Paraphrase bibles (The Message, Living bible, etc...)

[ARBITER01]

Which version is the “approved for beating each other over the head with” version?

John O.

Lol, like I said, any of the more literal versions.

 

[ARBITER01]

I have the honor to have been preaching for more than 20 years now and I have and do use the different paraphrase Bibles - including the Message in my preaching.

Not as a base, but as icing on the cake. They help illustrate certain verses.

I'll give you an example.

2 Cor 2:14 Now thanks be to God who always leads us in triumph in Christ, and through us diffuses the fragrance of His knowledge in every place. 15 For we are to God the fragrance of Christ among those who are being saved and among those who are perishing. NKJV

​

This is perhaps one of my favorite verses to minister along the lines of. The Message actually amplifies it a bit in it's vernacular:

2 Cor 2: 14 In the Messiah, in Christ, God leads us from place to place in one perpetual victory parade. Through us, he brings knowledge of Christ. Everywhere we go, people breathe in the exquisite fragrance. Because of Christ, we give off a sweet scent rising to God, which is recognized by those on the way of salvation—an aroma redolent with life. But those on the way to destruction treat us more like the stench from a rotting corpse.

​

Is it the meat of the message? NO - but it sure makes good icing.

Do I use it extensively? Nope - but it's like anything - we have to be smart as an old cow -

Chew on the hay and spit out the sticks.

I'm sorry, but if I ever walk in a church were the pastor is not preaching under revelation and inspiration, and instead is merely dictating from a loose interpretation from men who think they have a mandate to make such works, I'm walking back out. I won't stay there and be subject to the flesh.

People need to raise their standard of what Christianity is, and is suppose to be in front of folks. All the greats over the years were great because they practiced and used certain things that brought growth and fellowship with The Lord in their lives, and thereby the power of GOD to the body.

 

[imperfectchristian]

That would be you interjecting your opinion over what I said into what I actually said, and I'm not about to feel guilty over it just because you are demonstrating your feelings here.

I'll say it again, those Christians who are growing and maturing spiritually will gravitate towards a more literal translation of GOD's word.

It would be hilarious to see a person with their message bible come on here and try to use it to justify some of the arguments we beat each other up with simply because such actions would be easily viewed as non-professional and immature. In fact, go ahead and do it.

Ahhh so you are indifferent to how what you say makes people feel?

 

[imperfectchristian]

I'm sorry, but if I ever walk in a church were the pastor is not preaching under revelation and inspiration, and instead is merely dictating from a loose interpretation from men who think they have a mandate to make such works, I'm walking back out. I won't stay there and be subject to the flesh.

People need to raise their standard of what Christianity is, and is suppose to be in front of folks. All the greats over the years were great because they practiced and used certain things that brought growth and fellowship with The Lord in their lives, and thereby the power of GOD to the body.

People said the same thing about Paul...how dare he say we are no longer under the law. How dare he say we no longer need to be circumcised.

 

[ARBITER01]

Ahhh so you are indifferent to how what you say makes people feel?

I think it would be more on the lines that I don't allow folks to push their personal form of conviction at me when they try.

Instead of trying to force your personal beliefs and feelings towards me, thinking that such actions will have results, it would be better not to even try. People like control, but I don't allow them to achieve that over me through guilt.

I will allow myself to be convicted by The Holy Spirit, but not by someone's soul.

 

[Alpine]

Has anyone ever met someone harmed by The message?

I haven't.

But I have met people wounded by KJV wielding religious folks whacking them over the heads that they weren't good enough and not living up to their standards.

 

[jeolmstead]

Has anyone ever met someone harmed by The message?

I haven't.

But I have met people wounded by KJV wielding religious folks whacking them over the heads that they weren't good enough and not living up to their standards.

Well, give it time, once someone makes an idol of it, it will make a dandy club….



John O.

 

[Leimeng]

~ If you don't want to hear an interpretation of the Bible you dont like, nor hear a paraphrase you dont agree with, dont you DARE ever try to teach or instruct or correct anything anyone ever says unless it is a complete quote from your favorite 'literal' version of the Bible. Otherwise you are a pathetic whinny hypocrite. Everything unless it is a direct quotation from scripture, in context, is an intepretation.
~ Continue to discuss amongst yourselves...

Peace,

Leimeng

Flatulo Ergo Sum ~~~

(***Insert Personal One Liner Here***)

 

[ARBITER01]

~ If you don't want to hear an interpretation of the Bible you dont like, nor hear a paraphrase you dont agree with, dont you DARE ever try to teach or instruct or correct anything anyone ever says unless it is a complete quote from your favorite 'literal' version of the Bible. Otherwise you are a pathetic whinny hypocrite. Everything unless it is a direct quotation from scripture, in context, is an intepretation.
~ Continue to discuss amongst yourselves...

Peace,

Leimeng

Flatulo Ergo Sum ~~~

(***Insert Personal One Liner Here***)

/cheer

Leimeng jumps in the middle of the conversation telling us to talk among ourselves!!!

lol

 

[LogosRhema]

Actually, if I'm helping someone new to the Bible I give them The Message. Most are discouraged even by how NIV reads, so I hope to encourage them through the basics The Message paints. Start basic, then go advanced once the young disciple is ready!

 

[imperfectchristian]

I think it would be more on the lines that I don't allow folks to push their personal form of conviction at me when they try.

Instead of trying to force your personal beliefs and feelings towards me, thinking that such actions will have results, it would be better not to even try. People like control, but I don't allow them to achieve that over me through guilt.

I will allow myself to be convicted by The Holy Spirit, but not by someone's soul.

Oh well I tried...your cat provoked me.


However I don't see any difference between that and pushing your convictions on someone else.

 

[Elijah2]

Has anyone ever met someone harmed by The message?

I haven't.

But I have met people wounded by KJV wielding religious folks whacking them over the heads that they weren't good enough and not living up to their standards.

Mate that's the life of "hard knocks".

When we are saved we no longer conform to the world, and are transformed by renewing our mind, our heart, and this renewal is the TRUTH of HIS INSPIRED WORD. And you mean to tell me because you have experienced and been wounded by KJV wielding religious Christians that these experiences gives the author of "The Message" the right to distort, misrepresent, change, and add His INSPIRED WORd to suit his interpreations of what he believes HIS WORD should say.

The Message is watered-down MILK, you know, others know, and I know it.

How can you tell when a deceived and seduced Christian is harmed.

For heavens sake read the text of The Message and you will see that our Lord Jesus Christ is being harmed and mocked: "Let him who is taught the WORD share in all good things with him who teaches. Do not be deceived, God is not mocked for whatever a man sows, that he will also reap." (Gal. 6:8).

NKJV:
Walking in the Spirit

16 I say then: Walk in the Spirit, and you shall not fulfill the lust of the flesh. 17 For the flesh lusts against the Spirit, and the Spirit against the flesh; and these are contrary to one another, so that you do not do the things that you wish. 18 But if you are led by the Spirit, you are not under the law.
19 Now the works of the flesh are evident, which are: adultery,[a] fornication, uncleanness, lewdness, 20 idolatry, sorcery, hatred, contentions, jealousies, outbursts of wrath, selfish ambitions, dissensions, heresies, 21 envy, murders,[b] drunkenness, revelries, and the like; of which I tell you beforehand, just as I also told you in time past, that those who practice such things will not inherit the kingdom of God.
22 But the fruit of the Spirit is love, joy, peace, longsuffering, kindness, goodness, faithfulness, 23 gentleness, self-control. Against such there is no law. 24 And those who are Christ’s have crucified the flesh with its passions and desires. 25 If we live in the Spirit, let us also walk in the Spirit. 26 Let us not become conceited, provoking one another, envying one another.

THE MESSAGE:
16-18My counsel is this: Live freely, animated and motivated by God's Spirit. (no mention of the lust of the flesh) Then you won't feed the compulsions of selfishness. For there is a root of sinful self-interest in us that is at odds with a free spirit, just as the free spirit is incompatible with selfishness. These two ways of life are antithetical, so that you cannot live at times one way and at times another way according to how you feel on any given day. Why don't you choose to be led by the Spirit and so escape the erratic compulsions of a law-dominated existence?
19-21It is obvious what kind of life develops out of trying to get your own way all the time (no mention of the lust of the flesh): repetitive, loveless, cheap sex; a stinking accumulation of mental and emotional garbage; frenzied and joyless grabs for happiness; trinket gods; magic-show religion; paranoid loneliness; cutthroat competition; all-consuming-yet-never-satisfied wants; a brutal temper; an impotence to love or be loved; divided homes and divided lives; small-minded and lopsided pursuits; the vicious habit of depersonalizing everyone into a rival; uncontrolled and uncontrollable addictions; ugly parodies of community. I could go on (Is this a translation of Greek?).
This isn't the first time I have warned you, you know. If you use your freedom this way, you will not inherit God's kingdom.
22-23But what happens when we live God's way? (No mention of what the Fruit of the Spirit is!) He brings gifts into our lives, much the same way that fruit appears in an orchard—things like affection for others, exuberance about life, serenity. We develop a willingness to stick with things, a sense of compassion in the heart, and a conviction that a basic holiness permeates things and people. We find ourselves involved in loyal commitments, not needing to force our way in life, able to marshal and direct our energies wisely.
23-24Legalism is helpless in bringing this about; it only gets in the way. Among those who belong to Christ, everything connected with getting our own way and mindlessly responding to what everyone else calls necessities is killed off for good—crucified.
25-26Since this is the kind of life we have chosen, the life of the Spirit, let us make sure that we do not just hold it as an idea in our heads or a sentiment in our hearts, but work out its implications in every detail of our lives. That means we will not compare ourselves with each other as if one of us were better and another worse. We have far more interesting things to do with our lives. Each of us is an original. (Nothing about crucifying the flesh, or walking the Spirit, or being envy of one another.)

NKJV:
Bear and Share the Burdens

1 Brethren, if a man is overtaken in any trespass, you who are spiritual restore such a one in a spirit of gentleness, considering yourself lest you also be tempted. 2 Bear one another’s burdens, and so fulfill the law of Christ. 3 For if anyone thinks himself to be something, when he is nothing, he deceives himself. 4 But let each one examine his own work, and then he will have rejoicing in himself alone, and not in another. 5 For each one shall bear his own load.
Be Generous and Do Good


6 Let him who is taught the word share in all good things with him who teaches.
7 Do not be deceived, God is not mocked; for whatever a man sows, that he will also reap. 8 For he who sows to his flesh will of the flesh reap corruption, but he who sows to the Spirit will of the Spirit reap everlasting life.

THE MESSAGE:
1-3 Live creatively, friends. If someone falls into sin, forgivingly restore him, saving your critical comments for yourself. You might be needing forgiveness before the day's out. Stoop down and reach out to those who are oppressed. Share their burdens, and so complete Christ's law. If you think you are too good for that, you are badly deceived.
4-5Make a careful exploration of who you are and the work you have been given, and then sink yourself into that. Don't be impressed with yourself. Don't compare yourself with others. Each of you must take responsibility for doing the creative best you can with your own life.
6Be very sure now, you who have been trained to a self-sufficient maturity, that you enter into a generous common life with those who have trained you, sharing all the good things that you have and experience. (NO mention about being taught HIS WORD!)
7-8Don't be misled: No one makes a fool (Mocking is worse than making a fool of anything!) of God. What a person plants, he will harvest. The person who plants selfishness, ignoring the needs of others—ignoring God!—harvests a crop of weeds. (Where did this translate in the Greek!) All he'll have to show for his life is weeds! (Once again nothing about the lust of flesh!) But the one who plants in response to God, letting God's Spirit do the growth work in him, harvests a crop of real life, eternal life.

 

[ARBITER01]

Oh well I tried...your cat provoked me.


However I don't see any difference between that and pushing your convictions on someone else.

I may have my opinions, but I'm not singling out anyone in the process of stating them here. Some folks may feel I'm directing such things at them personally at times, but that is not the case 9 times out of 10 unless I make it so.

As can be seen from me, It is quite evident I do not accept such versions. I do spend considerable time editing passages and such in our bible, and it is very hard to do such a dedicated and disciplined work to try make something really precise and literal without stepping into personal opinions.

To see someone like Peterson just throw all caution to the wind and piece something together revolving around personal opinions and thoughts, and then call it a bible for the Christian community, is ridiculous in my eyes.

What is even more ridiculous is watching how such a liberal interpretation sells to our community, which only tells me that many folks just want their McBible along with their McPraise, McWorship, and McPreaching. In my opinion, these same folks buying such bibles are the same folks wondering why GOD is not in power in their lives and in their church, and will readily accept anything remotely resembling The Holy Spirit out of desperation.

Of course that is my opinion, but sometimes such things do manifest themselves as truth.

 

[Alpine]

just want their McBible along with their McPraise, McWorship, and McPreaching.

As a frequent McDonald's customer, I Mcresemble that comment!

 

[Leimeng]

~ It seems people are thinking that a paraphrase is a direct literal translation. They are completely different. It also seems that a lot of people have no idea how to actually read the English language. Pity. So caught up in self righteousness. Missing the big picture...
~ Continue to discuss amongst yourselves...

Peace,

Leimeng

Flatulo Ergo Sum ~~~

(***Insert Personal One Liner Here***)

 

[Ajax 777]

which only tells me that many folks just want their McBible along with their McPraise, McWorship, and McPreaching

ROFL!!!!

 

[Redwood]

ROFL!!!!

So you think talking about the Bible is a joke too.

 

[Ajax 777]

So you think talking about the Bible is a joke too.

No, I just found Arbiter's comment funny.

 

[Floatingaxe]

~ It seems people are thinking that a paraphrase is a direct literal translation. They are completely different. It also seems that a lot of people have no idea how to actually read the English language. Pity. So caught up in self righteousness. Missing the big picture...
~ Continue to discuss amongst yourselves...

Peace,

Leimeng

Flatulo Ergo Sum ~~~

(***Insert Personal One Liner Here***)

I agree!

For instance, I am seeing detractors repudiate The Message for non-issues. For instance:

7-8Don't be misled: No one makes a fool (Mocking is worse than making a fool of anything!) of God. What a person plants, he will harvest. The person who plants selfishness, ignoring the needs of others—ignoring God!—harvests a crop of weeds. (Where did this translate in the Greek!) All he'll have to show for his life is weeds! (Once again nothing about the lust of flesh!) But the one who plants in response to God, letting God's Spirit do the growth work in him, harvests a crop of real life, eternal life.

1. Mocking IS making a fool of someone.

2. It is a paraphrase! Not a translation!

3. "Selfishness" is the same as lust of the flesh!

There is nothing there that any reader will miss in the truth of God's Word.

 

[Redwood]

1. Mocking IS making a fool of someone.

Mocking Christians...you should never shoot a mocking Christian.