Passover

[gadar perets]

what day was it when they were camp by the sea and the Egyptians appeared?

And what day did they cross over?

I believe they both occurred on Abib 18.

 

[visionary]

 

[visionary]

Moses recorded the fact that Israel crossed over the Red Sea and physically left the land of Egypt on the 17th of Nisan in

Numbers 33:1 These are the journeys of the children of Israel, which went forth out of the land of Egypt with their armies under the hand of Moses and Aaron.2 And Moses wrote their goings out according to their journeys by the commandment of the LORD: and these are their journeys according to their goings out. 3 And they departed from Rameses in the first month, on the fifteenth day of the first month; (Nisan) on the morrow after the Passover (still the 15th) the children of Israel went out with an high hand in the sight of all the Egyptians. (Remember, Israel’s days start at sunset)4 For the Egyptians buried all their firstborn, which the LORD had smitten among them: upon their gods also the LORD executed judgments.5 And the children of Israel removed from Rameses, and pitched in Succoth. (Evening of the 15th) 6 And they departed from Succoth, and pitched in Etham, which is in the edge of the wilderness. (Evening of 16th) 7 And they removed from Etham, and turned again unto Pi-hahiroth, which is before Baal-zephon: and they pitched before Migdol. (Evening of the 17th)

 

[dfw69]

I believe they both occurred on Abib 18.

Which is the 4th day of Passover and unleavened bread?

 

[gadar perets]

Jos 5:10 And the children of Israel encamped in Gilgal, and kept the passover on the fourteenth day of the month at even in the plains of Jericho.
Jos 5:11 And they did eat of the old corn of the land on the morrow after the passover (Abib 15), unleavened cakes, and parched corn in the selfsame day.
Jos 5:12 And the manna ceased on the morrow after they had eaten of the old corn of the land (Abib 16); neither had the children of Israel manna any more; but they did eat of the fruit of the land of Canaan that year (Abib 16 - after the firstfruits were offered).

Num 33:3 And they departed from Rameses in the first month, on the fifteenth day of the first month; on the morrow after the passover the children of Israel went out with an high hand in the sight of all the Egyptians.
Num 33:4 For the Egyptians buried all their firstborn, which YHWH had smitten among them: upon their gods also YHWH executed judgments.
Num 33:5 And the children of Israel removed from Rameses, and pitched in Succoth (Abib 15 - first day of FOUB).
Num 33:6 And they departed from Succoth, and pitched in Etham, which is in the edge of the wilderness (Abib 16).
Num 33:7 And they removed from Etham, and turned again unto Pihahiroth, which is before Baalzephon: and they pitched before Migdol (Abib 17).
Num 33:8 And they departed from before Pihahiroth, and passed through the midst of the sea into the wilderness (Abib 18), and went three days' journey in the wilderness of Etham, and pitched in Marah (Abib 21 - last day of FOUB).
Num 33:9 And they removed from Marah, and came unto Elim: and in Elim were twelve fountains of water, and threescore and ten palm trees; and they pitched there (Abib 22).​

 

[Yeshua HaDerekh]

I understand a sabbath is the day of rest in which the holy day falls on the calendar.... is there a calendar in which Firstfruits always falls after the Sabbath?

Leviticus 23:15-16

 

[Elihoenai]

Bitters of the Bitters

What Bitters must be consumed according to the Law of the Passover?

What Bitters have you found to be the most Bitter?

Horseradish Root, Romaine Lettuce, Endives, Leaf part of Celery or Other?


Exodus 12:8 Young's Literal Translation (YLT)

8 `And they have eaten the flesh in this night, roast with fire; with unleavened things and bitters they do eat it;

 

[Meowzltov]

Questions I have for the timeline of Passover and feast of unleavened bread



Day 1 of Passover Nissan 10 the lamb chosen (is this also the time to yeast clean?)

Day 4 of Passover Nissan 14 the lamb eaten with
Unleavened bread (is this not the first day of the feast of unleavened bread?) (are the unleavened bread made on this day as well?)

Day 7 of Passover Nissan 17 (firstfruits?..and 3rd day of unleavened bread? And first day of counting of Omer?)

I thought he was talking about Passover as it is celebrated today without the Temple?

 

[Meowzltov]

Exodus 12:15 Seven days shall ye eat unleavened bread; howbeit the first day ye shall put away leaven out of your houses; for whosoever eateth leavened bread from the first day until the seventh day, that soul shall be cut off from Israel.​

To keep it in your house transgresses the command. What do you mean by "I couldn't get rid of"? That's like saying, "Sins I don't want to give up".

Selling your chametz to a non-Jew is absolutely absurd. Not only does that tradition cause you to transgress the Almighty's command (Matthew 15:3), but it is like passing your sins on to another and then taking those same sins back.

Deuteronomy 17:8-13

 

[gadar perets]

Deuteronomy 17:8-13

So when Yeshua rebuked the scribes and Pharisees in Matthew 15, would it have been acceptable for them to defend their breaking of the commandments so they could keep their traditions by quoting Deuteronomy 17:8-13?

 

[YESLORDIWILL]

Bitters of the Bitters

What Bitters must be consumed according to the Law of the Passover?

What Bitters have you found to be the most Bitter?

Horseradish Root, Romaine Lettuce, Endives, Leaf part of Celery or Other?


Exodus 12:8 Young's Literal Translation (YLT)

8 `And they have eaten the flesh in this night, roast with fire; with unleavened things and bitters they do eat it;

Broccoli Rabe, bitter made sweet ♡

Do this in remembrance of me :•)

 

[Meowzltov]

So when Yeshua rebuked the scribes and Pharisees in Matthew 15, would it have been acceptable for them to defend their breaking of the commandments so they could keep their traditions by quoting Deuteronomy 17:8-13?

I'm not defending their hypocrisy (how they lived). But apparently what they TAUGHT was A-Okay according to Yeshua (Matthew 23:1-2)

 

[YESLORDIWILL]

.

 

[Steve Petersen]

So when Yeshua rebuked the scribes and Pharisees in Matthew 15, would it have been acceptable for them to defend their breaking of the commandments so they could keep their traditions by quoting Deuteronomy 17:8-13?

In Matthew 23:23 Jesus endorsed the rabbinic tradition of tithing herbs, but to subordinate it to the weightier commandments.

From the Talmud, Rosh Ha Shanah 1a:

"And for herbs." To this a Boraitha adds "tithes and vows." Let us see. What does he mean by "herbs"? The tithe of herbs. But are not these included with other "tithes"? (Nay, for the tithe of herbs) is a rabbinical institution, while the others are biblical. If so, should he not teach the biblical commandment first? (This is no question), because it was pleasing to him (to have discovered that, although the tithe of herbs is only a rabbinical institution, yet it should have a special New Year to prevent the confusion of tithes from year to year) he, therefore, gives it precedence. And the Tana of our Mishna teaches us the rabbinical institution (viz., the New Year for herbs), leaving us to infer that if that must be observed, so much the more must the biblical law be followed.

The tithing of herbs is from the Rabbins. - Mishnah, Maaseroth 1:1

 

[gadar perets]

I'm not defending their hypocrisy (how they lived). But apparently what they TAUGHT was A-Okay according to Yeshua (Matthew 23:1-2)

It was OK with Yeshua as long as they taught what Moses taught. That is what it means to sit in Moses' seat. When they taught traditions that caused them to break what Moses taught, he rebuked them for it.

 

[gadar perets]

In Matthew 23:23 Jesus endorsed the rabbinic tradition of tithing herbs, but to subordinate it to the weightier commandments.

From the Talmud, Rosh Ha Shanah 1a:

"And for herbs." To this a Boraitha adds "tithes and vows." Let us see. What does he mean by "herbs"? The tithe of herbs. But are not these included with other "tithes"? (Nay, for the tithe of herbs) is a rabbinical institution, while the others are biblical. If so, should he not teach the biblical commandment first? (This is no question), because it was pleasing to him (to have discovered that, although the tithe of herbs is only a rabbinical institution, yet it should have a special New Year to prevent the confusion of tithes from year to year) he, therefore, gives it precedence. And the Tana of our Mishna teaches us the rabbinical institution (viz., the New Year for herbs), leaving us to infer that if that must be observed, so much the more must the biblical law be followed.

The tithing of herbs is from the Rabbins. - Mishnah, Maaseroth 1:1

Bull. Rabbinic exaltation. The fact that Yeshua referred to judgment, mercy, and faith as weightier matters of the law shows that tithing herbs is a lighter matter of the law which should not be left undone.

Leviticus 27:30 And all the tithe of the land, whether of the seed of the land, or of the fruit of the tree, is YHWH'S: it is holy unto YHWH.​

Are herbs grown from seeds? Yes. Are they among the seeds of the land? Yes. Should they be tithed? Yes. If not, why not?

 

[Elihoenai]

Broccoli Rabe, bitter made sweet ♡

Do this in remembrance of me :•)

Ruta graveolens

"...Rue is well known for its symbolic meaning of regret and it has sometimes been called "herb-of-grace" in literary works. It is one of the flowers distributed by the mad Ophelia in William Shakespeare's Hamlet (IV.5):

"There's fennel for you, and columbines:
there's rue for you; and here's some for me:
we may call it herb-grace o' Sundays:
O you must wear your rue with a difference..."

It was planted by the gardener in Richard II to mark the spot where the Queen wept upon hearing news of Richard's capture (III.4.104–105):

"Here did she fall a tear, here in this place
I'll set a bank of rue, sour herb of grace."..."

Ruta graveolens - Wikipedia

 

[Steve Petersen]

Bull. Rabbinic exaltation. The fact that Yeshua referred to judgment, mercy, and faith as weightier matters of the law shows that tithing herbs is a lighter matter of the law which should not be left undone.

Leviticus 27:30 And all the tithe of the land, whether of the seed of the land, or of the fruit of the tree, is YHWH'S: it is holy unto YHWH.​

Are herbs grown from seeds? Yes. Are they among the seeds of the land? Yes. Should they be tithed? Yes. If not, why not?

Deuteronomy 14:22 You shall tithe all the yield of your seed that comes from the field year by year. 23 And before the LORD your God, in the place that he will choose, to make his name dwell there, you shall eat the tithe of your grain, of your wine, and of your oil, and the firstborn of your herd and flock, that you may learn to fear the LORD your God always

This is a generalization (first bold) followed by the particular (second bold.) The particular limits the generalization. This is known as k'lal u'ferat, (from the general to the specific.) It is a form of expression in Jewish deliberation.

Kelal uferat (The general and the particular)

A general principle may be restricted by a particularization of it in another verse – or, conversely, a particular rule may be extended into a general principle. A Tenach example: Genesis 1:27 makes the general statement that God created man. Genesis 2:7, 21 particularizes this by giving the details of the creation of Adam and Chava (Eve). Other examples would be verses detailing with how to perform sacrifices or how to keep the feasts. In the Gospels, the principle of divorce being allowed for "uncleanliness," is particularized to mean for sexual immorality only.


Read more: Hebrew Hermaneutics | Ahavat Elohim (The Love Of God) Messianic Discussion Forums

 

[gadar perets]

Deuteronomy 14:22 You shall tithe all the yield of your seed that comes from the field year by year. 23 And before the LORD your God, in the place that he will choose, to make his name dwell there, you shall eat the tithe of your grain, of your wine, and of your oil, and the firstborn of your herd and flock, that you may learn to fear the LORD your God always

This is a generalization (first bold) followed by the particular (second bold.) The particular limits the generalization. This is known as k'lal u'ferat, (from the general to the specific.) It is a form of expression in Jewish deliberation.

Kelal uferat (The general and the particular)

A general principle may be restricted by a particularization of it in another verse – or, conversely, a particular rule may be extended into a general principle. A Tenach example: Genesis 1:27 makes the general statement that God created man. Genesis 2:7, 21 particularizes this by giving the details of the creation of Adam and Chava (Eve). Other examples would be verses detailing with how to perform sacrifices or how to keep the feasts. In the Gospels, the principle of divorce being allowed for "uncleanliness," is particularized to mean for sexual immorality only.


Read more: Hebrew Hermaneutics | Ahavat Elohim (The Love Of God) Messianic Discussion Forums

So how are you applying Kelal uferat to Deuteronomy 14:22 and Leviticus 27:30?

 

[Steve Petersen]

So how are you applying Kelal uferat to Deuteronomy 14:22 and Leviticus 27:30?

Deuteronomy 14 limits the general 'seed of the field' to grain, wine, and oil. Herbs are not included in that list.