Pastor leaves Adventism

[Moriah_Conquering_Wind]

Typical TSDA tactic. Throw out a blatant statement that clearly implies any other 'words' besides thier party line are not of God. Then, when they are called on it, they apologize and pretend they meant no such thing, when we all know what they really meant. Then they finish it off with the classic line : "Oh, I am so sorry my statement upset you, I guess you must be taking it personally since I didn't mention any names."

No actually, we just aren't that stupid we couldn't figure out that the SDA's you were directing it towards are the ones who disagree with your Conservative rhetoric.

Then, when all else fails, they resort to cheap shots that claim mere disgreements with thier positions equates to 'invectives'.

Cunningly, they manage to turn the whole thing around and you are now the offender and they are the innocent party.

Nope. Not going to work with me, sorry. Been there many times. Done that. Bought the T-shirt.

It ain't nothing new for me. Same old approach. Unfortunately, such spiritual abuse still has the potential to mentally and psychologically mess up those who are easily influenced and weak in the faith.

It's not just "TSDAs" who take this tactic. MANY Christians take it from/in their own bickerings. Attackers and spiritual abusers primarily.

Every time they do that, they create more power for Satan, IMO.

They do exactly what Satan wants. Why do you think they are all "chasing after" me?????????

 

[moicherie]

11 Tim 3:16 "Every scripture is God breathed given by inspiration and profitable for instruction for reproof and conviction of sin for correction of error and discipline in obedience and for training in righteousness to God's will in thought, purpose and action." Amplified

God Bless
Jim Larmore

Christians hymns are inspired imo but God did not compose the music or write the lyrics, try another text.

 

[sentipente]

Brother Jim, I just wanted to tell you that your PM really made my day. I thank God for this wonderful new friendship!

This just absolutely takes the cake. A messsage on a public board to tell someone that the PM that was sent was appreciated. Oh. Maybe the Reply button in PM was not working. My apologies. Such posturing.

 

[NightEternal]

Very true.

Unfortunately Senti, someone doesn't agree. The very same post you acknowledged as true has been reported as a flame.

But we who have a few years under our belts in the SDA church know better, don't we?

 

[TrustAndObey]

Oh brother.

 

[NightEternal]

Trust, I don't know what that's supposed to mean, but my experiences are valid. I have had it done to me and I have seen it done to others, many times. Maybe that has not been your experience, but I know what I have seen and experienced in the church.

No apology that ends in 'sorry if any nerves were tickled' is sincere. It only shows the individual meant to target a certain segment and has assumed he has been successful in attributing the proper guilt upon that segment.

I don't know why you can't see that, but Senti and Moriah certainly did.

I don't see any reports for Conklin's post when he rejected my apology on what he felt were valid grounds. Why is that?

 

[sentipente]

No, she did not--I have the page people point to and she didn't write it. I dealt with this whopper on a different forum.

She did say that meat will disappear from the diet of those who are preparing for translation. It used to be a runnig joke among us as kids. When someone told us we should not eat meat we would reply that we were not planning on being translated. For some people they felt that being translated was a step up. It did not dawn on them that whether one is translated is up to chance. HMS Richards cannot be translated no matter how much he may have wanted to.

 

[TrustAndObey]

Trust, I don't know what that's supposed to mean, but my experiences are valid. I have had it done to me and I have seen it done to others, many times. Maybe that has not been your experience, but I know what I have seen and experienced in the church.

No apology that ends in 'sorry if any nerves were tickled' is sincere. It only shows the individual meant to target a certain segment and has assumed he has been successful in attributing the proper guilt upon that segment.

I don't know why you can't see that, but Senti and Moriah certainly did.

I don't see any reports for Conklin's post when he rejected my apology on what he felt were valid grounds. Why is that?

Brother Night, I haven't even tried to keep it a secret that I love you and that while your behavior sometimes makes my jaw drop, I'm still totally intrigued by you.

I.E. I enjoy the thwackings as much as you do.

But when I PMd you and asked you to PLEASE apologize to brother DJ, you told me that you hadn't said anything wrong.

I don't know if you reconsidered before or after the mods asked you to edit your post or if what I said influenced you in any way, but you did eventually apologize.

Remember DJ's reaction to that apology? He said it wasn't sincere and you went OFF about that.

Scripture tells us that even if our brother comes to us SEVEN times in one day, that we should forgive them.

Obviously that means they weren't truly sorry the first time, the second time, etc etc.

I was very disappointed that DJ didn't accept your apology, and I'm very disappointed that you won't accept Jon's.

However, I have a feeling if you had been standing in front of brother DJ with a sincere apology, him being able to see your facial expressions etc, that he would have accepted the apology.

And I feel the same way about my little brother Jon.

It's impossible to truly "read" people on a message board.

It would just be nice to see more apologies and more acceptance OF those apologies.

Let's start that trend TOGETHER, shall we?

 

[Jimlarmore]

Anyone can throw up a whole string of Bible texts and claim 'this is what they mean'. This is the problem, and this is what Moriah was trying to tell you: It's you're interpretation of certain texts that we take issue with, as well as the arrogant claim that the way you have interpreted them is the only true one and has to be the conclusions we all come to. The Bible is of no private interpretation, therefore, someone else's take on what a text means is just as valid as yours.

Fine brother, I have no problem with what you have said. I could be wrong and I'll admit it if you can show me. My problem has been that we aren't even discussing actual scripture. You say anyone can throw up a bunch of scripture and make it say what they want it to. Your right but you know what when they do that those who are really versed in the Lord's word recognize immediately that they are taking things out of context to make the Bible say what they want.

The difference I see in the SDA church is that they take the Bible and research it for the truths it contains then comply with those teachings. Some folks take the Bible and find ways to make it fit what they want to believe.

That is why I personally don't cut and paste a whole slew of proof-texts to try and prove my position (and believe me, I could if I wanted to.

Usually, when that is the case it's because your position is really indefensible with real truths from the Bible. Clear thinking folks can understand and interpret God's word with no problem. When you say you have a different interpretation of the word than what it clearly says what you are really saying is you don't like what it says and refuse to accept the truth.

It used to always be my method of theological discussion for years.) More often than not, what it amounts to is you are merely reading into the verse what you want it to say, and you will only pick those which appear to support your position. Someone else may not even remotely see what you are seeing in a text.

The entire Bible is before you brother I won't throw a single verse out or discard one chapter , please provide texts that you feel dispute the fundamental beliefs of the sda church and we'll discuss them individually.

Furthermore, using the Bible as a sword to maim, gouge and cut others down to size does a grave disservice to the Word of God. And the verses in question are always meant for the other person, most often the one we are trying to destroy in a debate. Scripture is a two edged sword, a discerner of the heart and intentions. This soul-searching work should only come through private study with the Holy Spirit as the guide, not through an opponent pile-driving the unwary victim with an onslaught of texts that they think applies to the opponents situation.

I agree the Bible should never be used as a sword to hurt or maim but you said it above, in hebrews the Bible says the word of God is sharper than any two edged sword and is a discerner of the heart. If someone is offended by the truth in the word of God it may be that they are rebelling against it otherwise they would accept it with humbleness and grace. The Lord bids us to go to every kindred tongue and nation teaching them the truth of the gospel and His word. Some will not find this truth by private study because they don't have private study.

Of course, there are far too many who love taking on the mantle of the Holy Spirit aren't there?

Again, brother I ask you to examine your heart. You seem to have a aweful lot of venom inside and you are so eager to insight anger. Remember what the Bible says about the power of the tongue and that every idle word will be held in account. Let's respond in love to one another, ok?

God Bless
Jim Larmore

 

[moicherie]

She did say that meat will disappear from the diet of those who are preparing for translation. It used to be a runnig joke among us as kids. When someone told us we should not eat meat we would reply that we were not planning on being translated. For some people they felt that being translated was a step up. It did not dawn on them that whether one is translated is up to chance. HMS Richards cannot be translated no matter how much he may have wanted to.

The irony is neither will Ellen White so she could have eaten more chicken- :lol:

 

[moicherie]

...I agree the Bible should never be used as a sword to hurt or maim but you said it above, in hebrews the Bible says the word of God is sharper than any two edged sword and is a discerner of the heart. If someone is offended by the truth in the word of God it may be that they are rebelling against it otherwise they would accept it with humbleness and grace. The Lord bids us to go to every kindred tongue and nation teaching them the truth of the gospel and His word. Some will not find this truth by private study because they don't have private study. ......
God Bless
Jim Larmore

If I am hungry and served food from a garbage can should I be offended or be grateful and eat? The bible also says (KJV, Proverbs) A word fitly spoken are like apples of gold in pictures of silver.

 

[sentipente]

Brother Night, I haven't even tried to keep it a secret that I love you and that while your behavior sometimes makes my jaw drop, I'm still totally intrigued by you.

I am hoping the time will soon come when I will not hear any Christians saying such things. We ought to love everybody do it should not be news that we love anybody. We are all one family, including the ones we think are in the pig sty now.

 

[NightEternal]

Brother Night, I haven't even tried to keep it a secret that I love you and that while your behavior sometimes makes my jaw drop, I'm still totally intrigued by you.

I.E. I enjoy the thwackings as much as you do.

But when I PMd you and asked you to PLEASE apologize to brother DJ, you told me that you hadn't said anything wrong.

I don't know if you reconsidered before or after the mods asked you to edit your post or if what I said influenced you in any way, but you did eventually apologize.

Remember DJ's reaction to that apology? He said it wasn't sincere and you went OFF about that.

Scripture tells us that even if our brother comes to us SEVEN times in one day, that we should forgive them.

Obviously that means they weren't truly sorry the first time, the second time, etc etc.

I was very disappointed that DJ didn't accept your apology, and I'm very disappointed that you won't accept Jon's.

However, I have a feeling if you had been standing in front of brother DJ with a sincere apology, him being able to see your facial expressions etc, that he would have accepted the apology.

And I feel the same way about my little brother Jon.

It's impossible to truly "read" people on a message board.

It would just be nice to see more apologies and more acceptance OF those apologies.

Let's start that trend TOGETHER, shall we?

That is all well and good Trust, but the fact remains that it was my apology rejection post which as reported, not Conklins.

 

[StormyOne]

Counsel on Diets and Foods.... a compilation.... compiled after her death.... compilations of her writings routinely take things out of context.... continue on.....

 

[NightEternal]

Again, brother I ask you to examine your heart. You seem to have a awful lot of venom inside and you are so eager to insight anger. Remember what the Bible says about the power of the tongue and that every idle word will be held in account. Let's respond in love to one another, ok?

Why is passion and zeal always mistaken for venom and anger? I have neither unless I see the salvation Gospel being perverted by abberant, sinless perfection theology. The same theology that nearly shipwrecked and ruined my Adventist experience and drove me out of the church. The same theology that has successfully done that very thing to countless others. The victims litter the landscape, inside and outside the church. My response to OnTheDL was strong in the works/faith thread, yes. The Bible says if anyone comes to you and proclaims another gospel, let him be declared anathema (cursed.) So my calling his understanding 'bankrupt' and 'dead-end' certainly pales in comparison to that.

I will always fight any perversion of Reformation justification by faith, until I breathe my last.

Nothing I have said has been idle. I know exactly what and how I want to say everything I type.

 

[StormyOne]

Unfortunately Senti, someone doesn't agree. The very same post you acknowledged as true has been reported as a flame.

But we who have a few years under our belts in the SDA church know better, don't we?

not surprising... I was looking at the reported posts just yesterday, interesting that Senti is reported on a regular basis....

 

[Jimlarmore]

Christians hymns are inspired imo but God did not compose the music or write the lyrics, try another text.

There is more than likely a huge difference between what we call inspiration of hymns and the inspiration of the Holy Spirit to write the Bible. In this particular verse the word in greek is "God breathed" and we see a paralell text for the breath of God in Ps 33:6 which made the worlds but you are right I won't lean on just one scripture to prove my point.

2 Peter 1:19-21

21. " For the prophecy came not in old time by the will of man: but Holy men of God spake as they were moved by the Holy Ghost."

In most cases those who wrote the Bible received visions from God and were spoken directly to by Him. Song writers to my knowledge rarely reported having that kind of experience when they were "inspired" to write a song. Here we see where the men of God were moved by the Holy Ghost to write the Bible.

In Matt 24:35 Jesus said that His word will never pass away. Those inspired to repeat His words were writing a part of the Bible. In John 1 we see that the Bible describes Christ as the "Word of God" and equates Him bodily as the expressed word of the God-head who made everything in the universe. Christ was also called the word of God in the book of Revelations.

Speaking of Revelations let's look at Rev 21:5
" And He that sat upon the throne said Behold I make all things new and He said unto me Write for these words are true and faithful."

Here we have an example where the prophet John tells us he received direct instructions from God Himself to write the words of God for a faithful witness.

I could on and on but this post is getting a little long.

God Bless
Jim Larmore

 

[NightEternal]

But when I PMd you and asked you to PLEASE apologize to brother DJ, you told me that you hadn't said anything wrong.

I didn't. It was taken in the wrong way and I have always maintained that. The only thing I suppose could have been worded better was 'meaningless thread', which was also taken in a way I did not intend. I didn't mean by that it had no worth. I meant it was not relevant to me in light of the unrest raging at the time. I misunderstood his intent for starting the thread. He was trying to lighten the mood. I didn't see that. How many times must I clarify this?

I don't know if you reconsidered before or after the mods asked you to edit your post or if what I said influenced you in any way, but you did eventually apologize.

I apologized to bring peace, not because I felt what I said was wrong. I cannot help how some will percieve a statement.

As for the editing, it was done at the instructions of the mods. Not because I felt it was warranted.

Remember DJ's reaction to that apology? He said it wasn't sincere and you went OFF about that.

Conklin is entitled to believe whatever he wants on that one. I wasn't upset that he didn't think I was sincere. I was upset because he couldn't even make the effort to fake it just to keep the peace.

The difference between my apology and Jon's is that there was no questionable tagline at the end of mine.

Nevertheless, I am willing to accept the apology even if I feel it wasn't sincere.

But I stand by my response to the 'you will know them by thier words' post. Whether the mods force me to edit it or not, it is an accurate assessment of how I feel.

 

[Moriah_Conquering_Wind]

my experiences are valid. I have had it done to me and I have seen it done to others, many times. Maybe that has not been your experience, but I know what I have seen and experienced in the church.

Though I have no clue what you are referring to specifically with this post, I have to say AMEN to these words. My experience is being attacked all over this board and while the mods are sympathetic the MOB wants to see me hung, strung, tarred, feathered, stockaded, scarlet-lettered, and burned at the stake for a martyr to Satan.

It's not JUST the SDA church. It's CHRISTENDOM herself. The vile is rife in her walls. Her cup is nearly full. Very soon she will unitedly commit open and willful deicide again. I have seen it in vision. If the humans will not bear witness to the Reconciliation, the Daughter must be slain. History will come full circle and doom shall be upon her.

No apology that ends in 'sorry if any nerves were tickled' is sincere. It only shows the individual meant to target a certain segment and has assumed he has been successful in attributing the proper guilt upon that segment.

There are many forms of insincere apology. That is but one. Another one is "sorry IF that offended you." No. Sorry THAT it did, that's real. Sorry "IF" is self-exoneration and it does not wash.

We, the seeing, are tired of having the blind try to put our eyes out on this and thousands of other matters. JUST STOP. IT WILL NEVER WORK. YOU WILL NOT SUCCEED IN JUSTIFYING YOURSELVES, EVER. WE SEE, AND CANNOT UNSEE.



Disclaimer: this post is me "stewing in my own juice" ... I'm honestly not sure what NightEternal is referencing specifically. I am internally referencing my own ongoing torture.

 

[sentipente]

There is more than likely a huge difference between what we call inspiration of hymns and the inspiration of the Holy Spirit to write the Bible.

There is no difference. You are attempting to fragment the work of the Holy Spirit. Whose interest are you advancing in this effort?