Original Sin

[Debi1967]

Oh...I wouldn't say that God darted the term "original" at Adam.

The Word does show what Lucifer did. And the Word is from God.

And the Word shows God confronting Lucifer too.

"till iniquity was found within thee"

So...was sin original to Adam? Or was Adam and Eve the first of mankind to sin and bring it into the world of mankind?

What do you think Original means? Original recipe or something from Kentucky Fried Chicken.....

Original sin is a term we use just like that of the Trinity which also does not appear in the bible but invokes a meaning to something .... it is the title given to the doctrine .... and you are splitting hairs here ....

Who is it that committed the Original sin that cursed mankind? was it lucifer or was it Adam amd Eve? Yes Lucifer also sinned against God, that much is true but at the same time Adam and Eve both had the CHOICE to either choose to eat from the Tree of Knowledge or not ..... THEY were the ones that CHOSE to eat from the forbidden fruit. Just because someone tempts you with something does not automatically mean that the temptation has to be taken or that it is a good thing for you. In this case both of them knew that there would be some consequence and both knew in some fashion that they definitely were not supposed to eat from it and yet they did ....

So, therefore, it is Adam and Eve's sin that has cursed us .... The curse given to Lucifer was something different entirely .... He cursed Lucifer not to death as He speaks not of death to Lucifer but that he is to be restricted to the earthly realm. That is his curse, we know that God will dominate and that God will defeat Lucifer but think of it this way if Lucifer thought of it that way would he have rebelled against God in the first place in Heaven? That is illogical. Therefore, because of this Lucifer has to believe that he can defeat God.

Lovingly In Christ
Debi

 

[mdvaden]

and you are splitting hairs here

Nope. Just sticking to the jot and tittles. The Word is not useful if the jots and titttles are not adhered to. The Word is that precise.

Splitting hairs is like

Ori...ginal

Original comes form origin. It's associated with the idea of "unique". Unique is one of a kind.

The term "original sin" referring to Adam is either true, or a lie.

Is it true that sin was original and unique to Adam? Does the Word from God show that sin never existed before Adam?

What does the Word say? What does the Word not say?

It's different if we say "the original sin of MANKIND" - but that's a vast difference from the phrase "original sin". They are not identical and both can't be equated unless the Word equates them - not a verse, but all the writings of the scripture put together.

Splitting hairs does not exist with the Word. True or false - black or white. There are not two truths. And the line is so fine that it can't be split.

 

[Debi1967]

Nope. Just sticking to the jot and tittles. The Word is not useful if the jots and titttles are not adhered to. The Word is that precise.

Splitting hairs is like

Ori...ginal

Original comes form origin. It's associated with the idea of "unique". Unique is one of a kind.

The term "original sin" referring to Adam is either true, or a lie.

Is it true that sin was original and unique to Adam? Does the Word from God show that sin never existed before Adam?

What does the Word say? What does the Word not say?

It's different if we say "the original sin of MANKIND" - but that's a vast difference from the phrase "original sin". They are not identical and both can't be equated unless the Word equates them - not a verse, but all the writings of the scripture put together.

Splitting hairs does not exist with the Word. True or false - black or white. There are not two truths. And the line is so fine that it can't be split.

God's word is neither black nor white and in many cases has many shades of gray inbetween .....

Now to prove my point let us go back to the Trinity .... show me in black and white only, that God is Trinity.... when you can do that then you shall convince me that everything that God has written is solely black and white .... sometimes it is the implicit and not the explicit that we must also apply to get to the meaning of something .....

 

[Debi1967]

Noun1.explicit definition - a definition that gives an exact equivalent of the term defined definition - a concise explanation of the meaning of a word or phrase or symbol


im·plic·it adj. 1. Implied or understood though not directly expressed.
2. Contained in the nature of something though not readily apparent:

405 Although it is proper to each individual,295 original sin does not have the character of a personal fault in any of Adam's descendants. It is a deprivation of original holiness and justice, but human nature has not been totally corrupted: it is wounded in the natural powers proper to it, subject to ignorance, suffering and the dominion of death, and inclined to sin - an inclination to evil that is called concupiscence". Baptism, by imparting the life of Christ's grace, erases original sin and turns a man back towards God, but the consequences for nature, weakened and inclined to evil, persist in man and summon him to spiritual battle.

http://www.scborromeo.org/ccc/p1s2c1p7.htm#402

 

[Bobby35]

I fellow forumer brought up the idea that the doctrine on original sin or the belief that we are all stained with original sin was "a falacy, a perpetration based on assumption and opinions." I thought this would make for a good and interesting discussion/debate because I don't understand it totally. If you must know what I think I would say I heavily lean towards the belief that we are stained at birth, or conception, with original sin.

The term "original sin", as we are going to discuss in this thread, is not written in scripture. That odviously means that the belief that we are all stained with original sin comes from someones interpretation of scripture. These scriptures in which this interpretation was derived from is what I want to look at and discuss.

I know the doctrine on original sin is what most churches and denominations believe to be absolutely true and that it was discussed and debated and set in stone in the early church, exactly when I don't know. Yet, apparently, there are some who don't agree. I'd love to see what they have to say and how they would show through scripture how they believe the interpretation of scripture that is used to show the truth in original sin is flawed.

I know this will lead to the discuss of the nature of Jesus Christ. I ask that for the time being that we first tackle the job of our original sin first. Thank you

I'm the one who stated that it was a falacy and here is why I believe that. This is a copy of a post that Jimmy West posted recently that is called "The Lowness Doctrine". It is what changed my mind:

There is a basic question that we all need to ask. We need to ask it and fully understand the answer. The question is: “Why did God create us? What is our purpose?” Those who truly understand the character of God realize the basis for everything that he does is love. For love is what He is. Every other characteristic that he has is based on the characteristic of love. If you understand that, you must believe that our creation, the reason that He created Adam, was based on love. Our purpose in being here is that we would be Gods loving family, that he would have somebody to love, and somebody to love him. Family and the family relationship are what God is all about and is evident throughout the Bible.



The Bible states that we were, and are, created in Gods image. That is, we are created to be LIKE him. Of course, we can not be everything that he is, but we can possess his basic character. And his basic character is one of love, goodness, kindness, mercy, patience, tolerance, understanding and joy. His will must be evident to those who profess to know him. If we were created to be like him, then it is his will that we also possess his character.



There is a belief that is prominent in the Christian community that we are born with a sinful nature. It goes beyond that to say that we actually inherit the sin of Adam. There is another belief that works hand-in-hand with the previous two that we are not worthy to have a relationship with God the Father, that we are not worthy to even approach Him.

The truth is that sinfulness, or evilness, or wickedness are not inherited traits. They are not genetic. Ask any psychologist. Ask any psychiatrist. Ask any scientist who studies and researches genetic science. They will all tell you that behaviors are not inherited, but instead, are learned. Sinfulness is something that is learned during our childhood. It is a product of the environment that surrounds us while we grow up. Think about it: If a child grew up in an environment where there was no sin, that child would grow up to be sinless. He would not remain that way, because as soon as he was exposed to the world, which is full of sin, that influence would contaminate his sinless character. Another thing to consider is that God would not continue to create something with the defect of a sinful nature.



So, here it is: We were created to be like God. If you believe that we truly are his children, you can not believe that God would create sinful children.



The problem is that this doctrine of lowness has caused most Christians to dig themselves into a hole. It is a hole where they believe that they belong. They think that they are doomed to this stature due to Adams sin. As they sit in their holes, that remain distant from God. They can neither see nor hear him. As they sit in their holes of deprivation they will say things like: “I am sinful in nature”, “I am evil”, I am not worthy of Gods grace”, “I am not worthy of a relationship with God”. What they say is true, but it is not God, but they themselves who have placed themselves there.

GOD DOES NOT WANT YOU THERE!



Gods will is that you climb out of that hole and clean yourselves up and make yourselves acceptable to him. He wants to have a relationship with you, a relationship of closeness. As long as you stay in that hole and believe that you are not worthy, you WILL NOT BE worthy.



So, how do we become worthy, how do we become acceptable to him? As stated above, we must become like Him. In order to become like Him, it is necessary that we cast aside our flesh and become spiritual in our relationship with him. When we replace our carnality with spirituality, we are listening to the Holy Spirit instead of our animalistic instincts. That is when He can talk to us, for at that time, our spiritual ear is tuned to His spiritual voice. We become one-in-spirit with him.



If you believe that we were meant to be a loving family, then you must believe in a family relationship. A true family relationship is one of closeness, and is based on love and trust. That is what He wants. He can not have a relationship with you while you are sitting in your hole of sinfulness. It is time you climb out now! If you want to bless God in a big way, give him what he wants; you.

 

[Debi1967]

I'm the one who stated that it was a falacy and here is why I believe that. This is a copy of a post that Jimmy West posted recently that is called "The Lowness Doctrine". It is what changed my mind:

There is a basic question that we all need to ask. We need to ask it and fully understand the answer. The question is: “Why did God create us? What is our purpose?” Those who truly understand the character of God realize the basis for everything that he does is love. For love is what He is. Every other characteristic that he has is based on the characteristic of love. If you understand that, you must believe that our creation, the reason that He created Adam, was based on love. Our purpose in being here is that we would be Gods loving family, that he would have somebody to love, and somebody to love him. Family and the family relationship are what God is all about and is evident throughout the Bible.



The Bible states that we were, and are, created in Gods image. That is, we are created to be LIKE him. Of course, we can not be everything that he is, but we can possess his basic character. And his basic character is one of love, goodness, kindness, mercy, patience, tolerance, understanding and joy. His will must be evident to those who profess to know him. If we were created to be like him, then it is his will that we also possess his character.



There is a belief that is prominent in the Christian community that we are born with a sinful nature. It goes beyond that to say that we actually inherit the sin of Adam. There is another belief that works hand-in-hand with the previous two that we are not worthy to have a relationship with God the Father, that we are not worthy to even approach Him.

The truth is that sinfulness, or evilness, or wickedness are not inherited traits. They are not genetic. Ask any psychologist. Ask any psychiatrist. Ask any scientist who studies and researches genetic science. They will all tell you that behaviors are not inherited, but instead, are learned. Sinfulness is something that is learned during our childhood. It is a product of the environment that surrounds us while we grow up. Think about it: If a child grew up in an environment where there was no sin, that child would grow up to be sinless. He would not remain that way, because as soon as he was exposed to the world, which is full of sin, that influence would contaminate his sinless character. Another thing to consider is that God would not continue to create something with the defect of a sinful nature.



So, here it is: We were created to be like God. If you believe that we truly are his children, you can not believe that God would create sinful children.



The problem is that this doctrine of lowness has caused most Christians to dig themselves into a hole. It is a hole where they believe that they belong. They think that they are doomed to this stature due to Adams sin. As they sit in their holes, that remain distant from God. They can neither see nor hear him. As they sit in their holes of deprivation they will say things like: “I am sinful in nature”, “I am evil”, I am not worthy of Gods grace”, “I am not worthy of a relationship with God”. What they say is true, but it is not God, but they themselves who have placed themselves there.

GOD DOES NOT WANT YOU THERE!



Gods will is that you climb out of that hole and clean yourselves up and make yourselves acceptable to him. He wants to have a relationship with you, a relationship of closeness. As long as you stay in that hole and believe that you are not worthy, you WILL NOT BE worthy.



So, how do we become worthy, how do we become acceptable to him? As stated above, we must become like Him. In order to become like Him, it is necessary that we cast aside our flesh and become spiritual in our relationship with him. When we replace our carnality with spirituality, we are listening to the Holy Spirit instead of our animalistic instincts. That is when He can talk to us, for at that time, our spiritual ear is tuned to His spiritual voice. We become one-in-spirit with him.



If you believe that we were meant to be a loving family, then you must believe in a family relationship. A true family relationship is one of closeness, and is based on love and trust. That is what He wants. He can not have a relationship with you while you are sitting in your hole of sinfulness. It is time you climb out now! If you want to bless God in a big way, give him what he wants; you.

One thing this Author failed to mention that are also qualities of God

That he is Just and that He is a Jealous God as well .....

These attributes of God's nature are spoken of just as much in the Bible as well but this author carefully seems not not balance those traits with the traits of God that are Love Mercy and Kindness....

Everything God does is logical and is above our own capablity to properly explain at times as being entirely logical because of course what we as humans with our frailities think of as logic and what God's pure logic is are two completely different things .....

You have taken the word of a man above the word of God which contradicts this man in many places in the Bible, and if one is to believe that the Bible is inerrantly the word of God then we have to believe the word of God above some man's observations or theological viewpoint especially if it does not add up to what is directly and indirectly stated in the Bible ....

If God was so benevolent as this man states then why does God allow for Satan to exist in the first place? If what this man says is true then what happened in the Garden of Eden would never have been allowed to take place by God because He wopuld have intervened then ..... But the fact remains that He did not ....

Now some may say that this means that God is actually then a mean and nasty God but this too is not true. All this means is that He gave us what he did give himself freedom to choose, Free will, and because of that we are created in His image, but we must also then take the consequences for that as well .... God is indeed Loving to those that serve Him as He has protected them and povided for them covenants that cover them....

What you now say though is that He does not have the right because of the sin of Adam and Eve to punish them and their offspring, and this is in His control and should be if He is the Supreme ruler. How does one reign Supreme without having anyone to acknowledge the power He has to be able to do so? This too was not something taken into account by your prolific writer.

God does wish for ALL mankind to be Saved and thus the reason He sent His Son as a means to Redeem us, but it must be our choice and in the words of His Son our Lord and God .....

Mat 25:32 And all nations shall be gathered together before him: and he shall separate them one from another, as the shepherd separateth the sheep from the goats:

Mat 25:33 And he shall set the sheep on his right hand, but the goats on his left.

Mat 25:34 Then shall the king say to them that shall be on his right hand: Come, ye blessed of my Father, possess you the kingdom prepared for you from the foundation of the world.

Mat 25:35 For I was hungry, and you gave me to eat: I was thirsty, and you gave me to drink: I was a stranger, and you took me in:

Mat 25:36 Naked, and you covered me: sick, and you visited me: I was in prison, and you came to me.

Mat 25:37 Then shall the just answer him, saying: Lord, when did we see thee hungry and fed thee: thirsty and gave thee drink?

Mat 25:38 Or when did we see thee a stranger and took thee in? Or naked and covered thee?

Mat 25:39 Or when did we see thee sick or in prison and came to thee?

Mat 25:40 And the king answering shall say to them: Amen I say to you, as long as you did it to one of these my least brethren, you did it to me.

Mat 25:41 Then he shall say to them also that shall be on his left hand: Depart from me, you cursed, into everlasting fire, which was prepared for the devil and his angels.

Mat 25:42 For I was hungry and you gave me not to eat: I was thirsty and you gave me not to drink.

Mat 25:43 I was a stranger and you took me not in: naked and you covered me not: sick and in prison and you did not visit me.

Mat 25:44 Then they also shall answer him, saying: Lord, when did we see thee hungry or thirsty or a stranger or naked or sick or in prison and did not minister to thee?

Mat 25:45 Then he shall answer them, saying: Amen: I say to you, as long as you did it not to one of these least, neither did you do it to me.

Mat 25:46 And these shall go into everlasting punishment: but the just, into life everlasting.

Christ is telling us that many will come and many will say this and that ..... That many will truly believe that they are indeed Saved solely by the fact that they have, In Name ONLY, accepted the Lord but when it came to the fruits spoken of in

Mat 7:14 How narrow is the gate, and strait is the way that leadeth to life: and few there are that find it!

Mat 7:15 Beware of false prophets, who come to you in the clothing of sheep, but inwardly they are ravening wolves.

Mat 7:16 By their fruits you shall know them. Do men gather grapes of thorns, or figs of thistles?

Mat 7:17 Even so every good tree bringeth forth good fruit, and the evil tree bringeth forth evil fruit.

Mat 7:18 A good tree cannot bring forth evil fruit, neither can an evil tree bring forth good fruit.

Mat 7:19 Every tree that bringeth not forth good fruit, shall be cut down, and shall be cast into the fire.

Mat 7:20 Wherefore by their fruits you shall know them.

Mat 7:21 Not every one that saith to me, Lord, Lord, shall enter into the kingdom of heaven: but he that doth the will of my Father who is in heaven, he shall enter into the kingdom of heaven.

Mat 7:22 Many will say to me in that day: Lord, Lord, have not we prophesied in thy name, and cast out devils in thy name, and done many miracles in thy name?

Mat 7:23 And then will I profess unto them, I never knew you: depart from me, you that work iniquity.

The way your Author would have it everyone would be exempt from this judgement simply because of God's Love and Mercy when it directly counteracts the Bible and the words of God himself .....

One must test the words of man against the words of God to know that they are approved and can stand ready and be approved as solid teaching .... What I see is not solid teaching at all .... It countermands the very word of God.

Lovingly In Christ
Debi

 

[sawdust]

I'm the one who stated that it was a falacy and here is why I believe that. This is a copy of a post that Jimmy West posted recently that is called "The Lowness Doctrine". It is what changed my mind:

There is a basic question that we all need to ask. We need to ask it and fully understand the answer. The question is: “Why did God create us? What is our purpose?” Those who truly understand the character of God realize the basis for everything that he does is love. For love is what He is. Every other characteristic that he has is based on the characteristic of love. If you understand that, you must believe that our creation, the reason that He created Adam, was based on love. Our purpose in being here is that we would be Gods loving family, that he would have somebody to love, and somebody to love him. Family and the family relationship are what God is all about and is evident throughout the Bible.



The Bible states that we were, and are, created in Gods image. That is, we are created to be LIKE him. Of course, we can not be everything that he is, but we can possess his basic character. And his basic character is one of love, goodness, kindness, mercy, patience, tolerance, understanding and joy. His will must be evident to those who profess to know him. If we were created to be like him, then it is his will that we also possess his character.



There is a belief that is prominent in the Christian community that we are born with a sinful nature. It goes beyond that to say that we actually inherit the sin of Adam. There is another belief that works hand-in-hand with the previous two that we are not worthy to have a relationship with God the Father, that we are not worthy to even approach Him.

The truth is that sinfulness, or evilness, or wickedness are not inherited traits. They are not genetic. Ask any psychologist. Ask any psychiatrist. Ask any scientist who studies and researches genetic science. They will all tell you that behaviors are not inherited, but instead, are learned. Sinfulness is something that is learned during our childhood. It is a product of the environment that surrounds us while we grow up. Think about it: If a child grew up in an environment where there was no sin, that child would grow up to be sinless. He would not remain that way, because as soon as he was exposed to the world, which is full of sin, that influence would contaminate his sinless character. Another thing to consider is that God would not continue to create something with the defect of a sinful nature.



So, here it is: We were created to be like God. If you believe that we truly are his children, you can not believe that God would create sinful children.



The problem is that this doctrine of lowness has caused most Christians to dig themselves into a hole. It is a hole where they believe that they belong. They think that they are doomed to this stature due to Adams sin. As they sit in their holes, that remain distant from God. They can neither see nor hear him. As they sit in their holes of deprivation they will say things like: “I am sinful in nature”, “I am evil”, I am not worthy of Gods grace”, “I am not worthy of a relationship with God”. What they say is true, but it is not God, but they themselves who have placed themselves there.

GOD DOES NOT WANT YOU THERE!



Gods will is that you climb out of that hole and clean yourselves up and make yourselves acceptable to him. He wants to have a relationship with you, a relationship of closeness. As long as you stay in that hole and believe that you are not worthy, you WILL NOT BE worthy.



So, how do we become worthy, how do we become acceptable to him? As stated above, we must become like Him. In order to become like Him, it is necessary that we cast aside our flesh and become spiritual in our relationship with him. When we replace our carnality with spirituality, we are listening to the Holy Spirit instead of our animalistic instincts. That is when He can talk to us, for at that time, our spiritual ear is tuned to His spiritual voice. We become one-in-spirit with him.



If you believe that we were meant to be a loving family, then you must believe in a family relationship. A true family relationship is one of closeness, and is based on love and trust. That is what He wants. He can not have a relationship with you while you are sitting in your hole of sinfulness. It is time you climb out now! If you want to bless God in a big way, give him what he wants; you.

...and not one scripture to back up his doctrine???

I'll say no more.

peace

 

[mdvaden]

God's word is neither black nor white and in many cases has many shades of gray inbetween .....

Now to prove my point let us go back to the Trinity .... show me in black and white only, that God is Trinity.... when you can do that then you shall convince me that everything that God has written is solely black and white

What makes you so sure that it's not parts of the church, rather than God teaches the trinity? Is God teaching it because you think so?

Back to a lack of understanding about black and white...

2 Peter 1:20

20 Knowing this first, that no prophecy of the scripture is of any private interpretation.

The Word is black and white, not several meanings for each person.

Deuteronomy 12:32

32 What thing soever I command you, observe to do it: thou shalt not add thereto, nor diminish from it.

Gets more black and white with each piece of Word

Nehemiah 8:8-9

8 So they read in the book in the law of God distinctly, and gave the sense, and caused them to understand the reading.

9 And Nehemiah, which is the Tirshatha, and Ezra the priest the scribe, and the Levites that taught the people, said unto all the people, This day is holy unto the LORD your God; mourn not, nor weep. For all the people wept, when they heard the words of the law.

You know who gray area exist for in the Word? Those who don't believe enough to learn that all is black and white. There was gray for these folks in the verse until they were caused to understand

Acts 8:31

31 And he said, How can I, except some man should guide me? And he desired Philip that he would come up and sit with him.

An account of another man who will enter the real world of black and white because he is realistic and knows where he wants to head.

Luke 11:52

52 Woe unto you, lawyers! for ye have taken away the key of knowledge: ye entered not in yourselves, and them that were entering in ye hindered.

That's a group of guys that were in the realm of gray. The Lawyers and Pharisees too, were a group that willed to stay out of the black and white realm of understanding. In it's stead, they formed formulas and teaches of their own, using verses, but in the realm of gray.

 

[Debi1967]

What makes you so sure that it's not parts of the church, rather than God teaches the trinity? Is God teaching it because you think so?

Back to a lack of understanding about black and white...



The Word is black and white, not several meanings for each person.



Gets more black and white with each piece of Word




You know who gray area exist for in the Word? Those who don't believe enough to learn that all is black and white. There was gray for these folks in the verse until they were caused to understand



An account of another man who will enter the real world of black and white because he is realistic and knows where he wants to head.



That's a group of guys that were in the realm of gray. The Lawyers and Pharisees too, were a group that willed to stay out of the black and white realm of understanding. In it's stead, they formed formulas and teaches of their own, using verses, but in the realm of gray.

What do you think your understanding of the Scripture is when you try to render it to another? It is a personal interpretation of what you believe it to be .....................

 

[Debi1967]

2Pe 1:17 For he received from God the Father honour and glory, this voice coming down to him from the excellent glory: This is my beloved Son, in whom I am well pleased. Hear ye him.

2Pe 1:18 And this voice, we heard brought from heaven, when we were with him in the holy mount.

2Pe 1:19 And we have the more firm prophetical word: whereunto you do well to attend, as to a light that shineth in a dark place, until the day dawn and the day star arise in your hearts.

2Pe 1:20 Understanding this first: That no prophecy of scripture is made by private interpretation.

2Pe 1:21 For prophecy came not by the will of man at any time: but the holy men of God spoke, inspired by the Holy Ghost.

It does not say what you are trying to portray my friend by quoting one Scripture out of context.....

What it in fact says is that prophecy does not come by the way of men alone by by the will of God and through the Holy Ghost .... So although you would have us believe by quoting something out context that prophecy does not exist that is not what it is saying at all....

Act 8:27 And rising up, he went. And behold, a man of Ethiopia, an eunuch, of great authority under Candace the queen of the Ethiopians, who had charge over all her treasures, had come to Jerusalem to adore.

Act 8:28 And he was returning, sitting in his chariot and reading Isaias the prophet.

Act 8:29 And the Spirit said to Philip: Go near and join thyself to this chariot.

Act 8:30 And Philip running thither, heard him reading the prophet Isaias. And he said: Thinkest thou that thou understandest what thou readest?

Act 8:31 Who said: And how can I, unless some man shew me? And he desired Philip that he would come up and sit with him.

And your point to this Scripture is what? It means that there has to be one teaching Authority not many ..... you debate me simply because I am Catholic I see and you disagree with the Church so instead of this being about Original sin, you are making this into a debate about the teaching Authority of the Church..... that I believe is called derailing the thread ....

Luk 11:51 From the blood of Abel unto the blood of Zacharias, who was slain between the altar and the temple. Yea I say to you: It shall be required of this generation.

Luk 11:52 Woe to you lawyers, for you have taken away the key of knowledge. You yourselves have not entered in: and those that were entering in, you have hindered.

Luk 11:53 And as he was saying these things to them, the Pharisees and the lawyers began violently to urge him and to oppress his mouth about many things,

Luk 11:54 Lying in wait for him and seeking to catch something from his mouth, that they might accuse him.

Who was he talking to but the Pharisees.... sneaky but effective but it also will not work either ....

Back to Original Sin please

 

[calidog]

I have a few questions:

1. Does the Bible say we are all sinners, or does it just simply say that all have sinned?

2. Is the sinful nature a state of being or a sin?

3. Did all humankind really inherit Adam's sin, or did we inherit the penality for his sin?

1. We have all sinned. Only a sinner can sin.
2. The sinful nature is natural.
3. We inherited sin from Adam. The penalty is death.