Pork

[aleph-bet]

I know that G-d said in the Torah not to eat pork, but I was wondering, does anyone really know why? What if it was organic? What about shellfish too? What if they where only fed good food and were organic?

 

[insaneinthebrain]

I'll leave the first part of your question to someone else, but as for this:

What if it was organic? What about shellfish too? What if they where only feed good food and were organic?

God said not to, and that should be good enough. Trying to figure out why he said "no" so that we can find a way around it essentially has us putting ourselves above God, and that really isn't a good place to be.

 

[Wags]

I know that G-d said in the Torah not to eat pork, but I was wondering, does anyone really know why? What if it was organic? What about shellfish too? What if they where only fed good food and were organic?

Well since shellfish don't have fins or scales it is unclean as well. What an animal is fed doesn't matter either, what matters is what God said we are not to do. Why he said it, isn't important - HE said it.

 

[Bon]

I know that G-d said in the Torah not to eat pork, but I was wondering, does anyone really know why? What if it was organic? What about shellfish too? What if they where only fed good food and were organic?

At the time God said not to eat these foods they were organic.


http://home1.gte.net/res063uz/pork.htm

Shalom from Bon

 

[Yhudah]

aleph-bet wrote:

I know that G-d said in the Torah not to eat pork, but I was wondering, does anyone really know why?

What if it was organic? What about shellfish too? What if they where only fed good food and were organic?

My Response:

The purpose of the deity food regulations under the Law of Moses was only for reasons, that it was part of God's plan to make Jewish people peculiar, to be different that's all.

Under the Law of Moses, Jews were forbidden a lot of things, but we are not under the Law of Moses, we are under the Law of Christ.

Moreover, in 1 Timothy 4:4-5 (NJK) Paul said,

For every creature of God is good, and nothing is to be refused if it is received thanksgiving;
for it is to be sanctified by the word of God and prayer.

The reason Paul said this in his letter to his spiritual son Timothy, likely may had been because there were false teachers claiming that some foods should be avoided because they defiled the person.

 

[Henaynei]

Well since shellfish don't have fins or scales it is unclean as well. What an animal is fed doesn't matter either, what matters is what God said we are not to do. Why he said it, isn't important - HE said it.

That is true!! If you knew what chicken really eat you'd figure they must be unclean, but they are not They are kosher

 

[Henaynei]

the only reason HaShem gave for what He gave us as food is to separate us and sanctify us and set us apart unto Him as Holy..... That is reason good enough for me

 

[Wags]

Under the Law of Moses, Jews were forbidden a lot of things, but we are not longer under the Law of Moses, we are under the Law of Christ.

Law of Christ?

Yeshua said that he had not come to do away with Torah! So if it appears that any of his disciples are contridicting Torah then they are wrong or more likely we are reading them out of context.

 

[jgonz]

I read somewhere a long time ago that there are good medical reasons for avoiding pork and shellfish especially. Apparently, not only do they have to be cooked _really_ well or you can get food poisoning, they are Extremely high in cholesterol.

 

[yod]

Pigs don't have sweat glands. They don't process food and eliminate it like most animals. When you eat a piece of ham, your body recognizes it almost like a cancer and begins to "fight" to digest it. This uses a LOT of your body's resources which can drain your body's ability to fight off other health threats or diseases. It can literally make you tired all the time.

I believe that all animals mentioned in the Levitical prohibition are scavengers. In other words, they eat the refuse off of the planet as God's "vacuum cleaners". Interestingly enough, these animals have digestive systems that absorb this refuse right into their flesh instead of "going into the draught" like other animals who pass these impurities in their stool.

A cow has 7 stomachs. They chew, regurgitate, chew some more....well...you get the picture?

But a pig or a vulture or a catfish or a shrimp will eat anything and it gets absorbed into them almost instantly.

However, even ordinarily "clean" animals can become "unclean" by how they are butchered. I doubt we have a dozen meat processing companies in America that are kosher in the way they slaughter cattle or chicken....but in Israel only a rabbi can be a butcher.



Here's a good example of how eating a scavenger can harm you;

If there is ever a nuclear holocaust, only the totally kosher person will survive because all non-kosher animals will carry radioactivity in their flesh.

 

[Bon]

"Unclean" animals have a different digestive system to "Clean" animals.

Many animals Yahuweh declares to be healthy for consumption take a minimum of 12 hours for the food they eat to be utilized by their systems; and that during this process all the toxins that are poisonous to human consumption are filtered out of their systems within that time?

But with the pig, and other unclean animals, a maximum of 4 hours, from which all toxins are not eliminated, is not uncommon.



I saw a documentary a few years ago where they used mussels to test the toxicity of a particular area of the ocean.

Their flesh absorbed any toxins in the water and scientists were able to confirm toxin levels in the water when their flesh was tested.


Here is an article worthy of your time if you wish to know more.

http://www.tntrevealed.org/radioshow.cfm?c=6&l=17

How One Scientist Views Unclean Meats
(from Health Guide for Survival by Salem Kirban.)

In Leviticus 11 and Deuteronomy 14 are guidelines telling us what foods we should avoid. The swine, or hog, is referred to in Leviticus 11.

And the swine, though he divide the hoof, and be clovenfooted, yet he cheweth not the cud; he is unclean to you.

Our Creator, when He gave us bodies, gave us bodies that balanced out the body chemistry. He created energy out of anions and cations.

In reading this, some will say "Yes, but these instructions were just for the people of Israel in Old Testament times. We now have the liberty to eat pork."

But, in reality, your gastric juices, your body chemistry, is no different than those of the Israelites of some 4,000 years ago!

While we are living in the dispensation of Grace . . . this had to do with our spiritual life. Our human digestive tract has not changed!

Just because today’s hogs are raised on grains and in hog parlors under antiseptic conditions . . . the hog still presents digestive problems.

Dr. Carey Reams, a biochemist, did seven years of research before he found the answer . . . yet it was not the research that helped him find the answer to why we were better off obeying the instructions of Leviticus 11 and Deuteronomy 14.

Dr. Reams first discovered that the calories in beef, pork, fish or anything else per gram of lean meat are almost the same. There is very little difference here.

Dr Reams came upon this fact quite unexpectedly. He had a client who was told that he had less than a year to live. As an agricultural engineer, Dr. Reams serviced his orange grove and cattle farms.

This client told Dr. Reams: "You’ve got to help me. Medicine has failed." Dr. Reams gave him a gram scale and told him: "I don’t care what you eat. I want you to mark down exactly what you eat on the gram scale and come in for a saliva and urine test every day at 2 o’clock."

Through his tests, Dr. Reams came up with the unusual information that every day this client ate the unclean meats . . . down went the energy level! And every day that he did not eat unclean meats . . . the energy level began to climb.

Dr. Reams began eliminating certain foods from his diet . . . one by one . . . and to Dr. Reams’ knowledge this man is still living today!

What Dr. Reams discovered is that such unclean meats as hogs, shrimp, lobsters, clams, oysters and catfish (along with many others) produce very high energy levels. But the problem is that they expend these high energy levels very quickly!

Dr. Reams emphasizes: "You must have a time limit on it. In other words, the unclean meats digest in a period of 3 hours. The clean meats require about 18 hours. What this means is that the energy in pork and other unclean meats in released in 3 hours instead of 18."

Why would it be bad for these meats to digest so quickly . . . in 3 hours?

It is bad because, according to Dr. Reams’ thinking,

It’s like putting high test gasoline, such as aviation fuel, in a motor that’s not built for it!

With the way we live today, such quick energy tends to burn out our system . . . causing many physical problems.

We may eat these high energy meats for years and appear seemingly healthy, but this continued abuse of our body one day surfaces into a serious terminal disease!

Dr. Reams found that even people who do hard work such as construction workers and farmers, in many cases, come in to see him with serious problems . . . even though they expend a great deal of energy in their work. He states that even some people 30 and 35 years of age look like they are 70 or 75 because of indiscretionary eating habits.

He adds,

We take these people off the unclean meats, teach them what to eat and in 6 months they look younger than their years!

How many people today are eating "minus" foods which may eventually lead them to an early grave? —by Salem Kirban

Shalom from Bon

 

[Bruce101]

For every creature of God is good, and nothing is to be refused if it is received thanksgiving;
for it is to be sanctified by the word of God and prayer.

I would disagree with the accepted interpretation of the above verse. No matter how much I pray and bless pork, it is still not healthy food. FAT FAT FAT!

Shellfish, CANCER CANCER CANCER!

Bruce (just being real)

 

[Yhudah]

Wags wrote:

Yeshua said that he had not come to do away with Torah!

So if it appears that any of his disciples are contradicting Torah then they are wrong or more likely we are reading them out of context.


My Response:

Sorry, perhaps you had misunderstood my post.

Sanctifcation is not accomplished by a natural food diet, that's really the point I was trying to make.

Sanctification is accomplished as people surrender their lives to God through Christ.

It progresses as we remain faithful and in union with God through Christ.

The dietary laws may afford good health, but that's not what I was talking about, but they will never enhance the spiritual walk of believers. That's the point I was trying to make.

If someone were to ask me, if it's okay to keep kosher (say KO-sher) (which means "fit" or "proper": can be used of food, clothes, business), but in this case I use it in reference to food.


I would say, yes, but only if in doing so we don't make for a spiritual law out of it, and to believe that it will inhence our spirituality, for reasons of what natural foods we chose to eat (or not eat).


If we make for a spiritual law out of what we chose to eat (or not eat), that will take us to the ditch into error, and in spiritual bondage.


Moreover, in doing that we will have devalued or denied what Christ's bloody sacrifical atoning death had accomplished for us.


If we don't want to eat pork, we are perfectly free not to eat it, just don't make for a spiritual law out of not eating it, is what I am saying.(smiling)

 

[aleph-bet]

Todah for the info. It helps alot when trying to explain it to a small child. I've had that question asked so many times by children to me, and even though I knew what Torah said, and what I believed, I still couldn't give a great example for children to undertand. Todah again.

 

[Wags]

Wags wrote:

Yeshua said that he had not come to do away with Torah!

So if it appears that any of his disciples are contradicting Torah then they are wrong or more likely we are reading them out of context.


My Response:

Sorry, perhaps you had misunderstood my post.

Sanctifcation is not accomplished by a natural food diet, that's really the point I was trying to make.

Sanctification is accomplished as people surrender their lives to God through Christ.

It progresses as we remain faithful and in union with God through Christ.

The dietary laws may afford good health, but that's not what I was talking about, but they will never enhance the spiritual walk of believers. That's the point I was trying to make.

If someone were to ask me, if it's okay to keep kosher (say KO-sher) (which means "fit" or "proper": can be used of food, clothes, business), but in this case I use it in reference to food.


I would say, yes, but only if in doing so we don't make for a spiritual law out of it, and to believe that it will inhence our spirituality, for reasons of what natural foods we chose to eat (or not eat).


If we make for a spiritual law out of what we chose to eat (or not eat), that will take us to the ditch into error, and in spiritual bondage.


Moreover, in doing that we will have devalued or denied what Christ's bloody sacrifical atoning death had accomplished for us.


If we don't want to eat pork, we are perfectly free not to eat it, just don't make for a spiritual law out of not eating it, is what I am saying.(smiling)

The Holy One, blessed be He, made the law. Keeping Torah is what He expects from His children as the proper response to His having saved them. We are to walk as Yeshua walked, and he kept Torah. (If he didn't keep it then he would not have been Messiah.)

 

[Wags]

Here's a good example of how eating a scavenger can harm you;

If there is ever a nuclear holocaust, only the totally kosher person will survive because all non-kosher animals will carry radioactivity in their flesh.

Hey the Vegetarian will survive too!

 

[Sephania]

Pigs don't have sweat glands. They don't process food and eliminate it like most animals. When you eat a piece of ham, your body recognizes it almost like a cancer and begins to "fight" to digest it. This uses a LOT of your body's resources which can drain your body's ability to fight off other health threats or diseases. It can literally make you tired all the time.

I believe that all animals mentioned in the Levitical prohibition are scavengers. In other words, they eat the refuse off of the planet as God's "vacuum cleaners". Interestingly enough, these animals have digestive systems that absorb this refuse right into their flesh instead of "going into the draught" like other animals who pass these impurities in their stool.

A cow has 7 stomachs. They chew, regurgitate, chew some more....well...you get the picture?

But a pig or a vulture or a catfish or a shrimp will eat anything and it gets absorbed into them almost instantly.

However, even ordinarily "clean" animals can become "unclean" by how they are butchered. I doubt we have a dozen meat processing companies in America that are kosher in the way they slaughter cattle or chicken....but in Israel only a rabbi can be a butcher.



Here's a good example of how eating a scavenger can harm you;

If there is ever a nuclear holocaust, only the totally kosher person will survive because all non-kosher animals will carry radioactivity in their flesh.

Would someone kindly confirm for me that the name at the top of this post it "YOD"?
***blinks****blinks some more******** ********** *******

 

[Yhudah]

aleph-bet wrote:

Todah for the info.

It helps alot when trying to explain it to a small child.

I've had that question asked so many times by children to me, and even though I knew what Torah said, and what I believed, I still couldn't give a great example for children to undertand.

Todah again.


My Response:

Todah Aleph-Bet!

You are too kind.

The Mashiach filled the law, and for that we say, "Amein."

Shalom aleikhem!

 

[yod]

Would someone kindly confirm for me that the name at the top of this post it "YOD"?
***blinks****blinks some more******** ********** *******

ROFLOL


Why do you act so surprised??


I can't deny the Truth. The Spirit of the Levitical law lives forever. Unclean food is not meant for human consumption and one is taking a health risk to violate them

There was a penalty for violating this ordinance long ago in the nation of Israel just like you can't carry a pair of wire cutters in your backpocket if you live in Texas (cattle-thieving).

They are both outdated "legal" concepts. If you carry wire cutters in your back pocket now it will just be uncomfortable to sit down. The spirit of that law is fulfilled if you don't steal cattle with them.

The Spirit of the levitical law is fulfilled when one is IN Messiah, a Priest higher than Aaron and the Levites who has entered the Holy of Holies in our stead.

Maybe that would be a good thread topic? What does "in" Messiah mean to you? Is it a laundry list of "dos" and "don'ts" ?

I gotta travel today. Anyone want to start that fire for me?


(btw....I need to point out that Yhudah is not the person I thought he was in another thread. He does not attend Ari Sorko Rams congregation nor has he ever lived in Israel. He does live in Texas though so that has to count for something!??! GO COWBOYS!)

 

[Yhudah]

Yod wrote:

The Spirit of the levitical law is fulfilled when one is IN Messiah, a Priest higher than Aaron and the Levites who has entered the Holy of Holies in our stead.

Maybe that would be a good thread topic?

What does "in" Messiah mean to you?

Is it a laundry list of "dos" and "don'ts" ?

I gotta travel today. Anyone want to start that fire for me?


My Response:

Zol ich azoi vissen fun tzores is Yiddish for "I should so know from trouble as I know about this." (smiling)

Someone I had known once who I had considered to be a great Bible teacher, told me that he had given a lecture once on something near being the same topic as you suggest.

He told me that he had begun his lecture by saying,

"Christianity, is not a set of rules, it is being led by the Holy Spirit."

Moreover, he said that when he said that before having given explanation, by the looks on peoples faces. You would have thought he had said that God was dead. (smiling)

But of course, there are rules, and I know you aren't saying there aren't, and neither was he in having said that either.

Of course, we know we aren't brought into salvation by the Holy Spirit through Christ, and reconciled to God to practice lawlessness.

In fact, if we fully understood the new covenant, we would know that God requires even more of us under the new covenant, than He ever did under the old covenant and under the Law of Moses.

But I don't think many have really come to have realized that.

Any way, I wish you well, and have a safe and good trip!



Yod write:

I need to point out that Yhudah is not the person I thought he was in another thread.

He does not attend Ari Sorko Rams congregation nor has he ever lived in Israel.


My Response:

Yes, I read that on posted on another thread, and it make me smile.

However, I do know of that congregation "Glory of Jesus," in Israel, and have always been in agreement with Ari & Shira-Ram's ministry.

They are one of the early pioneers of the Messianic Jewish Movement, and they have served in ministry in Israel now for more than 30 years.

Of course, Ari is Jewish, but his wife Shira is a Gentile, she's Lindsay's daughter of "CHRIST FOR THE NATIONS INC" here in Dallas, did you ever realize that?


Yod wrote:

He does live in Texas though so that has to count for something!??!

GO COWBOYS!


My Response:

I know that's right! LOL.

You can just call me the al' round Jewish Christian Cowboy, if you like.

(Smiling)


Shalom.