"Poorly" designed eye can be used to test quantum mechanics

[SkyWriting]

You do know that a river ISN'T alive, right?

It is subject to natural properties that encourage it's growth and health.

I continue to ask: What natural properties encourage the formation of life from non-living material? What is the reason for life?

 

[AnotherAtheist]

You do know that a river ISN'T alive, right?

I do agree with what you're saying, but it is exceptionally easy to use language which literally (if not by intention) assigns agency to non-agents. Such as rivers.

 

[AnotherAtheist]

I continue to ask: What natural properties encourage the formation of life from non-living material? What is the reason for life?

Why do there need to be natural properties that encourage the formation of life? Providing that there isn't anything stopping the formation of life (e.g. temperature out of range, lack of water), then why wouldn't it be the default that life just happens?

So, the reason for life could be (and appears to be) that there simply wasn't anything to stop it happening.

EDIT: Or, if you want things on the positive side: then a supply of the necessary and sufficient chemical pre-cursors, and a suitable environment.

 

[SkyWriting]

Why do there need to be natural properties that encourage the formation of life?

Cause and effect. Nothing happens without a cause. Back to the question please.

Unless you are advocating for supernatural causes?

 

[Warden_of_the_Storm]

It is subject to natural properties that encourage it's growth and health.

I continue to ask: What natural properties encourage the formation of life from non-living material? What is the reason for life?

... but a river is a non-living entity. It isn't alive.

 

[xianghua]

This blog entry (not written by me) sums up what I think of the human eye quite well. https://thehumanevolutionblog.com/2015/01/12/the-poor-design-of-the-human-eye/ The human eye is a clunky design that evolution has refined into something that works well.

lets see. from your link:

"In the US and Europe, 30-40% of the population have myopia"

and then he says: "The defect in the myopic eye is not caused by injury or overuse: it is simply too long".


but its actually the result of bad mutations and not of the original design:

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Near-sightedness

"defects in the control of these structural proteins might be the actual cause of myopia"

so its just a degeneration rather than "bad design".


he continue:


"One of the all-time most famous examples of quirky designs in nature is the vertebrate retina. The photoreceptor cells of the retina appear to be placed backward,"

but as we already seen- this is just wrong:

https://phys.org/news/2014-07-fiber-optic-pipes-retina-simple.html

"Having the photoreceptors at the back of the retina is not a design constraint, it is a design feature. The idea that the vertebrate eye, like a traditional front-illuminated camera, might have been improved somehow if it had only been able to orient its wiring behind the photoreceptor layer, like a cephalopod, is folly"

or:

Phys. Rev. Lett. 104, 158102 (2010) - Retinal Glial Cells Enhance Human Vision Acuity

"The retina is revealed as an optimal structure designed for improving the sharpness of images"

or:

Evolution gave flawed eye better vision

"IT LOOKS wrong, but the strange, “backwards” structure of the vertebrate retina actually improves vision"

 

[SkyWriting]

Or, if you want things on the positive side: then a supply of the necessary and sufficient chemical pre-cursors, and a suitable environment.

Super. Now what forces propel life to form under those conditions? Chemically, thermally, electrically or any other force....why?

 

[Warden_of_the_Storm]

Super. Now what forces propel life to form under those conditions? Chemically, thermally, electrically or any other force....why?

You're asking two completely different questions there.

 

[Speedwell]

Super. Now what forces propel life to form under those conditions? Chemically, thermally, electrically or any other force....why?

The same kinetic and thermodynamic forces which drive any chemical reaction.

 

[SkyWriting]

The same kinetic and thermodynamic forces which drive any chemical reaction.

Those can be documented and put in a formula....go ahead.

Rock plus acid plus sunshine = Life.

It that the one?

 

[SkyWriting]

You're asking two completely different questions there.

Go ahead. I'm listening. For what reasons does life form?
I didn't mean to stump you.
If you need some examples of life I'll look around
and see if I can find one. A good answer would be one clue it exists.

 

[Speedwell]

Those can be documented and put in a formula....go ahead.

Rock plus acid plus sunshine = Life.

It that the one?

No, it's more like molecule A combines with molecule B to form molecule D rather than E or F because of the local thermodynamic conditions plus the energy to overcome any kinetic barriers.

 

[SkyWriting]

No, it's more like molecule A combines with molecule B to form molecule D rather than E or F because of the local thermodynamic conditions plus the energy to overcome any kinetic barriers.

That's a valid theory for life?
Have you published it yet?
Did anybody beat you to the punch?

 

[Warden_of_the_Storm]

Go ahead. I'm listening. For what reasons does life form?
I didn't mean to stump you.
If you need some examples of life I'll look around
and see if I can find one. A good answer would be one clue it exists.

You didn't stump me, you just switched questions in the middle of a sentence from 'what' to 'why'.
And as for the reason why life formed... it just did.
And next time, please drop the condescending attitude. I'm pretty sure that the Bible does say that a Christian shouldn't act in such a manner.

 

[Speedwell]

That's a valid theory for life?
Have you published it yet?

LOL! No need--there are plenty of actual biochemists who have. Granted, there is no coherent theory of abiogenesis as of yet, but whenever we find life, it is as an emergent property of complex biochemistry, and biochemistry obeys the same laws as any other branch of chemistry.

 

[SkyWriting]

LOL! No need--there are plenty of actual biochemists who have. Granted, there is no coherent theory of abiogenesis as of yet, but whenever we find life, it is as an emergent property of complex biochemistry, and biochemistry obeys the same laws as any other branch of chemistry.

Which ones promote the formation of life and why?

It's a trick question. Nobody has been able to answer it yet.

 

[SkyWriting]

You didn't stump me, you just switched questions in the middle of a sentence from 'what' to 'why'.
And as for the reason why life formed... it just did.
And next time, please drop the condescending attitude. I'm pretty sure that the Bible does say that a Christian shouldn't act in such a manner.

A very common dodge for the squeamish. WHY as in:
Why does the sun shine? Find out. | Space | EarthSky
Why does water evaporate at room temperature?
Why is the sky blue? :: NASA Space Place
Why Does Life Exist? - What Is a Genome and Why Do We Care





My attitude is: stop evading the question and grow up.

 

[Speedwell]

Which ones promote the formation of life and why?

It's a trick question. Nobody has been able to answer it yet.

Which ones what? Biochemical reactions proceed due to the same forces which drive any other chemical reaction. Why do hydrogen and oxygen combine to make water?

 

[Warden_of_the_Storm]

A very common dodge for the squeamish. WHY as in:
Why does the sun shine? Find out. | Space | EarthSky
Why does water evaporate at room temperature?

My attitude is: stop evading the question.

It's not a dodge. It's a honest answer from me. I'm not Stephen Hawking, and I'm not going to pretend I am.
But it would be brilliant if you would stop pretending that you're intellectually superior to everyone and drop the haughty attitude when you have never once shown any hint of scientific knowledge on any topic you enter in to.

 

[SkyWriting]

And as for the reason why life formed... it just did.

I SEE it did. Why did it?
Corrosion resistance
Hygroscopy
pH
Reactivity
Specific internal surface area
Surface energy
Surface tension
Electrical properties
Capacitance
Dielectric constant
Dielectric strength
Electrical resistivity and conductivity
Permittivity
Piezoelectric constants
Seebeck coefficient

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_materials_properties