Pastor has multiple affairs

[Doctor Strangelove]

Maybe he had enough and wanted to get caught?

I dunno. I think someone like that never has enough!

 

[memoriesbymichelle]

what is sad to me is that I haven't really wanted to go to church since this happened. I'm not mad at him and I know I'm just as bad a sinner as the next guy, but it just made an excuse for me really. I plan to go this Sunday, but because of this and my own circumstances (which have nothing to do with anything like this) even though I know God is with me, I feel far away and lost a little bit.

 

[iambren]

This is the problem with mega-churches (5K-5,500). Ordinarily I would prefer an offtime meeting for MEMBERS ONLY where that pastor could read or simply say sorry to his flock(AFTER he was told he would resign). Then members can be explained what happened and what they are going to do in the future eg how counseling is conducted and accountability built in.

I always chuckle when the knee-jerk method of secrecy is deemed best. People are going to talk regardless and seems to me getting the right info would be best without exaggerated gossip. A meeting can bring closure,clarity,and ways to pray for this pastors future.

 

[Doctor Strangelove]

I partly agree, partly disagree, iambren. I don't like the mega-church model for several reasons. One of the reasons is it can become a personality cult led by one charismatic man (by charismatic I don't mean as in the gifts of the Spirit). This does not always happen but I think such problems are more likely. Someone posted a news article about that church. I think I like how they handled the situation. The pastor was immediately let go and the congregation was told why, without being told anything too specific. It looks like they at least found someone right away to be an interim pastor. I don't see any point of having the congregation confront the failed pastor. Emotions are raw and that would make them even more raw. A confrontation would not bring closure - it would just get people even more upset and worked up for no real purpose. There is also the potential for violence when a situation is heated. On the other hand, letting the pastor go and keeping the reason a secret would not work, I agree. This is all a sad thing.

 

[dayhiker]

Part of what this speaks to is that being a pastor is often a lonely place to be. Most pastors feel they can't be friends with people who attend their church because they will be seen as showing partiality to them. They are often so busy that they don't have time to find a friend outside the church and spend enough time with so that trust is built and they can open up and be honest.
When any man is that lonely then a woman who shows him an interest is going to look might nice and a place where he can get some relief from that loneliness. This is probably where denominations have fallen down. They could easily build in time for training for that fellowship. Pastors of independent churches it can be even harder.
So their is a way to have compassion for these men of God.

 

[memoriesbymichelle]

Well I had dinner with some friends that attend that church last night. They said they know someone that is close to the situation. So he had one particular affair that lasted over 2 years. Then for whatever reason he did not want to continue the relationship, so the woman came forward. And after that, 3 other women also came forward. He confessed only when confronted. Ironically (or not) Christmas service he was preaching to the men to keep their eyes on their wives and their marriages, eye on the prize he said. And he had cheated before in his marriage, even before becoming a pastor. The guy that is the interim pastor was/is a good friend of his but had no knowledge of his affairs and he felt lied to and betrayed (because he was). But he is the family pastor and he will be taking the lead now until we find a new pastor. What bothers me is that I just watched a sermon from last week and he was saying that people ask him how they can help the pastor and his family and he says to respect their privacy. I disagree. I think he should be made/compelled to stand in front of the congregation he has hurt by his actions and tell us he is sorry. No it would not solve anything, but it should be part of the accountability plan. It's like hearing it from the horses mouth.
Even though we know we are all sinners. He was the Pastor. He was the Spiritual authority of sorts over the church and he had a responsibility to be diciplined and he failed. At the very least he could do a video or write a letter but something. Not just fade off into the sunset never to be seen in public again, no. I forgive him for being human and failing to heed the temptation but not owning up to it himself without being told on first.....I still forgive but that is intent to hide. And while he may be successful at hiding it from us, he is not successful in hiding it from God. And I would like to know from him, what did he think was going to happen. Did he think he could hide this fraud forever? It was the scorned woman that unraveled the tangled web he weaved. Sad.

 

[dayhiker]

I agree with you Michelle that it would be good for him to stand in front of the church and confess what he did and ask forgiveness. I don't think he can be made to do it. The church leadership could ask him to do that. But its his choice wither he does or not.

From what we see of politicians who fall and step up the microphone to confess and ask forgiveness, it appears there are a lot of people who don't accept what they say and don't believe their are sorry. I suspect that would be true of your ex pastor. His record isn't good and he was still hiding it. He got caught. So its almost impossible for him to come across as repentant I think.

I do think you are handling it as good as one can Michelle. So this speaks to me of your maturity in Christ.

 

[TheyCallMeDavid]

I'm not sure how to feel about this, although I am sure there are a couple of members here that will tell me exactly how I should feel.

I wasn't going to go to church this Sunday, but I knew I was just being lazy about getting back into the routine of things and so I got up and went.
As soon as I walked in I could "feel" something was up. I wasn't sure what it was until after worship. One of the board of directors got up and with a shaky voice started to speak. He said they had found out that our Pastor had had an affair. Then he said they received more information that it was multiple affairs. They requested and received the Pastor's resignation and said that they are walking along side him and his family thru this and that we should respect their privacy.
So it looks like we don't have a Pastor now. I am shocked, first of all.
I really don't know how to "feel" about it. I definitely think he should have resigned. I have alot of questions. How did they find out if it wasn't from the Pastor and it sounded like it wasn't because after they received the information they confronted him (they said) and he confessed. Also if the Pastor didn't tell them, what was the Pastor thinking would happen? Did he think he could keep the secret forever? just curious on that one.
Why didn't the Pastor have to confront the congregation? Why did the Elders tell us? Shouldn't he have had to stand before us, (like our Senators regularly do or like Tiger Woods) and tell us himself?

I am a firm believer that our Pastor is forgiven and God is not surprised by his actions. He is a sinner just like us, and needs mercy and grace just like we do. I also think that if you are going to be in a position of leadership that you are held to a higher standing and if you are still committing known habitual sin, you should not be a leader. I don't believe that that makes you unsaved, just not fit for leadership.
So I struggle. I have not been attending for very long. I don't feel like leaving over this, but at my other church there are two Pastors and one is the lead Pastor so if something happened, the other one would be in charge at least temporarily, but at this church, I guess I don't know if they even have an assistant Pastor and what they plan to do to go forward.

I can tell you how you should feel based on Gods Word, if you like.

First, the Pastor feels quite responsible , guilty, and ashamed because he submitted his resignation willfully (if in fact he wasn't coersed to do so) . That is a decision that was afforded him and if that's what he was led to do after much time in prayer with God over it ...then his decision should be honored and respected. He may feel he needs to resign in order to properly and effectively work on getting past this hurdle both personally and with his marriage.

Had the Pastor chose to remain on as Pastor , then biblical guidelines kick in to which the Elders and Pastor would announce to the congregation what has taken place , with the Pastor being very contrite and repenting of the situation and asking for the forgiveness of the Congregation. The protocol under this situation would be for the church body to restore this fallen Pastor IF he was truly sorry including exiting the sexual immorality. If he was not ...then biblical discipline kicks in to where he is asked to leave the presence of the Church Body aka : Disfellowship .

As to the questions you have...perhaps you will find out more as time goes on.

Sadly today, it is not too uncommon for a Pastor to stray sexually, particularly if there are problems at home . The Adultress also needs to be considered in this scenario with appropriate biblical handling applied.

 

[memoriesbymichelle]

Thanks David, your post is fine exept the part that says you will tell me how I "should" feel. You have no authority to tell me or anyone how to feel, so please choose different wording in the future because you just sound so above everyone with those words.

 

[TheyCallMeDavid]

Thanks David, your post is fine exept the part that says you will tell me how I "should" feel. You have no authority to tell me or anyone how to feel, so please choose different wording in the future because you just sound so above everyone with those words.

It was kind of a jovial statement that I made in response to your opening statement...at least in my personal estimation it was ...lol...

Of course, no one can tell another HOW they should feel....but....as fellow Christians we do have the responsibility of sharing the truth from Gods Word so that Anothers thinking might be brought in line with absolute truth with The Bible being that Instrument of persuasion regarding life issues and things that we post about.

 

[memoriesbymichelle]

Sharing God's word is different than telling someone how they "should" feel.

 

[TheyCallMeDavid]

Sharing God's word is different than telling someone how they "should" feel.

As our Christian walk continues, and grows, our feelings/thoughts/motives/ideals/philosophies/decisions/etc...should be the same as what Gods Word instructs . The way a Christian feels on anything in life, should line up with Gods Word ., and a Christian is Someone who should desire that without end. Even Gods Word encourages all Christians to encourage, train up, edify , correct, rebuke when necessary, etc... other fellow Followers of Christ (2 Tim 3:15-17). So as Christians, we should actually welcome how we should be feeling on an issue based on Another telling us the truth of Gods Word.

 

[blackribbon]

As our Christian walk continues, and grows, our feelings/thoughts/motives/ideals/philosophies/decisions/etc...should be the same as what Gods Word instructs . The way a Christian feels on anything in life, should line up with Gods Word ., and a Christian is Someone who should desire that without end. Even Gods Word encourages all Christians to encourage, train up, edify , correct, rebuke when necessary, etc... other fellow Followers of Christ (2 Tim 3:15-17). So as Christians, we should actually welcome how we should be feeling on an issue based on Another telling us the truth of Gods Word.

You have got to be kidding....please tell me you are kidding. We do not control how we "feel"...only how we respond to our feelings. Nobody can "instruct" on how we should feel about anything.

 

[Doctor Strangelove]

You have got to be kidding....please tell me you are kidding. We do not control how we "feel"...only how we respond to our feelings. Nobody can "instruct" on how we should feel about anything.

Agreed. This shaming/guilting people for just being human drives many people away from Christ - when all people hear is law, law, law and no grace, they figure that Christianity is just another system of works, and that is what some people turn it into. If you are burdened and the only "help" you get is people telling you what you should feel - if that is the only "Christian" response and Christ is pictured as waiting to catch you in something in order to condemn you - why wouldn't you figure that everything is hopeless and this "religion" business is just a cruel trick to put more burdens on you?

 

[blackribbon]

In theory I don't like mega churches...but I attend one because my teens love it and I have watched their Christian lives truly grow under this church. It also teaches the Bible better than any other church I have visited. There is a reason why this church has grown so big. Besides the 5 campuses, they are sponsoring the start of many new churches that are independent of our church.

I think the difference is that they do not have a single pastor...there is a team of pastors...most have a "regular" church and services....but they rotate on a regular basis. We never know who is going to walk out each service. As much as I like my main pastor (the reason I go to this particular campus), I have yet to be disappointed when it is a different pastor who walks out any week and they rotate enough that we do know all of them. The lead pastor only guest speaks at the various campuses. I believe that all the pastors meet each week and support each other through friendship and hold each other to accountability. I also do not believe that the teaching pastors do any of the counseling. They also participate as members in group activities. I think this helps minimize making these men into "gods" and if any leader left, we might miss them but the daily function of the church as a whole wouldn't miss a beat.

 

[TheyCallMeDavid]

You have got to be kidding....please tell me you are kidding. We do not control how we "feel"...only how we respond to our feelings. Nobody can "instruct" on how we should feel about anything.

The Bible isn't kidding about it, and neither am I. As Christians, we are to filter everything thru the screen of Gods Word so our feelings about things and how we react , are totally lined up. When God does a true Born Again experience with an Individual, the entire Person becomes a new creation...including how we feel, what our thought processes are, how we respond , etc...

In fact, the Bible says NOT to trust in your feelings .

 

[TheyCallMeDavid]

Agreed. This shaming/guilting people for just being human drives many people away from Christ - when all people hear is law, law, law and no grace, they figure that Christianity is just another system of works, and that is what some people turn it into. If you are burdened and the only "help" you get is people telling you what you should feel - if that is the only "Christian" response and Christ is pictured as waiting to catch you in something in order to condemn you - why wouldn't you figure that everything is hopeless and this "religion" business is just a cruel trick to put more burdens on you?

God is love and he is also Just (justice) . And we are not talking about 'shaming' a person in this dialogue...but we are talking about showing Another Christian what Gods Word has to say on how we should feel about an issue and all issues. The Bible even instructs us to build each other up in the truth of Gods Word by sharing it with them. If a person has a wrong feeling or attitude toward an issue, then we are to go to that Person and lovingly show them why their feelings or views need to be adjusted to be in line with (more in line with) Gods Word. God doesn't call his people to be tolerant but to be loving enough to share the truth with them and that standard is his Word.

 

[blackribbon]

The Bible isn't kidding about it, and neither am I. As Christians, we are to filter everything thru the screen of Gods Word so our feelings about things and how we react , are totally lined up. When God does a true Born Again experience with an Individual, the entire Person becomes a new creation...including how we feel, what our thought processes are, how we respond , etc...

In fact, the Bible says NOT to trust in your feelings .

EXACTLY...do not trust your feelings because you do not have control over them...you have control over your reaction and your actions. That is what God holds us accountable for.

When you say "the Bible says"....please start giving references. God does NOT tell us how to feel beyond being "joyful and grateful" in all situations. You can NOT advice someone on how to feel....any more than you can tell someone who just had their leg amputated to just not "feel the pain"...it isn't something we have control over.

 

[TheyCallMeDavid]

EXACTLY...do not trust your feelings because you do not have control over them...you have control over your reaction and your actions. That is what God holds us accountable for.

When you say "the Bible says"....please start giving references. God does NOT tell us how to feel beyond being "joyful and grateful" in all situations. You can NOT advice someone on how to feel....any more than you can tell someone who just had their leg amputated to just not "feel the pain"...it isn't something we have control over.

We are to line up our ENTIRE BEING with the Word of God and the Nature, Person, and Character of Christ himself. When I speak of 'how we feel' ... im speaking of our view on a matter mainly which shapes our thinking and convictions.

The Bible gives a lot of passages on how we should FEEL , for instance Phillipians 4:8 which tells us to think on certain things which would/should certainly influence how we feel , and also The Fruit of Gods Spirit found in Galatians 5:21 which tells us to put certain Fruits into action which certainly has an impact on how we feel .

Our Soul being a very complex Entity, is such that our feelings/emotions/thoughts/desires/will are all closely linked together and are meant to be in harmony with Gods Word of instruction on how to live . In essence...Gods Word is the input to our 'Computer' and the segments of our Soul are the micro-processor part of our Computer which leads to animation of our emotional and physical responses.

 

[blackribbon]

We are to line up our ENTIRE BEING with the Word of God and the Nature, Person, and Character of Christ himself. When I speak of 'how we feel' ... im speaking of our view on a matter mainly which shapes our thinking and convictions.

The Bible gives a lot of passages on how we should FEEL , for instance Phillipians 4:8 which tells us to think on certain things which would/should certainly influence how we feel , and also The Fruit of Gods Spirit found in Galatians 5:21 which tells us to put certain Fruits into action which certainly has an impact on how we feel .

Our Soul being a very complex Entity, is such that our feelings/emotions/thoughts/desires/will are all closely linked together and are meant to be in harmony with Gods Word of instruction on how to live . In essence...Gods Word is the input to our 'Computer' and the segments of our Soul are the micro-processor part of our Computer which leads to animation of our emotional and physical responses.

So you are saying "I feel" means "my opinion"....and not my "feelings" such as sad, joyful, annoyed, tired, heartbroken, afraid....

The verses you gave are about actions...and the result of making correct decision is positive feeling (emotions).

Again, these verses do not tell us how to feel...they tell us how to act in spite of how we are feeling. Neither asks us to state our opinion...just act.

Philippians 4:8 (NIV)8

Finally, brothers and sisters, whatever is true, whatever is noble, whatever is right, whatever is pure, whatever is lovely, whatever is admirable—if anything is excellent or praiseworthy—think about such things.



Galatians 5:19-23 (NIV) 19 The acts of the flesh are obvious: sexual immorality, impurity and debauchery; 20 idolatry and witchcraft; hatred, discord, jealousy, fits of rage, selfish ambition, dissensions, factions 21 and envy; drunkenness, orgies, and the like. I warn you, as I did before, that those who live like this will not inherit the kingdom of God.
22 But the fruit of the Spirit is love, joy, peace, forbearance, kindness, goodness, faithfulness, 23 gentleness and self-control. Against such things there is no law.