiving healing is not a merit that is mandatory to Christian living? If so then perhaps we may want to consider if its against the rules to question another's faith in Christ if they do not receive healing..

2. No Promotion of works, observances or water baptism as a means to gain salvation or righteousness, or any other merit, or as mandatory to Christian living. Baptism however may be discussed as a sign of obedience to Christ.

Who has questioned anyone's faith in Christ? You know what that phrase means right? That some may be questioning the "Christian" in a person... that is a bit outlandish. I certainly haven't seen anything close to this

Souldier · Apr 7, 2015

ByTheSpirit said:
Who has questioned anyone's faith in Christ? You know what that phrase means right? That some may be questioning the "Christian" in a person... that is a bit outlandish. I certainly haven't seen anything close to this

I only suggested that we consider the rule, i never made any accusations.

ByTheSpirit · Apr 7, 2015

Souldier said:
After reading the SOP, i dont know that i am breaking any rules. I have never dinied that spiritual gifts may still be given to members of the Church. I only try to prove things by scripture. I believe that if something is true then scripture will not contradict it.

I believe i follow these rules:

Spirit-Filled, Pentecostal and/or Charismatic believers can be from any denomination. They are those who believe that all the various spiritual gifts (or charisms) listed in the New Testament (including but not limited to the manifestations gifts found in I Corinthians 12:8-10) are active in the Church today and desirable in the life of the individual believer, for the edification of the Body of Christ. It is not required that the individual exercises/exhibits any specific spiritual gift(s)

2. No Promotion of works, observances or water baptism as a means to gain salvation or righteousness, or any other merit, or as mandatory to Christian living. Baptism however may be discussed as a sign of obedience to Christ.

Definition of discussion:
: the act of talking about something with another person or a group of people : a conversation about something
: a speech or piece of writing that gives information, ideas, opinions, etc., about something

Bold, Red, Enlarged above...

You have made posts in this thread where you have stated that it is less desirable for healing and more so to accept suffering as the will of God. Perhaps that wasn't the exact words you used, but the essence of your words was that healing is less desirable for Christians... I will find this post or two or more of yours and pin them here...

Souldier · Apr 7, 2015

ByTheSpirit said:
Bold, Red, Enlarged above...

You have made posts in this thread where you have stated that it is less desirable for healing and more so to accept suffering as the will of God. Perhaps that wasn't the exact words you used, but the essence of your words was that healing is less desirable for Christians... I will find this post or two or more of yours and pin them here...

No, i never suggested such. I did say we should covet the best gifts as Paul teaches, but he goes on to say that love is the greatest, perhaps the greatest gift. Im only saying that we much persevere above all circumstances, and not lose focus of walking by faith instead of sight, as the apostles teach us. I also suggested that suffering can teach us things. The apostles teach us the same thing many times. They say through much adversity we will enter the kingdom. I have not broken that rule which you cited. You have only misinterpreted what i have said.

ByTheSpirit · Apr 7, 2015

Souldier said:
No, i never suggested such. I did say we should covet the best gifts as Paul teaches, but he goes on to say that love is the greatest, perhaps the greatest gift. Im only saying that we much persevere above all circumstances, and not lose focus of walking by faith instead of sight, as the apostles teach us. I also suggested that suffering can teach us things. The apostles teach us the same thing many times. They say through much adversity we will enter the kingdom. I have not broken that rule which you cited. You have only misinterpreted what i have said.

Love isn't a gift of anything...

It is a fruit of obedience to the Spirit, but it is not a gift. Actually Paul doesn't even say Love is greater than the gifts, he says of faith, hope, and love that love is the greatest of those things. But love is a necessary element of faith if our faith is to be acceptable to God. WHICH implies that a person can have faith and still not be acceptable to God.

If I misunderstood your posts, I apologize sincerely. The way I have read some of your words is that healing is less desirable.

Souldier · Apr 7, 2015

Look if you dont want to study the context of the scriptures that we use then thats fine. I just think we can all learn together, we can learn deeper truths by studying the context of the scripture. Im not here to experience trouble. I just like to explore scripture and search for answers that i dont have.

Souldier · Apr 7, 2015

ByTheSpirit said:
Love isn't a gift of anything...

It is a fruit of obedience to the Spirit, but it is not a gift. Actually Paul doesn't even say Love is greater than the gifts, he says of faith, hope, and love that love is the greatest of those things. But love is a necessary element of faith if our faith is to be acceptable to God. WHICH implies that a person can have faith and still not be acceptable to God.

If I misunderstood your posts, I apologize sincerely. The way I have read some of your words is that healing is less desirable.

You say that by faith we heal. Love is greater than faith according to your words.

Messy · Apr 7, 2015

Galatians 5
For in Christ Jesus neither circumcision nor uncircumcision avails anything, but faith working through love.

Souldier · Apr 7, 2015

Messy said:
Galatians 5
For in Christ Jesus neither circumcision nor uncircumcision avails anything, but faith working through love.

Now we get back to faith. My only concern is the difference between the apostles doctrine of walking by faith not sight, and the doctrine of healing by faith. I believe it is not the same thing. I believe we all must walk by faith and not sight if we want to get through this world of hardship, but we dont alll need to be healed. Is something wrong with focusing on heaven, even if we may endure illness without healing? Surely focusing on heaven in all situations can help us get through them. That is what walking by faith not sight means. If however we confuse that definition with healing then we rob ourselves of the full blessings of faith. So its important to study the context of walking by faith and its definition. Its not a bad thing but its a good thing.

Souldier · Apr 7, 2015

I think we should start another thread on the topic of walking by faith. I think the purpose of this one is praying for the sick.

ByTheSpirit · Apr 7, 2015

well healing does concern walking by faith. I don't know someone could start a new thread on the topic, but I feel it is appropriate even though I would like to hear more from Oscarr on the topic.

ByTheSpirit · Apr 7, 2015

Souldier said:
You say that by faith we heal. Love is greater than faith according to your words.

Yet that doesn't make love a gift. That is an unscriptural statement, "Love is the greatest gift" is about like saying, "God helps those who help themselves"

You'll find neither one of those in the Bible anywhere. Even in CONTEXT (see I do like contexts) of the love is greater than faith, that is right in the middle of the bible's most specific teachings on the gifts of the Spirit, healings being one of the listed. And as he writes that "without love I am nothing" he doesn't say anything about healing not being necessary, he simply says that *PARAPHRASING* those who display the gifts of the Spirit should love, because without love it is pointless.

So I was merely correcting your statement, love is not a gift, it is a fruit.

Alithis · Apr 7, 2015

Love and faith are inseparable.

Souldier · Apr 7, 2015

ByTheSpirit said:
well healing does concern walking by faith. I don't know someone could start a new thread on the topic, but I feel it is appropriate even though I would like to hear more from Oscarr on the topic.

It is appropriate and thats why it came into the discussion. I just think another thread can be more profitable for discussing the two topics. I think we have said all that we can in this thread without getting away from the OP which is about praying. Maybe by starting a new thread on walking by faith the two threads together can become more profitable. I dont care one way or the other to be honest, i just didn't want to get away from the praying thing any further. I think we have two different topics in walking by faith and praying in faith. Both teach different aspects of faith in my opinion. I dont think faith is dependent upon healing miracles, i think its also about looking toward heaven where we dont need such things any more.

Souldier · Apr 7, 2015

Alithis said:
Love and faith are inseparable.

I agree

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