OCD/Scrup/unbelief thoughts

[Christian-Catholic]

Hi Christian Catholic,

Hope all is going well and goes well. Hope you had a good day today. I love how you take time to praise God throughout your moments of peace. Sometimes I find myself thinking, hey, my brain is actually quite and I thank God and it used to bring more thoughts, and that would become frustrating but He knows. These thoughts can really wear you thin, especially the thoughts of doubt because all you want to do even if you don't have all the answers is believe and all they seem to want to do is want proof and its straining. But I'm just glad to know that we serve an awesome God whose gifts are for everyone. In this battle, hold onto your faith, and try not to focus on what you can't do, but what the Lord can and will do through you and for you. Praying =] Take it day by day .

Mathew 21: 22 And all things, whatsoever ye shall ask in prayer, believing, ye shall receieve.

Thank you KayKay and ShelovesChrist for your prayers.
I called the pastor but he wasnt there (so I left a message and marked it urgent and private,maybe he is on easter vacation still) so I will call him again tomorrow. The thoughts seem to be more intense now then ever and you are right SheLovesChrist the thoughts are trying even more to demand proof and try to get me not to believe, but like I said I would rather die then stop believing. SheLovesChrist I am so sorry that you are going through this. If you ever need to talk you have a friend now (that goes for everyone here). Right now I cant do anything but pray and hold on. These have been the darkest 3 months of my life. Today I asked god to take away the last 6 months from me. I wish it never happened

Only thing that helped a bit was to listen to pastor melissa scott the other day talking about the resurrection of Jesus. She is really good.

 

[shelovesChrist]

No problem Christian-Catholic,

we have to be here for one another and encourage and support one another. Since Easter Sunday when I was filled with the Holy Spirit I've been feeling so much better. Mind clear and the thoughts that do come, just don't matter, like it's like I know that the Lord is bigger than them. They don't frighten me. Some of us are over this and some are still struggling, but I still remember the anguish and pain and lost days and squirmish nights, ugh, I hate to even remember. But I know your pain and I'm going to try my best to be here for you and encourage you. It's a blessing that we are able to talk because just the thought of not being connected with this forum, and feeling alone. There were days where I felt alone and I remember you guys, and it felt good to know I wasn't the only one going through it and that I wasn't crazy. The Lord is proud of you that despite what's thrown at you, you are continuing on, even if you don't feel good and that's wonderful. He has you in His hand, and you can't be plucked. Try to hold onto that when the thoughts flare, that your situation is only temporary because the Lord has never and will never fail. Hope your day is blessed and continue to read and praise and pray in spite of. Praying.

John 10

27: My sheep hear my voice, and I know them, and they follow me:
28 And I give unto them eternal life; and they shall never perish, neither shall any man pluck them out of my hand.
29 My Father, which gave them me, is greater than all; and no man is able to pluck them out of my Father's hand.
30 I and my Father are one.

 

[Christian-Catholic]

Well, I had a phone consultation with the pastor , and I dont think im going to see him. He basically told me that Jesus is ok with me having doubts and I have to learn to live with them, even though I told him that these dont seem like my thoughts and these are thoughts I dont want and I am having panic attacks.
Back to square one. It seems like the non-christian hypnotherapist nailed the problem better then this guy.
This is just frustrating

 

[kaykay9.0]

Well, I had a phone consultation with the pastor , and I dont think im going to see him. He basically told me that Jesus is ok with me having doubts and I have to learn to live with them, even though I told him that these dont seem like my thoughts and these are thoughts I dont want and I am having panic attacks.
Back to square one. It seems like the non-christian hypnotherapist nailed the problem better then this guy.
This is just frustrating

Well, bummer. A lot of counselors don't understand OCD, especially religious OCD. And not all counselors are created equal. And some may be good but you just don't have a rapport with them. You have to find someone that understands OCD and kinda knows how to scratch where you itch, so to speak. Don't give up. I'm know it's frustrating. Just keep looking for the right person. They don't have to be perfect in every respect, but you need to find someone who YOU feel has the ability to help you.

 

[Christian-Catholic]

Thanks Kaykay, the same evening my friend took me to a school counselor who stayed with us for an hour and in her opinion it is really me having those thoughts and all I have to do is believe and it will go away, and that OCD is a man made label. Suffice to say that I felt even worse. I have since went back to my uncle and called the therapist that he originally recommended. WE still have to process my insurance since it is the weekend so I will probably see him sometime this weekend.

 

[gracealone]

Wow!!
I'm so sorry you had that horrendous experience. It's bad enough to deal with our own self accusations that this disorder causes let alone having someone say something so hurtful. This person is wholly uneducated about the nature of anxiety disorders. I know it's hard but you have to completely ignore and set aside her counsel because it is based in ignorance.
The thoughts are uncontrolled events and so is your intense emotional reaponse to them. Nearly everyone experiences strange unwanted/intrusive thoughts from time to time but most people don't have OCD so their brain doesn't overeact to them because they don't have an inappropriate amount of fight or flight chemistry egging the thoughts on. All illnesses are given names or "labels" or else we wouldn't have a way to describe or speak of them. These disorders are real and the mental pain they cause is excruciating. If this person continues to give such irresponsibe and ill advised advice to students suffering from real mental disorders she is in danger of doing great harm to them. It's completely shocking to me!
Actually the Pastor even though he may not understand OCD at least gets it that the doubts are meaningless and that they are best ignored.
I'll be praying for you that your next appointment will go better. Hang in there... this too shall pass.
Mitzi

Thanks Kaykay, the same evening my friend took me to a school counselor who stayed with us for an hour and in her opinion it is really me having those thoughts and all I have to do is believe and it will go away, and that OCD is a man made label. Suffice to say that I felt even worse. I have since went back to my uncle and called the therapist that he originally recommended. WE still have to process my insurance since it is the weekend so I will probably see him sometime this weekend.

 

[gracealone]

PS.
I just wanted to add that Dr. Phillipson of ocdonline.com would be quick to point out to this ill informed woman that you do not have a "thought disorder - you have an anxiety disorder." That is why the thoughts plague you. Your brain is already primed to over react to the intrusive thoughts/images. That's why they are stuck in there.
Sigh.... I can't stand that you had to experience this. I feel tremendous empathy for you. None of this is your fault any more than if you had diabetes or high blood pressure.
praying.. Mitzi

Wow!!
I'm so sorry you had that horrendous experience. It's bad enough to deal with our own self accusations that this disorder causes let alone having someone say something so hurtful. This person is wholly uneducated about the nature of anxiety disorders. I know it's hard but you have to completely ignore and set aside her counsel because it is based in ignorance.
The thoughts are uncontrolled events and so is your intense emotional reaponse to them. Nearly everyone experiences strange unwanted/intrusive thoughts from time to time but most people don't have OCD so their brain doesn't overeact to them because they don't have an inappropriate amount of fight or flight chemistry egging the thoughts on. All illnesses are given names or "labels" or else we wouldn't have a way to describe or speak of them. These disorders are real and the mental pain they cause is excruciating. If this person continues to give such irresponsibe and ill advised advice to students suffering from real mental disorders she is in danger of doing great harm to them. It's completely shocking to me!
Actually the Pastor even though he may not understand OCD at least gets it that the doubts are meaningless and that they are best ignored.
I'll be praying for you that your next appointment will go better. Hang in there... this too shall pass.
Mitzi

 

[kaykay9.0]

Thanks Kaykay, the same evening my friend took me to a school counselor who stayed with us for an hour and in her opinion it is really me having those thoughts and all I have to do is believe and it will go away, and that OCD is a man made label. Suffice to say that I felt even worse. I have since went back to my uncle and called the therapist that he originally recommended. WE still have to process my insurance since it is the weekend so I will probably see him sometime this weekend.

Yeah, as Mitzi said this woman's opinion is just based in ignorance and lack of experience with those who battle OCD. A lot of people don't understand it. OCD may indeed be a man made "label" but it describes a real set of symptoms. Actually, it was a counselor who "diagnosed" me with OCD. I was not there to see her for that per se, but she fairly quickly recognized it because of her experience with others she had counseled. She explained to me that Christians with OCD will usually obsess primarily about religious issues, not germs, and other things because their faith is what is most important to them. (I had never even told this counselor that as a child I had the "classic" germ/handwashing obsession/compulsion!) I knew I battled various issues over the years, but I didn't make the connection till then that yes, I did show clear evidence of OCD as a child and that as a Christian adult the battles had just morphed into the spiritual realm but I was still fighting the same enemy. It has helped me immensely just to realize what I'm battling. Hope that makes sense.

 

[Christian-Catholic]

Thank you Mitzi and KayKay for your words of wisdom and empathy. It seems like each day gets worse, but Im glad that im finally going to a professional soon. The only reason I didnt make an appointment earlier with this therapist is that my dad was afraid of me getting on any medications. Finally my dad realized the seriousness of this problem and was cool with it. The only reason I value his opinion is that I know he loves me unconditionally and wants to see me happy.

I will also see the original hypnotherapist this week too (but I will take my dad with me just to be on the safe side that unwanted thoughts arent placed in my head during the trance like state) because he also hit the nail right on the head when he told me that I was stuck in flight or fight mode and that he can help bring me out of that and the obsessive analytical state that I am in.

Words cannot explain how much all you guys have helped me. I really dont know where I would be without this forum and all of you.
God bless you all

Wow!!
I'm so sorry you had that horrendous experience. It's bad enough to deal with our own self accusations that this disorder causes let alone having someone say something so hurtful. This person is wholly uneducated about the nature of anxiety disorders. I know it's hard but you have to completely ignore and set aside her counsel because it is based in ignorance.
The thoughts are uncontrolled events and so is your intense emotional reaponse to them. Nearly everyone experiences strange unwanted/intrusive thoughts from time to time but most people don't have OCD so their brain doesn't overeact to them because they don't have an inappropriate amount of fight or flight chemistry egging the thoughts on. All illnesses are given names or "labels" or else we wouldn't have a way to describe or speak of them. These disorders are real and the mental pain they cause is excruciating. If this person continues to give such irresponsibe and ill advised advice to students suffering from real mental disorders she is in danger of doing great harm to them. It's completely shocking to me!
Actually the Pastor even though he may not understand OCD at least gets it that the doubts are meaningless and that they are best ignored.
I'll be praying for you that your next appointment will go better. Hang in there... this too shall pass.
Mitzi

 

[Christian-Catholic]

Yeah, as Mitzi said this woman's opinion is just based in ignorance and lack of experience with those who battle OCD. A lot of people don't understand it. OCD may indeed be a man made "label" but it describes a real set of symptoms. Actually, it was a counselor who "diagnosed" me with OCD. I was not there to see her for that per se, but she fairly quickly recognized it because of her experience with others she had counseled. She explained to me that Christians with OCD will usually obsess primarily about religious issues, not germs, and other things because their faith is what is most important to them. (I had never even told this counselor that as a child I had the "classic" germ/handwashing obsession/compulsion!) I knew I battled various issues over the years, but I didn't make the connection till then that yes, I did show clear evidence of OCD as a child and that as a Christian adult the battles had just morphed into the spiritual realm but I was still fighting the same enemy. It has helped me immensely just to realize what I'm battling. Hope that makes sense.

KayKay that makes total sense to me. I guess you understand that when the doubts get inflamed so large that at times your not sure that if they are you or they are the thoughts. The one factor that I cling to is that when I was having the debates there were no thoughts like this. It was only after I left the debates because of the nervous episode that was going through that I felt this at all. It gets so bad that Im praying to god to bring back what I lost, that im so scared of losing my faith even though I know these thoughts didnt come until that nervous episode happened.
On a good note, im talking my cousins, nieces and nephews to church today right next to the beach.

I will continue to pray throughout this.
Thanks KayKay and everyone for not ignoring my rambling posts
God bless

 

[kaykay9.0]

I'm glad you're Dad is on board with you getting some help now. I still don't know if I think the hypnosis session will help if I'm honest here, but hey, I could be wrong. I think it is good that you are continuing to be pro-active about seeking some treatment, even though you have had some setbacks. I think you will hit on the right combination of therapy for yourself if you don't give up! Wishing you the best and praying for your success!

 

[Christian-Catholic]

Thank you KayKay for the kind words. I just heard from my dad that my mom went behind my back and talked to a psychiatrist at my moms church (very hardcore, extremist church) and she was telling my mom that this is simply the devil and that even my dad was starting to believe this. This is the same mom that was arguing for hours each day with me for 3 months during my panic attacks. Im going to press through despite what she is trying to do. You guys have to understand this church to understand these people. From now on I will ignore all of their advice and press on in getting real help from a real therapist. These people are starting to remind me of the quackers when their were buring people at the stake simple for accusing them of being witches.

I'm glad you're Dad is on board with you getting some help now. I still don't know if I think the hypnosis session will help if I'm honest here, but hey, I could be wrong. I think it is good that you are continuing to be pro-active about seeking some treatment, even though you have had some setbacks. I think you will hit on the right combination of therapy for yourself if you don't give up! Wishing you the best and praying for your success!

 

[shelovesChrist]

Hey Christian-Catholic,

I hope your day is going better. Just from reading your posts I can only imagine the confusion and frustration that you're going through. It's so hard dealing with these thoughts because like you said you're so scared of losing your faith. As I was. The only thing I wanted to do was believe and the thoughts seemed to be trying to do the opposite. Doubts everytime I read the Bible, aggression when I try to do good, but you know, the Lord understands more than we do and He knows our heart and He sees you're trying to get help and do everything you can. But every battle is not ours to fight and sometimes we just have to sit and hold onto our faith. We know the Lord never fails and that we can't be plucked out His hands. I just know that it felt like no one understood me sometimes, that I had no one to talk to, but don't forget that the Lord understands all and those moments where it feels like no one is listening and that some might get it, but not get everything, get on your knees and talk to Him. He has the time, He has the love and compassion and mercy, and He is the answer. And as I always say, He is happy, that in spite of what's thrown at you, that you refuse to let these thoughts get in the way and that shows how much you love Him. Stay strong and stay encouraged. And despite where they come from, you know that they are not what you want and how you want to think. He knows this because He knows your heart. Keep coming to Him.

Mathew 17

14 And when they were come to the multitude, there came to him a certain man, kneeling down to him, and saying,
15 Lord, have mercy on my son: for he is lunatick, and sore vexed: for oftimes he falleth into the fire, and oft into the water.
16 And I brought him to thy disciples, and they could not cure him.
17 Then Jesus answered and said, O faithless and perverse generation, how long shall I be with you? how long shall I suffer you? bring him hither to me.
18 And Jesus rebuked the devil; and he departed out of him: and the child was cured from that very hour.
19 Then came the disciples to Jesus apart, and said, Why could not we cast him out?
20 And Jesus said unto them, Because of your unbelief: for verily I say unto you, If ye have faith as a grain of mustard seed, ye shall say unto this mountain, Remove hence to younder place; and it shall remove; and nothing shall be impossible unto you.
21 Howbeit this kind goeth not out but by prayer and fasting.

I'm not saying you are demon possessed, I gave you this scripture because it shows how key faith is in tough situations, and how the Lord, despite what others can't do, can heal and has the power. Praying for you.

 

[Christian-Catholic]

Hey Christian-Catholic,

I hope your day is going better. Just from reading your posts I can only imagine the confusion and frustration that you're going through. It's so hard dealing with these thoughts because like you said you're so scared of losing your faith. As I was. The only thing I wanted to do was believe and the thoughts seemed to be trying to do the opposite. Doubts everytime I read the Bible, aggression when I try to do good, but you know, the Lord understands more than we do and He knows our heart and He sees you're trying to get help and do everything you can. But every battle is not ours to fight and sometimes we just have to sit and hold onto our faith. We know the Lord never fails and that we can't be plucked out His hands. I just know that it felt like no one understood me sometimes, that I had no one to talk to, but don't forget that the Lord understands all and those moments where it feels like no one is listening and that some might get it, but not get everything, get on your knees and talk to Him. He has the time, He has the love and compassion and mercy, and He is the answer. And as I always say, He is happy, that in spite of what's thrown at you, that you refuse to let these thoughts get in the way and that shows how much you love Him. Stay strong and stay encouraged. And despite where they come from, you know that they are not what you want and how you want to think. He knows this because He knows your heart. Keep coming to Him.

Mathew 17

14 And when they were come to the multitude, there came to him a certain man, kneeling down to him, and saying,
15 Lord, have mercy on my son: for he is lunatick, and sore vexed: for oftimes he falleth into the fire, and oft into the water.
16 And I brought him to thy disciples, and they could not cure him.
17 Then Jesus answered and said, O faithless and perverse generation, how long shall I be with you? how long shall I suffer you? bring him hither to me.
18 And Jesus rebuked the devil; and he departed out of him: and the child was cured from that very hour.
19 Then came the disciples to Jesus apart, and said, Why could not we cast him out?
20 And Jesus said unto them, Because of your unbelief: for verily I say unto you, If ye have faith as a grain of mustard seed, ye shall say unto this mountain, Remove hence to younder place; and it shall remove; and nothing shall be impossible unto you.
21 Howbeit this kind goeth not out but by prayer and fasting.

I'm not saying you are demon possessed, I gave you this scripture because it shows how key faith is in tough situations, and how the Lord, despite what others can't do, can heal and has the power. Praying for you.

Thanks you so much ShelovesChrist for your encouraging words, and yes that is exactly what im going through now at almost every part of my day,all I can do now as you said is to try to get help and hold onto my faith even though these thoughts are trying every trick in the book(doubts, side, stomach and lower chest pains from stress etc etc) to change my mind. I thank god for all of you folks that have been in this dark abyss and understand this so well. I just wish my dad or mom could have understood it better. I have to also wait till my bro and mom are gone because they will try to listen in on my phone conversations. Im trying my best to hold onto my faith and will do so no matter what. The ocd knows this and keys on this even more

I pray to the lord each day despite these thoughts and feelings and im asking him to show me what I must do now
Thank you so much for your prayers

 

[kaykay9.0]

Are your parents also catholic? I'm assuming that they are. I was just remembering that I read a book about religious OCD and it was written by a catholic author. It was good for anyone to read but it did have a catholic perspective. Given that, I was wondering if it might be helpful for your mother and father to read that book and you too for that matter. Might give them more understanding of what you are battling. The name of the book was The Doubting Disease:help for Scrupulosity and Religious Compulsions. Author is Joseph Ciarrocchi. (Even though it doesn't use the term OCD in the title, that is what the book is referring to.) It's a bit clinical, but still has some good info in my opinion. I know it could be obtained on www.amazon.com if nowhere else. Just a thought....

 

[Christian-Catholic]

Hello KayKay, yes my parents are catholic and so am I, but im not what you would call a hardcore catholic (my mom is). My uncle and I watch Joel Olsteen and others all the time and I absolutely love the positive message he brings. There is a reason why I chose the screen name that I have. It means that I have gained a new love and respect for all of my christian brothers and sisters everywhere.

My old bible study teacher was a hard-hard-hardcore catholic and he said some things about non catholics that My heart and soul couldnt agree with (thus I dont go to his biblestudies anymore). I recently went to my first non demoninational bible study and it was the most wonderful experience I have had in a bible study. There was no judging, no finger pointing, no gossip and no hatred. Just openess, a close atmosphere and prayer. Everyone presented their problems and we all prayed for them. I was very touched and very moved.

Kaykay , I will do a search on that book, the fact that it may be clinical might be a good thing for me right now. I have got enough "quakers" in my family thinking that "Foosball is from the debil" as adam sandler would say. I really need some good clinical advice which I have been getting from all the wonderful people on this forum.

Mitzi sent me an incredibly good amount of info in pm's which helped me so much and actually gave me a chance to enjoy church on sunday for a whole hour, and I havent felt an hour like that in such a long time.
God bless you all, and thank you for not leaving me alone in this darkness.
I know Jesus is here also, but its hard sometimes to know when im in this mode, but I know he wont let me give up.

 

[kaykay9.0]

Hello KayKay, yes my parents are catholic and so am I, but im not what you would call a hardcore catholic (my mom is). My uncle and I watch Joel Olsteen and others all the time and I absolutely love the positive message he brings. There is a reason why I chose the screen name that I have. It means that I have gained a new love and respect for all of my christian brothers and sisters everywhere.

My old bible study teacher was a hard-hard-hardcore catholic and he said some things about non catholics that My heart and soul couldnt agree with (thus I dont go to his biblestudies anymore). I recently went to my first non demoninational bible study and it was the most wonderful experience I have had in a bible study. There was no judging, no finger pointing, no gossip and no hatred. Just openess, a close atmosphere and prayer. Everyone presented their problems and we all prayed for them. I was very touched and very moved.

Kaykay , I will do a search on that book, the fact that it may be clinical might be a good thing for me right now. I have got enough "quakers" in my family thinking that "Foosball is from the debil" as adam sandler would say. I really need some good clinical advice which I have been getting from all the wonderful people on this forum.

Mitzi sent me an incredibly good amount of info in pm's which helped me so much and actually gave me a chance to enjoy church on sunday for a whole hour, and I havent felt an hour like that in such a long time.
God bless you all, and thank you for not leaving me alone in this darkness.
I know Jesus is here also, but its hard sometimes to know when im in this mode, but I know he wont let me give up.

Well, that helps me understand a little more where you are right now. When I say the book was a tad "clinical" I guess what I mean is it was technical, as opposed to practical in some respects. However, I do think it had some value for those of us who battle primarily religious OCD primarily. And, I thought your parents might be more accepting of what he had to say since the author is catholic himself.

Glad Mitzi was able to give you some good advice. She has excellent understanding of how this rascal, OCD, works and how to battle it. Hang in there!

 

[Christian-Catholic]

Thanks kaykay for that book title. On a positive note I have finally set an appointment thursday with a professional , and also an appintment tomorrow with a certified hypnotherapist. Thanks everyone for helping me even get to the point of braving the ignorance .
I believe that Jesus brought me to this forum
god bless

 

[kaykay9.0]

Thanks kaykay for that book title. On a positive note I have finally set an appointment thursday with a professional , and also an appintment tomorrow with a certified hypnotherapist. Thanks everyone for helping me even get to the point of braving the ignorance .
I believe that Jesus brought me to this forum
god bless

This forum helped me quite a bit too.

 

[Christian-Catholic]

KayKay, im so glad that it helped you also ::hugs::. Jesus Has really turned you and the otehrs on this thread into Christian Warriors. Right now I think he has assigned me to bootcamp