Politics and a cohesive Orthodox worldview

-Sasha-

Handmaid of God
Apr 12, 2019
382
472
Midwest
✟27,318.00
Country
United States
Faith
Eastern Orthodox
Marital Status
Married
When I first came to Orthodoxy, I was deeply invested in political issues. I spent much of my time reading, worrying, and debating about politics. After a little while my worldview became "divided", segmented. "Here are the political things, here are the Orthodox things...if there be some overlap, good...if there be some contradictions, well I'll just keep the two separate in their respective spheres." became my approach. However, it turns out that for most people, holding two mutually exclusive ideas at once isn't something we are comfortable with for long, and so a tension builds up; the two things must either be reconciled, or something must be discarded.

Politics were very dear to me; I wanted to keep them. But this tension prompted inquiries: "How ought I approach politics? Is it wrong for me to devote so much time and effort to them? etc." which was met with what I viewed at the time as a non-answer: "Don't worry about it. Just keep coming to Church. It will work itself out in time." Nonsense, I thought...and yet... as time passed, I found myself reading fewer news items. I found myself less interested in defending political positions or preferred politicians. I found myself less inclined to argue when I came across an opinion I didn't agree with, or becoming outraged about it. It all happened very naturally, without force. As if suddenly, I realized the tension was gone and that something new had taken its place. Around that time I stumbled across a post by Fr. Stephen Freeman which provided a perspective that I wouldn't have considered before, let alone accepted:

"Our warfare is not the earthly form that appears in the merely political realm. Our true warfare is to intercede as Daniel did through every means given to us.

An important insight within all of this is that what we ourselves see is not the full extent of the story. Human history is not entirely human. When Pilate questions Christ, he assumes that he is a key player in a human drama. But the true drama is being acted out in the heavens. The entire cosmos surrounds what happens on Golgotha. Our daily lives are no less intertwined in the business of the heavens.

This unmasks the foolishness of modern thought. We have reduced our world to the merely secular, presuming that we ourselves are the driving force of history and that the outcome of things is in our hands. The Church, however, has its “citizenship” in heaven (Phil. 3:20). Actions that might seem out-of-the-way in the light of secular history have more to do with reality than is realized. The offering of the Bloodless Sacrifice at the altar in even the smallest congregation carries more eternal weight in heaven than all the votes cast by men. The outcome of history in Sodom and Gomorrah turned on the possible presence of but ten righteous persons.

We should remember to live lives that matter. Pray. Forgive. Repent. Intercede. Confess. Commune. The Lord sustains the universe through the prayers of the faithful."

(See here https://blogs.ancientfaith.com/glor...07/09/politics-and-the-princes-of-this-world/ for the full posting.)
 

FenderTL5

Κύριε, ἐλέησον.
Site Supporter
Jun 13, 2016
5,085
5,960
Nashville TN
✟635,056.00
Country
United States
Faith
Eastern Orthodox
Marital Status
Married
Politics
US-American-Solidarity
speaking only as an individual member of the laity:

You count me as one that thinks that no party, especially Republican or Democrat, holds a platform that a Christian can really, fully, support. I cannot support: torture, oppression, greed, exploitation, blatant immorality.
I am not a single issue voter. I consider myself thoroughly pro-life, which for me includes the issues of abortion, capital punishment and euthanasia, but also overlaps into issues of poverty, health-care, war, guns, immigration, and protection of minorities. I try to look at every issue through the lens of life being sacred, all of it.
On the issue of social programs, I tend to favor an attitude of we are all in this together over that of every man for himself.
I try to be consistent but the current political make-up is inconsistent and often hypocritical. So, determining who to support is often a challenge.

imho, ymmv, and in no way suggesting to speak for the Church at large.
 
Upvote 0

-Sasha-

Handmaid of God
Apr 12, 2019
382
472
Midwest
✟27,318.00
Country
United States
Faith
Eastern Orthodox
Marital Status
Married
the current political make-up is inconsistent and often hypocritical.
Indeed!
So, determining who to support is often a challenge.
"He didn't belong to any political party - he was above parties. He disapproved of godless political parties and politicians because of their atheism and their polemics against the Church. 'If a hand won't make the sign of the cross,' he said, 'Who cares if it is a left hand or a right hand? What am I going to do with it?' If a politician was godless, the elder didn't care what his positions were." From "Elder Paisios of Mount Athos" written by Hieromonk Isaac
 
Upvote 0

mark kennedy

Natura non facit saltum
Site Supporter
Mar 16, 2004
22,024
7,364
60
Indianapolis, IN
✟549,630.00
Faith
Calvinist
Marital Status
Single
Politics
US-Democrat
Strangely the church doesn't speak often to political issues, occasionally. The right to life thing is one exception and of course there are civil matters that are addressed from time to time. It's been my experience that clerical voices kind of ignore the banter of political issues, since they are busy with other things like the spiritual welfare of the church.
 
Upvote 0

-Sasha-

Handmaid of God
Apr 12, 2019
382
472
Midwest
✟27,318.00
Country
United States
Faith
Eastern Orthodox
Marital Status
Married
Strangely the church doesn't speak often to political issues
they are busy with other things like the spiritual welfare of the church
Yes, this is true generally speaking. I wonder if it's not meant to provide, through living example, a guide on how we ought to individually approach the whole thing.
 
Upvote 0

mark kennedy

Natura non facit saltum
Site Supporter
Mar 16, 2004
22,024
7,364
60
Indianapolis, IN
✟549,630.00
Faith
Calvinist
Marital Status
Single
Politics
US-Democrat
Yes, this is true generally speaking. I wonder if it's not meant to provide, through living example, a guide on how we ought to individually approach the whole thing.
Well yea, of course. The church has always tried to be a moral influence on the society around it, that almost goes without saying. I've just noticed that most clerics, if that's the right term, are a bit busy with pastoral issues to bother themselves with politics. Perhaps that is just perception.
 
Upvote 0

FenderTL5

Κύριε, ἐλέησον.
Site Supporter
Jun 13, 2016
5,085
5,960
Nashville TN
✟635,056.00
Country
United States
Faith
Eastern Orthodox
Marital Status
Married
Politics
US-American-Solidarity
It's been my experience that clerical voices kind of ignore the banter of political issues, since they are busy with other things like the spiritual welfare of the church.
In my parish, my experience is the same - to which I consider that to be a great blessing.

That's quite a contrast to the congregation I attended prior to Orthodoxy.
 
Upvote 0

mark kennedy

Natura non facit saltum
Site Supporter
Mar 16, 2004
22,024
7,364
60
Indianapolis, IN
✟549,630.00
Faith
Calvinist
Marital Status
Single
Politics
US-Democrat
In my parish, my experience is the same - to which I consider that to be a great blessing.

That's quite a contrast to the congregation I attended prior to Orthodoxy.
I hate it when the church gets involved in politics but I can see how a local parish might get involved in something, here and there, now and then. I just think clerics are more concerned with their congregations then what politicians are up to, I means seriously, should how the roads are being fixed be the topic of a sermon?
 
  • Agree
Reactions: FenderTL5
Upvote 0

yeshuaslavejeff

simple truth, martyr, disciple of Yahshua
Jan 6, 2005
39,944
11,098
okie
✟214,996.00
Faith
Anabaptist
Our true warfare is to intercede as Daniel did through every means given to us.
If I may ask in this section,
did Daniel use every means available to him ? From the Scriptural account, I thought not. Or did you mean "every means" that God says to do ? (not that man provides)
 
Upvote 0
This site stays free and accessible to all because of donations from people like you.
Consider making a one-time or monthly donation. We appreciate your support!
- Dan Doughty and Team Christian Forums

-Sasha-

Handmaid of God
Apr 12, 2019
382
472
Midwest
✟27,318.00
Country
United States
Faith
Eastern Orthodox
Marital Status
Married
If I may ask in this section,
did Daniel use every means available to him ? From the Scriptural account, I thought not. Or did you mean "every means" that God says to do ? (not that man provides)
I can't answer for the author of that quote, though I'm sure he would be willing to discuss it if you follow the link to his blog. From my understanding, he is stating that we have spiritual means we ought to be utilizing (especially prayer!) rather than depending only on our political means.
 
Upvote 0

MariaJLM

Crazy Cat Lady
Aug 1, 2018
1,117
1,475
33
Calgary
✟50,815.00
Country
Canada
Faith
Eastern Orthodox
Marital Status
Celibate
Politics
CA-Others
Before I converted I was a full-blown Marxist. As you can probably imagine that created all manner of issues, but fortunately over time I grew less interested in politics on my own as I matured in faith. I still hold to some core values, but for the most part I don't really do anything with them except get into the occasional argument online. I am mentally ill, suffering from PTSD, so I actually try to avoid political debates usually. They invoke negative emotions in me. One in particular, the shaming or victim blaming of the poor is actually one of the triggers for my PTSD.

I think it's natural for many of us to become less political when we come into the church. As the saying goes, we cannot serve both mammon and God. If we truly want to be Christians then we need to live for the Kingdom of Heaven. For me that seems to be a desire to simply just quit mainstream society as far too many things overwhelm me emotionally, thus making it difficult to function. (I'm overly sensitive to the suffering of others. I may even be an Empath to some extent.)
 
Upvote 0