happyinhisgrace
Blessed Trinity
arizona_sunshine said:
Well, the Bible says that God created all things for his glory.
God Bless-
Grace
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arizona_sunshine said:Progression: continuous creation, continuous increase
if He'd reached His full potential why would He create the earth and those that are in it? for His entertainment? i have a hard time trivializing His work in that way.
Your statement does not take away from the possibility of equality with God. Furthner, as Lorenzo Snow and Joseph Smith and other pointed out, God was once a man who became a God, so presumably if that is held to be true, God once had to worship another God, and thus if God said the same as you, then there must be another God yet greater than the God which the Mormons claim to worship. Why would you worship only a lesser god?arizona_sunshine said:wow, i am impressed how strong this thread continues!
tom777, emerald dragon is well aware of the belief in eternal progression. his point is that we will never grow beyond the power of God. even as we progress, he continues to progress, continues to be our Heavenly Father, continues to be the God we worship and from whom we learn.
happyinhisgrace said:Well, the Bible says that God created all things for his glory.
happyinhisgrace said:As far as Him being a lesser God... you have a grandfather. Does that make your father any less to you? Does that mean your grandfather is really responsible for your birth, and more worthy of your affections than your father? Then again, I mean... you have a great grandfather...
I think this passage is a good responce to what you said above....
Romans 1:22.... Professing to be wise, they became fools, and changed the glory of the incorruptible God into an image made like corruptible man....
happyinhisgrace said:One Godhead: God the Father, Christ His son and the Holy Ghost.
Actually, in lds belief...these are 3 different gods and god the father is the one that is worshipped. worship of God through Jesus christ but the lds church does not teach worship of all three, only of God the father so to say that the lds church worships all 3 is incorrect.
Interpret these how you may.happyinhisgrace said:One Godhead: God the Father, Christ His son and the Holy Ghost.
Actually, in lds belief...these are 3 different gods and god the father is the one that is worshipped. worship of God through Jesus christ but the lds church does not teach worship of all three, only of God the father so to say that the lds church worships all 3 is incorrect. The mainstream christian community worships all three because we believe they are one God, not just one in purpose but actually one God. This is different from the lds form of worship...I think it is sometimes hard to explain things from either side because while LDS and Christians often use the same terminology, the meanings behind it is very different within the 2 groups.
God Bless-
Grace
8 Now he that planteth and he that watereth are one: and every man shall receive his own reward according to his own labour. (1 Corinthians3:8)
11 And now I am no more in the world, but these are in the world, and I come to thee. Holy Father, keep through thine own name those whom thou hast given me, that they may be one, as we are. (John17:11)
It was stated by Joseph Smith to be "gospel doctrine". Did Joseph Smith not know what the gospel was? If he did not know what the Mormon gospel is, who does? I don't think that you can so easily suggest that it is not canonical. It is in harmony with D&C 132.arizona_sunshine said:Your statement does not take away from the possibility of equality with God. Furthner, as Lorenzo Snow and Joseph Smith and other pointed out, God was once a man who became a God, so presumably if that is held to be true, God once had to worship another God, and thus if God said the same as you, then there must be another God yet greater than the God which the Mormons claim to worship. Why would you worship only a lesser god?
This can be deduced, yes. It, however, remains speculative because it has not been canonized. It is not important to our salvation.
If God supposedly "caught" up, then what makes you different? Another Mormon on here told me that the only difference between Adam and God was knowledge, so learn a lot and you become God, according to that Mormon. And that is in concert with the Lorenzo Snow doctrine.The point remains: we're never going to "catch up." He'll always be ahead of us---worthy of our worship.
A difference...I am not God nor was my father or grandfather.As far as Him being a lesser God... you have a grandfather. Does that make your father any less to you? Does that mean your grandfather is really responsible for your birth, and more worthy of your affections than your father? Then again, I mean... you have a great grandfather...
I did not ask that...I ask how many gods that you worship. Please answer the question.Second question - how many gods do you worship?
One Godhead: God the Father, Christ His son and the Holy Ghost.
So do you therefore agree that there is nothing in the Bible which endorses the doctrine that men can become gods?Third, where is the Bible does it endorse the doctrine that man can become a god?
The LDS church does not hold its beliefs to the Bible only. We hold our beliefs accountable to revelation from God. In our beliefs, more has been revealed to the children of men than the Bible alone.
Tom, I sit here in amazement contemplating the real reason you keep driving at this point. Since our concept of God is very different than yours, you obviously believe that our God does not exist! Surly our doctrine is not suggesting that we can become as the God that you invision or know. So what in the world can you prove by arguing that we cannot become as something that you believe does not exist? What is your real purpose?Toms777 said:Your statement does not take away from the possibility of equality with God. Furthner, as Lorenzo Snow and Joseph Smith and other pointed out, God was once a man who became a God, so presumably if that is held to be true, God once had to worship another God, and thus if God said the same as you, then there must be another God yet greater than the God which the Mormons claim to worship. Why would you worship only a lesser god?
Second question - how many gods do you worship?
Third, where is the Bible does it endorse the doctrine that man can become a god?
I believe that your god does exist, but not as God or as a god. We do see in the Bible that there was one who sought to be as God and who promised that men could also be as god.MormonFriend said:Tom, I sit here in amazement contemplating the real reason you keep driving at this point. Since our concept of God is very different than yours, you obviously believe that our God does not exist! Surly our doctrine is not suggesting that we can become as the God that you invision or know. So what in the world can you prove by arguing that we cannot become as something that you believe does not exist? What is your real purpose?
Absolutely not! Somewhere a few days ago I illustrated. I'll summarize.Toms777 said:So do you therefore agree that there is nothing in the Bible which endorses the doctrine that men can become gods?
MormonFriend said:Interpret these how you may.
Actually none of the things that you mentioned say anything about becoming gods, even though a few are NOT in the Bible. For example:MormonFriend said:Absolutely not! Somewhere a few days ago I illustrated. I'll summarize.
1. We were created in His Image.
2. We were created in His Likeness.
3. We became as God, knowing good and evil.
4. God is perfect. He commanded us to become perfect.
5. I am His son, what does that make me?
6. Immortality is provided through Jesus Christ.
7. Knowledge of the mysteries of Godliness are given to men who are worthy to receive that revelation.
8. God gives men the right to use His power by way of His Priesthood. Peter walked on water until his faith faltered. The apostles healed and raised the dead. etc.
9. God has shared His power with us to create life, and has given us agency to choose not to take life. (Is there any wonder why these two sins of misusing these powers are numbers 1 & 2 on His list of the worst sins. (Apart from denying the Holy Ghost)
happyinhisgrace said:Mormon Friend...well to find the meaning in them, one must first read in context which mean not just one verse of proof texting but rather the verse right before and after it so lets see what exactly IS the message of this first verse...
1 Corinthians 3:1-15 (8 being the one you pointed out)
3And I, brethren, could not speak to you as to spiritual people but as to carnal, as to babes in Christ.
2 I fed you with milk and not with solid food; for until now you were not able to receive it, and even now you are still not able;
3 for you are still carnal. For where there are envy, strife, and divisions among you, are you not carnal and behaving like mere men?
FB: Paul teaches that not all the truth can be taught to members of the church because they would not be able to digest it. Thus the reference to being fed milk first. This is, of course why LDS missionaries teach investigators the basics of the gospel. People who are sincere, ask the source of all truth to confirm what they are being taught, and this begins the growth of a testimony.
4 For when one says, "I am of Paul," and another, "I am of Apollos," are you not carnal?
5 Who then is Paul, and who is Apollos, but ministers through whom you believed, as the Lord gave to each one?
6 I planted, Apollos watered, but God gave the increase.
7 So then neither he who plants is anything, nor he who waters, but God who gives the increase.
8 Now he who plants and he who waters are one, and each one will receive his own reward according to his own labor.
FB: This means to me that those who work to build Gods kingdom will have rewards according to their efforts. Sort of does away with any claim that faith alone without works is a misunderstanding.
9 For we are God's fellow workers; you are God's field, you are God's building. 10 According to the grace of God which was given to me, as a wise master builder I have laid the foundation, and another builds on it. But let each one take heed how he builds on it.
11 For no other foundation can anyone lay than that which is laid, which is Jesus Christ.
12 Now if anyone builds on this foundation with gold, silver, precious stones, wood, hay, straw,
13 each one's work will become clear; for the Day will declare it, because it will be revealed by fire; and the fire will test each one's work, of what sort it is.
14 If anyone's work which he has built on it endures, he will receive a reward. 15 If anyone's work is burned, he will suffer loss; but he himself will be saved, yet so as through fire.
FB: This is pretty clear to me that those who work for the wrong things will be burned, but those who "WORK" for God, will have a foundation that will endure.
Ok, so clearly this passage of scripture is referring to people putting building their "works" on wordly things rather than on the foundation of Christ and it does not matter what "minister" or "devision" of the church you subcribe to, what matters is what your foundation for your works is. Verse 8 read in conjunction with the previous verses and the following verses clearly points out that it does not matter if you are planting seeds in Christ or watering them...are all one in the service they are doing for Jesus in spreading his word.
The verse you pointed out has nothing to do with God and the father being one in "purpose" but rather speaks of believers of God being one in the purpose of spreading the good news of Christ. Those chapters don't even take any "interpertation" they are very self-explanitory.
Now, on to the next verse you posted will be in a following post
God Bless-
Grace
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