Police shoot 13 year old who pulled BB gun

[Inkfingers]

No. I am saying I lack the data to make the determination that society is more coarse and the fact that we know humans tend to see the past as better then it was makes anecdotal data useless in determining this. Presenting me with more anecdotal data is not going to change that. I think you are doing the same thing every generation does where they proclaim that this new generation is not nearly as respectful. As I said, been going on for thousands of years.

It's been going on for thousands of years because it tends to go in cycles.

That you would deny that modern society is far more coarse than the 50s just boggles the mind; it takes quite serious denial to think the age that censored Elvis's pelvic thrusting was not less coarse than the one which gave us Miley naked on a wrecking ball and twerking.

I'll leave you to your denial, there is nothing more to be gained from discussing this except the opportunity to be baited (and I have no desire to be party to that).

 

[VanillaSunflowers]

We should be able to add our likes in multiples there Inkfingers. Very well said.

 

[Inkfingers]

Thank you Vanilla, that's kind of you to say so.

 

[Belk]

It's been going on for thousands of years because it tends to go in cycles.

Oh yes? How was that determined?

That you would deny that modern society is far more coarse than the 50s just boggles the mind; it takes quite serious denial to think the age that censored Elvis's pelvic thrusting was not less coarse than the one which gave us Miley naked on a wrecking ball and twerking.

You mean the same era in which African Americans were relegated to the back of the bus and terrorized for speaking out? This is why anecdotal evidence is of no use. For every example I could come up with an opposite.

I'll leave you to your denial, there is nothing more to be gained from discussing this except the opportunity to be baited (and I have no desire to be party to that).

I fail to see how having a discussion on the merits of data based societal evaluation is baiting. Have a pleasant day Inkfingers.

 

[RDKirk]

It is indeed many peoples perceptions. However these perceptions are based off anecdotal data not anything we have actually measured. Given the historical precedent of these pronouncements of disrespectful youth (Going back thousands of years) I find it much more likely that the issue is our perceptions, not things getting worse in reality.

Did I say "disrespectful youth?" I'm talking about adults.

But the USMC added a week to basic training to teach morality. I suspect they have some numbers.

 

[thecolorsblend]

You can ask the BLM movement what the problem is and you will get an earful.

I believe in the system that says someone is "Innocent until proven guilty." So blowing away perps, even caught in the act, is not acceptable.

Not acceptable to you. Me, I've got no real problem with that when the officer has good reason to believe his life is in danger... as was the case here.

So as a compromise, maybe some BLM activists can create a PSA advising people not to point weapons at officers. The way I envision it, the ads can be tested in limited markets to study the long term effects of not pointing weapons at officers.

Assuming the numbers of perps who get shot to death for pointing weapons at officers decreases in the areas where the PSA aired, nationwide broadcasts can be attempted.

If people understand the direct link between pointing weapons at officers and those officers blowing them away, we may be able to solve this problem rather quickly.

This "don't point weapons at officers" PSA idea has a lot of potential, I must admit.

 

[Belk]

Did I say "disrespectful youth?" I'm talking about adults.

But the USMC added a week to basic training to teach morality. I suspect they have some numbers.

That would be interesting to see. I would also be curious what is being measured in sociology circles.

 

[PreachersWife2004]

We used to run up and down in the street firing realistic look cap guns at each other, and no police constable ever considered those guns to be real or us to be a danger to ourselves or others.

What has changed? Society. Into a degenerate place where police are so often faced with violence that they have to treat a toy as potentially real because there are teenagers killing each other over drugs.

And they call this progress.

Well, to be fair, none of the more recent situations involving bb guns were like the scenario you've presented. We also played cops and robbers growing up, and "shot" each other quite frequently with our fake guns. None of our neighbprs (who we all knew by name) would've called the police, either.

What we've seen recently is one kid playing by himself, waving a gun around near and/or in a park, or kids having a pretend gun like it was a real gun (running with their homies with a gun in their waistband).

People don't know their neighbors anymore, and I'd be inclined to call police on a kid waving around a toy gun at or near a park myself. Unless I was carrying myself, I wouldn't feel overly comfortable walking up to them and casually asking if their gun is real. :O

Except we are trying to limit or eliminate those being shot by police.

Do you have a short-term strategy for THAT?

Maybe the people being shot could just do what they're told? Very few cases are cut and dry where the person shot wasn't doing anything wrong.

It just makes sense to me that, even without a uniform, if someone with a gun tells me to do something I'm probably better off doing it. Even if I was carrying and it wasn't a cop, how quickly can I draw on someone who is already drawn on me?

 

[RDKirk]

Well
Maybe the people being shot could just do what they're told? Very few cases are cut and dry where the person shot wasn't doing anything wrong.

It just makes sense to me that, even without a uniform, if someone with a gun tells me to do something I'm probably better off doing it. Even if I was carrying and it wasn't a cop, how quickly can I draw on someone who is already drawn on me?

How do you know for sure that a move you think is harmless won't be read by a nervous officer as "false?"

A number of years ago, I called the police after being hit by a hit-and-run driver. He literally got out of his car and ran away on foot. The police arrived, took some information from me. While chatting with them, I mentioned that "My cousin is a cop."

They immediately handcuffed and frisked me and tossed me into the car saying, "'Cop?' That's drug talk!"

After about thirty minutes, they let me go. But what the heck? Let me mention, too, that they had my military ID in hand. That's precisely the kind of thing that convinced the entire community that the police are not there to protect their neighborhood, but to occupy it.

 

[PreachersWife2004]

How do you know for sure that a move you think is harmless won't be read by a nervous officer as "false?"

A number of years ago, I called the police after being hit by a hit-and-run driver. He literally got out of his car and ran away on foot. The police arrived, took some information from me. While chatting with them, I mentioned that "My cousin is a cop."

They immediately handcuffed and frisked me and tossed me into the car saying, "'Cop?' That's drug talk!"

After about thirty minutes, they let me go. But what the heck? Let me mention, too, that they had my military ID in hand. That's precisely the kind of thing that convinced the entire community that the police are not there to protect their neighborhood, but to occupy it.

Sorry, I'm highly skeptical of this story. Nothing against you personally, because I'd have a hard time believing anyone telling this story, but that's just too far-fetched.

And if it did happen in exactly that way (meaning there's no context here we're missing) then it would be quite the rarity, and not even close to what I'm addressing.

Most of these cop stops go exactly the way they're supposed to go. Why do you suppose that is?