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Okay, mature singles...

miss-a

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Huddle up...because if there's an area where this mature girl, whom folks often call wise, feels unschooled, new and possibly from another planet, I think this would be it. So, I'd appreciate your wise opinions.

Just when I was thinking I had this thing down, a conversation with a friend has caused me to question it. I've spoken to the Lord, and I'm not yet sure what He's saying, and I think considering other peeps opinions can sometimes help discern that. So what I thought I had down was that the healthy, mature, accepting, even holy way to handle the somewhat regularly repeating pattern of meeting an interesting man, thinking he's interested, being approachable and friendly enough to help him be at ease--and then never being asked out, was to assume he was not interested, that I'd mistaken a friendly brother for a possible suitor, to live with that, and still be kind and friendly, keeping him in the he's-not-interested-in-me-on-that-way catagory. and I even thought I was applying some humility in thinking maybe I need to accept that I'm not as great a catch as I thought I would be.

The holy part, I thought, was to be accepting and trust that God has His reasons for this extended time alone. The part that last night's conversation has me re-thinking is that my friend brought up that one or more of these guys may actually be interested but so bruised from divorce or othe life events that they don't dare to pursue or have been left feeling like they have nothing to offer. Well, part of me wants to just toss it all into the very easy compartment, a statement that I've heard said, "Men go after what they want." It's actually gotten rather easy to accept. And so I put it together with the other point and added my own addendum, "If they really found me interesting or worth it, they'd pursue me, in spite of their bruises."

Having said all that, the friend who brought this up is currently in a crisis of faith, so her relationship with the Lord is nominal. I know I can't take her counsel as gospel, but truthfully, I think I kind of want to believer her, at least the part about me not being invisible to men. And I'm not sure how I feel about the rest of it or what a girl is supposed to do with.

Meanwhile, one of them moved far away on a temporary assignment. Before he left he hugged me a bunch of times and told me his contact info was on facebook. Admittedly unfamiliar with dating rules, I took that to be a bit of a testing of the waters on his part. I, being rather shy, thought this might be an easier way to get to know him better, you know less risky for each of us. While on a layover on his way out of the country, he responded to my facebook friend request and sent a note again saying that his contact info was posted on fb. So, a big move for me, I sent him an email a few days after he'd have reached his destination. He responded a week later and among other things asked if I could get the pastor's email. I had it and sent it immediately, and told him I'd be back in touch and say more when I had more time. But then when he didn't respond even briefly to the second email, I just let it go, feeling like I might be a pest. I mean he didn't acknowledge getting the email address, and it seems to me that that would have been a good opportunity for him to maintain contact. I'm not offended and thought the mature and brotherly love thing to do is accept it. So he went in the he's-not-interested category, where he remained until my friend said that last night. Now, he's filed under h for "Huh?"

So, right now I'm very grateful for the Bible verses that remind me that the things I go through lots of other peeps do too. I feel, well, like I dropped in from another planet and the map incinerated on contact. How does one know how to navigate the world of mature Christian dating and mating? Could it be that we've all had bad experiences that left us all frozen in time, so no one's doing or saying what they really would like to do and say? And if so, what's a girl to do with that.

Any thoughts, gang.
 
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blackribbon

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You have discovered the great truth about love...Christian or otherwise...it doesn't follow any rules. Each of us is individual and the older we get, the more times we have been hurt. It is normal human behavior to try to prevent being hurt and build whatever walls we need to survive. So your friend is correct that even many men may not have the strength or courage to let a woman know they are interested...especially if life has them doubting their own value.

Now complicate this a little further, and realize that one day an individual may feel more confident with themselves and willing to stretch a little more...then when the sun sets or the next day arrives, that courage or little bit of self-esteem fades away.

Also, realize that this gentleman may also really be highly stressed or very busy and choose not to complicate his mind with emotional matters that cannot be addressed while he is overseas.

How do you know?...you don't. Love in our society requires taking a risk.

My advice would be to try to not expect too much but at the same time, offer friendship and encouragement on a level that feels appropriate for the situation.
 
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dayhiker

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Miss-a ... what you describe sounds very reasonable to me. Only think I'd say to change is instead on one email send two before you wait for a replay or put them in the not interested category.
I agree that men are hurt and some tho not all are not willing to make a commitment. I think that is true of women as well. Then I meet some that are so lonely that they will do pretty much what every is needed to get a guys attention.

You probably know that I don't consider sex before marriage a sin. So I often don't look to women in church for relationships as I figure they will only want to date and hold hands. But I am running into a lot of Christian ladies that aren't attending church much. Also meeting ladies that while not against God are looking to other things to meet needs in their life that they weren't getting at church. Its been a real education to me to be out dating a lot of women over the last 1.5 yrs. Its also given me a change to testify of my love for Jesus.

All that says as black commented that there isn't any simple rule that explains where men are are or were women are at.

I've been working on communication and so I talk with women way more than I used to. I talk to tell them were I'm at and hear where they are at. If they don't tell me, I ask. Its the only way I know to know. Just guessing is really for me to be left ignorant about what they other person is thinking or what they want in their life. If nothing else I've had some great conversations with people that I'd never have had if I didn't get alone with them to ask them what I wanted to know.
 
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Doctor Strangelove

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Miss-a, I think by now you should send him another e-mail, just a brief one asking him how things are going. If he is really interested he should reply. Suppose he is really, really busy. I can only say what I would do. If I were on some trip and very busy, and someone wrote to me and I was interested, but I was busy, then I would reply, saying that I am very busy now but I would like to talk about the trip when I got back. I would probably mention something interesting about my trip. That way, she would know that "See you later" meant "Let's talk when I return" and not, "Don't call me, I'll (probably not) call you."

If someone does not seem to show much interest, I am quick to assume that she isn't interested. I try to take into account shyness, caution, etc. But I think, especially for a guy, there is a thin line between persistence and creepiness. I have probably erred on the side of caution more often than not, but I would rather respect boundaries and I am not good at guessing games. I could praise myself about how "honest" I am, but probably I am just inept at reading signals.
 
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dayhiker

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Doc .. I hear you on reading signals .... Tho I do feel that I'm finally making some progress on reading signals. Its taken years of work to get this figured out so that I'm finally having some success. Ok, quite a bit of success right now. But I enjoyed the work and the results are even better.
 
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miss-a

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I wanted to let you all know you've been very helpful. I guess I wanted it to be black and white, "He loves me, he loves me not." It's just not that simple anymore, is it?

So, I have a bit of a respiratory infection right now which makes thinking straight rather challenging, but when it's gone and I can reason this through with the Lord again, I may send another email. Where this man has not shown back up at church, this means he made it through his probationary period and is fully accepted for the job now, so a congrats message would be completely appropriate, I think, or might think if I could think right now.

So thank you. And heads-up! If I write to him again, I might need to hear from you again!
 
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memoriesbymichelle

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I wanted to let you all know you've been very helpful. I guess I wanted it to be black and white, "He loves me, he loves me not." It's just not that simple anymore, is it?

So, I have a bit of a respiratory infection right now which makes thinking straight rather challenging, but when it's gone and I can reason this through with the Lord again, I may send another email. Where this man has not shown back up at church, this means he made it through his probationary period and is fully accepted for the job now, so a congrats message would be completely appropriate, I think, or might think if I could think right now.

So thank you. And heads-up! If I write to him again, I might need to hear from you again!

So he got a job working in another country?
 
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blackribbon

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It is also potentially time to just build a friendship based on encouragement. Online friendships means you can say "hi" when is convenient for you and he can read when is convenient for him. As good as this job is, he has to feel some loneliness being in a foreign country. So write him some regular chit-chatty little hellos. One year means no weirdness about "expectations". Plenty of time to build a friendship.

I am guessing that he hasn't responded partially because he thinks it wouldn't be fair to you with him being out of country for so long. I suspect that maybe it is exactly what might be good for you...slow and gentle...with no need to determine 'where are we going with this". The answer is "just friends"....for a year. :)
 
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dayhiker

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God to love your attitude when you are happy for the opportunity he has when its might not be what you would like.

I agree, I love web friends. When I was you a few friends had pen pals, they were looked on in very positive way, but now some don't look at web friends that positive. But they have added a lot to my life. So keep a dialogue going I say.
 
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miss-a

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It is also potentially time to just build a friendship based on encouragement. Online friendships means you can say "hi" when is convenient for you and he can read when is convenient for him. As good as this job is, he has to feel some loneliness being in a foreign country. So write him some regular chit-chatty little hellos. One year means no weirdness about "expectations". Plenty of time to build a friendship.

I am guessing that he hasn't responded partially because he thinks it wouldn't be fair to you with him being out of country for so long. I suspect that maybe it is exactly what might be good for you...slow and gentle...with no need to determine 'where are we going with this". The answer is "just friends"....for a year. :)

That's right, and pretty much the direction I was headed until the email wasn't responded to. I thought it was kind of a safe, no pressure way to get to know one another as friends.. Then, as I said in my original post, I thought I might be being a pest, so I never wrote back. But your first reply really helped me. I see I can't be that black and white about it. And, of course satan knows this is a weak area for me, so he started vomiting his lies all over it.

So now I just need to spend some more time talking to the Lord about it, and about my stuff in general in relation to relationships and loneliness and all of that. That way whatever happens, it will be okay. I may or may not end up with a new friend or a new man in my life, but I will end up closer to the Lord and more whole, and clearer about things. But, I have to say, it would be nice to have and be a new friend.

Meanwhile, thanks so much for your input. It's nice having you, and the whole gang here as new friends! And you do give good advice. I bet you're a super mom!
 
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miss-a

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God to love your attitude when you are happy for the opportunity he has when its might not be what you would like.

I agree, I love web friends. When I was you a few friends had pen pals, they were looked on in very positive way, but now some don't look at web friends that positive. But they have added a lot to my life. So keep a dialogue going I say.

Yes, I'd really be okay with that. I get a lot, and try to give as well, from converstations here on the forum.
 
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OP> "Huddle up...because if there's an area [...]"

It's late, but here are a few thoughts that may or may not help. I'm sure much will repeat what others have said.

1. This problem has been going forever, so you've got the company of (and I'm sure sympathy of) hundreds of millions of other women. The dead ones, too -- spiritually.

2. Some men are too shy and will never ask anyone out. The problem is, you can't tell who they are. Against their own wills they sometimes masquerade as jerks and buttholes because (again, subconsciously) that guarantees distance. Sometimes they masquerade as "all business, no emotion" even though inside there's a voice screaming at them 24x7 that this is wrong, wrong, wrong.

3. Some men have been burned too many times and will never again ask anyone out. On a case-by-case basis, it's a combination (in varying degrees) of:

a) self-preservation,

b) punishing subsequent women for what previous women "did" to them (and typically that premise is total bs because it was mostly self-inflicted),

c) punishing themselves for mistakes they've made in the past,

d) sadistic streak: "I know she wants me. I think I'll just watch her squirm."

4. Some men have no "date money" left after the divorce & child support.

5. Some men just don't care -- whether it's never did care, or used to previously but don't any more.

6. Some men never got the hang of dating or even asking women out, and so missed out on the whole deal.

7. Some men would like to date & have romantic companionship, but for a Christian, the proper context for that is only in marriage. But if the man is a Christian and doesn't ever want to get married, then what possible point could there be to asking someone out? Why even go there.

8. Some men assume every woman wants to have babies. So for a Christian man who believes marriage is the proper context for any romantic companionship, and would like to be married, what would be the point of asking someone out? Again, why even go there.

9. Some men want as little personal responsibility as possible and know that a serious relationship, let alone marriage, would be the end of it.

10. Some men just don't "get" women and the rewards of the (often strongly) chemical but non-sexual gifts they bring to the table.

11. Some men do, and it scares the living crap out of them. The vulnerability thing.

Probably lots more.

Hope this helped brighten your day, lol .......
 
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dayhiker

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very good list, Bass.
I know a man who told me he stopped dating because he too a couple Christian ladies out thinking it would just be nice to go out as friends and hang out, but the next time he saw them it was like they thought they were going steady.
 
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