Orthodoxy and Philosophy

[Epiphanius]

Thank you for your post.

I am actually a Physics student, rather than a philosopher, but I do study philosophy in my spare time, have occasionally given talks on apologetics, and know quite a few atheists, who I've enjoyed sparring with from time to time.

I must confess I'd be disappointed if your view on the relationship between faith and reason, theology and philosophy, is really representative of Orthodox opinion. It seems to me that the God who made our minds would not want us to switch them off when it comes to thinking about Him, or embrace any beliefs without using the cognitive equipment that He created. Thinking carefully and rationally seems to me to be a way of glorifying God, and a true religion is surely one which embraces - and gives expression to - our whole humanity.

But I suspect there may be more of a spectrum of opinion on these sorts of questions, as there is among evangelicals, perhaps (?)

"Switching off the mind" is not what (all) of us do. Rather, why try to understand God from an outside philosophy looking in? This is what we do not do. I'm very well read in philosophy and all of that used to have significant influence over my thought and my personal philosophy. Once I became Orthodox, I found what I was trying to find in those other philosophies. I didn't have to "give them up" or stop thinking about them or reading them. But in the end, they just naturally fell by the wayside.

Philosophy is defined as the pursuit of Truth. Well, I have found the truth in Orthodoxy and personally, no longer feel the need to read philosophy (I've read most of the major philosophers anyway) because I have a good idea of what's out there and none of it really compares with the reality of what I've found in Orthodoxy. I think it's not so much that if you become Orthodox you will have to switch off your brain, but more that if you become Orthodox you will realize the futility of using external and worldly rationalist thought to construct an understanding of something that cannot be understood except through divine revelation, guidance from the Holy Spirit and the historical Holy Tradition of the Church. Orthodoxy opens you up to a different sort of thought, and different sort of pursuit for your mind, it's hard to explain, but I will say this, I am more challenged intellectually now than I ever was reading philosophy.

As far as apologetics goes. The Orthodox Church is the home of the first Christian apologists. These people have defended the Church from heresy and outside attacks, people like St. Justin Martyr and St. Athanasius and Blessed Augustine. There is plenty to read written by them and there are more modern apologists out there too. You should read Nihilism by Fr. Seraphim Rose, an apology against the nihilistic philosophy of our modern age. Also, you should read "Christ the Eternal Tao" by Hieromonk Damascene a work that shows parallells between Taoist philosophy and poetry and Old testament prophecy and poetics. These are Orthodox works, and highly intellectual, without looking for understanding from philosophers that do not share our faith.

 

[Barky]

"Switching off the mind" is not what (all) of us do. Rather, why try to understand God from an outside philosophy looking in? This is what we do not do. I'm very well read in philosophy and all of that used to have significant influence over my thought and my personal philosophy. Once I became Orthodox, I found what I was trying to find in those other philosophies. I didn't have to "give them up" or stop thinking about them or reading them. But in the end, they just naturally fell by the wayside.

Philosophy is defined as the pursuit of Truth. Well, I have found the truth in Orthodoxy and personally, no longer feel the need to read philosophy (I've read most of the major philosophers anyway) because I have a good idea of what's out there and none of it really compares with the reality of what I've found in Orthodoxy. I think it's not so much that if you become Orthodox you will have to switch off your brain, but more that if you become Orthodox you will realize the futility of using external and worldly rationalist thought to construct an understanding of something that cannot be understood except through divine revelation, guidance from the Holy Spirit and the historical Holy Tradition of the Church. Orthodoxy opens you up to a different sort of thought, and different sort of pursuit for your mind, it's hard to explain, but I will say this, I am more challenged intellectually now than I ever was reading philosophy.

As far as apologetics goes. The Orthodox Church is the home of the first Christian apologists. These people have defended the Church from heresy and outside attacks, people like St. Justin Martyr and St. Athanasius and Blessed Augustine. There is plenty to read written by them and there are more modern apologists out there too. You should read Nihilism by Fr. Seraphim Rose, an apology against the nihilistic philosophy of our modern age. Also, you should read "Christ the Eternal Tao" by Hieromonk Damascene a work that shows parallells between Taoist philosophy and poetry and Old testament prophecy and poetics. These are Orthodox works, and highly intellectual, without looking for understanding from philosophers that do not share our faith.

This post is phenomenal. This is almost exactly how it is for me as well. It is hard to try to explain it from the outside, just as Epiphanius says. Instead of getting na understanding of all this through talking about it, it is as if we trying to push you towards a particular door, so that entering that door you can have understanding of what's ahppening. This is truly what it boils down to: Orthodoxy is a living experience, and being such it cannot be adequetely described in words.

 

[Spiritus7]

I think it's not so much that if you become Orthodox you will have to switch off your brain, but more that if you become Orthodox you will realize the futility of using external and worldly rationalist thought to construct an understanding of something that cannot be understood except through divine revelation, guidance from the Holy Spirit and the historical Holy Tradition of the Church. Orthodoxy opens you up to a different sort of thought, and different sort of pursuit for your mind, it's hard to explain, but I will say this, I am more challenged intellectually now than I ever was reading philosophy.

Amen to this. I have found this as well; I used to look for answers in Psychology of all things, as well as other places too. It is truly futile to look elsewhere besides the church for answers. Even when I have first entered into Orthodoxy I tried to use rationalism to try to understand it; but realize that everything I have experienced in Orthodoxy is Divine revelation. Glory to God!