Oy vey! A talking snake!!

[theFijian]

Why wasn't Eve surprised, or even slightly taken aback, that she was spoken to by a snake?

 

[shernren]

Maybe the world was like Narnia before the Fall. And then animals stopped talking when man sinned.

That's a perfect explanation for the introduction of predation, too. After all, communication breakdowns cause conflict!

 

[TexasSky]

Because it was normal.

The bible says that the snake was considered an intelligent creature.

I suspect that the snake was actually a dragon, which every society has a reference to as being intelligent enough to communicate, and yet, calls it "worm" and "Snake".

 

[shernren]

Personally, when it comes to the flippant side of anti-creationism, I'm more curious to know how Adam figured for the first time that the lions were no longer friendly.

"Here, kitty kitty - OUCH!"

 

[MrSnow]

It may have been an actual reptile, but I tend to not think so. I usually think it was Satan, who is also called "The Serpent".

 

[Donkeytron]

Because it was normal.

The bible says that the snake was considered an intelligent creature.

I suspect that the snake was actually a dragon, which every society has a reference to as being intelligent enough to communicate, and yet, calls it "worm" and "Snake".

I suspect it's actually make-believe. That seems a bit more parsimonious then concluding that it was actually a dragon which had human-like vocal cords.

Besides, who says dragons are smart?

 

[Tinker Grey]

I suspect it's actually make-believe. That seems a bit more parsimonious then concluding that it was actually a dragon which had human-like vocal cords.

Besides, who says dragons are smart?

Tolkien

 

[Dannager]

I suspect it's actually make-believe. That seems a bit more parsimonious then concluding that it was actually a dragon which had human-like vocal cords.

Besides, who says dragons are smart?

Agreed.

 

[GratiaCorpusChristi]

I'm going to go with.... there was no talking snake.

*cue mark kennedy* "That denies the gospel!"

 

[Scotishfury09]

It may have been an actual reptile, but I tend to not think so. I usually think it was Satan, who is also called "The Serpent".

This is a common misconception. Satan as we know him was not developed until the post-exilic community. When the Israelites were under captivity they had enormous theological influence from the Persians and developed the Zoroastrianism concept of duality. That's why the character in Job is called ha satan - "the satan" meaning "the adversary". Even though we have what the NT identifies as being Satan, the serpent in Genesis was nothing of the sort to the Israelites at that time.

 

[billwald]

Eve was a mental midget, child-like. She didn't know good from evil.

Anyone else remember the Star Trek program about the Eden-like planet populated by beautiful but child-like adults? They could do anything as long as they didn't break any rules. If they broke a rule the god of that world might kill the violator. A crewman, while playing with a ball, damages something and is killed for rule breaking.

No one else on this list is glad that A&E got kicked out of the Garden? I think they were living in Hell.

 

[GratiaCorpusChristi]

Eve was a mental midget, child-like. She didn't know good from evil.

Anyone else remember the Star Trek program about the Eden-like planet populated by beautiful but child-like adults? They could do anything as long as they didn't break any rules. If they broke a rule the god of that world might kill the violator. A crewman, while playing with a ball, damages something and is killed for rule breaking.

No one else on this list is glad that A&E got kicked out of the Garden? I think they were living in Hell.

Actually, the church has historically thought of Adam and Eve as having preternatural intelligence.

And way to use a Star Trek episode as your hermeneutical key...

 

[Donkeytron]

Eve was a mental midget, child-like. She didn't know good from evil.

Anyone else remember the Star Trek program about the Eden-like planet populated by beautiful but child-like adults? They could do anything as long as they didn't break any rules. If they broke a rule the god of that world might kill the violator. A crewman, while playing with a ball, damages something and is killed for rule breaking.

No one else on this list is glad that A&E got kicked out of the Garden? I think they were living in Hell.

God help me I actually do remember that episode. I saw it as a kid and thought it was really stupid. Really, really stupid.

 

[theIdi0t]

Why wasn't Eve surprised, or even slightly taken aback, that she was spoken to by a snake?

Perhaps it was her first encounter with a snake, so she might have thought that talking snakes were the norm?

But I'm with the other poster here, and I think the serpent was a dragon, and not a snake, because talking dragons are much more believable.

 

[busterdog]

Because it was normal.

The bible says that the snake was considered an intelligent creature.

I suspect that the snake was actually a dragon, which every society has a reference to as being intelligent enough to communicate, and yet, calls it "worm" and "Snake".

Balaam's ass?

This is not an example of some unknown property of animals, but really just of wierdness that is beyond us.

I have tried to figure out why a species of animal -- the snake would end up being legless on the basis of this chapter. That is probably the biggest problem I have with the passage.

If having an answer for that is a test of hermeneutics, then we have a draw -- since, no evolutionist has any way to make sense of this either. It can't be determined to be "just a metaphor" for anything if it doesn't make sense.

Wierdness can explain most of the rest of it -- as in strange things we simply accept becaues that's what the Word says. As far as satan is concerned, the Bible is reallly about all we have or should want, I suppose. What else do we really know about the devil? Precious little. And that is no barrier to accepting what the Bible teaches about him literally. Why should the idea of a talking snake be much different?

Let's look at other wierd incarnations:

Jud 1:6
And the angels which kept not their first estate, but left their own habitation, he hath reserved in everlasting chains under darkness unto the judgment of the great day.
Jud 1:7
Even as Sodom and Gomorrha, and the cities about them in like manner, giving themselves over to fornication, and going after strange flesh, are set forth for an example, suffering the vengeance of eternal fire.

Now, many TEs will dispute that this, combined with Gen. 6 (the B'nai Elohim) has anything to do with angels becoming incarnate and father children.

The idea of angels incarnating in rebellion is not a problem conceptually to a biblical literalist. Thus, a talking snake.

But, why the curse on all snakes? Is that what it is? Hard to say. I don't have a literalists conclusion on that one. Does that mean it must be just metaphor? I see the argument, but as noted the metaphor doesn't make much sense either.

But, once you have come this far, a number of things become trouble, but other start to make a little more sense.

If angels incarnate, you wonder whether that might have had something to do with the sudden need to cover the privates of Adam and Even in Gen. 3. Sexual harassment might have been involved as one part of the overall problem. These lecherous beings may have been invisible or forbidden until obedience divorced man from God's absolute dominion and protection.

Also involved would be:

Rev 12:10 And I heard a loud voice saying in heaven, Now is come salvation, and strength, and the kingdom of our God, and the power of his Christ: for the accuser of our brethren is cast down, which accused them before our God day and night.

In short, satan may have been the original Freudian, mocking the naked Adam for his many physical, moral, spiritual and mental shortcomings. It sounds stupid, but maybe you don't get all the spam I get, which is clearly demonic in nature. Viagra is just the beginning. Further, sexuality is clearly a device for really heavy duty spiritual bondage. Sexual shame is the first line of defense for the pedophile and exploitation of women in prostitution.

More disturbing is the following:

Gen 3:15 And I will put enmity between thee and the woman, and between thy seed and her seed; it shall bruise thy head, and thou shalt bruise his heel.

As a species problem, what of this seed thing? What does this have to do with the snake now being legless? If you take the notion of incarnation seriously, you now have the notion that seed is not just a spiritual notion, but a genetic one.

Now, I have some of the seed of the ancient Scots in me, but I have never painted myself blue. So, I don't want to hear about all snakes being devils. The nature of corrupt DNA is not a straightforward proposition.

You will also remember the idea that Noah was "perfect in his generations" as background for the flood story. Some suggest, again, genetic corruption requiring a universal flood to destroy either their DNA (but, see Goliath) or their works.

PS What about Jim Morrison? "I am the lizard king. I can do anything. "

 

[Scotishfury09]

PS What about Jim Morrison? "I am the lizard king. I can do anything. "

I always just thought he presumed himself to be a T-Rex.

 

[TexasSky]

I suspect it's actually make-believe. That seems a bit more parsimonious then concluding that it was actually a dragon which had human-like vocal cords.

Besides, who says dragons are smart?

Almost every culture in the world that has a dragon mythos indicates they are intelligent beings.

 

[Dannager]

Almost every culture in the world that has a dragon mythos indicates they are intelligent beings.

Yes, use that bit of supporting evidence as far as it suits you, then ditch it. Ignore the incredible disparity in disposition, description and action between these various myths and their probable foundation in mysterious real-life creatures.

 

[Scotishfury09]

Almost every culture in the world that has a dragon mythos indicates they are intelligent beings.

Could you name a few? I'm not sure I can remember any where the dragon is actually indicated to be intelligent, and Puff the Magic Dragon doesn't count.

 

[busterdog]

Eve was a mental midget, child-like. She didn't know good from evil.

Anyone else remember the Star Trek program about the Eden-like planet populated by beautiful but child-like adults? They could do anything as long as they didn't break any rules. If they broke a rule the god of that world might kill the violator. A crewman, while playing with a ball, damages something and is killed for rule breaking.

No one else on this list is glad that A&E got kicked out of the Garden? I think they were living in Hell.

You must be the man who corrupted Hadleyburg.

(Mark Twain?)

[SIZE=-1]"Lead us into temptation"[/SIZE]