Obedience to the word of God is NOT optional -if we persist in disobedience we are not saved

Alithis · May 24, 2016

some folkd dont get this yet . but they will

underthe law it is thou shalt not
under grace is .. you will not to . the law of life is never done away with .. it is there to prove guilt for breaking it . but once we are made new creation i christ we abode by it because we are a new creation in christ .
if we go on sining, we are not yet a new creation in christ , we neitther know him nor have we seen him .

Si_monfaith · May 27, 2016

Alithis said:
some folkd dont get this yet . but they will

underthe law it is thou shalt not
under grace is .. you will not to . the law of life is never done away with .. it is there to prove guilt for breaking it . but once we are made new creation i christ we abode by it because we are a new creation in christ .
if we go on sining, we are not yet a new creation in christ , we neitther know him nor have we seen him .

Adam did not know what it was to sin before he chose kge/ml. Jesus set us free from kge by dying for us-rom3:20.
But word after word you presuppose kge.
When wud you take the deliverance that Jesus earned?

NewCreation17 · Jul 17, 2016

ARBITER01 said:
I posted that because the individual that started this thread just had a another thread removed because it was teaching against our Assemblies of GOD theology here. He's not a pentecostal according to his profile, and feels he has a right to teach his brand of Christianity in particular faith areas, even though he is not part of their faith and denomination.

People that are not of our denomination here are only able to make fellowship posts, not teach against our theology.

I do not want to be involved in the postings of dispute/disagreement above, I would just like to insert a reminder to all who will read this about what the will of GOD is. I know GOD wants unity in His people. Unity of the faith, unto a perfect man.
Whatever rules this site makes, I pray is led by the Holy Spirit and is pleasing to GOD.

Ephesians 4:11-16
And he gave some, apostles; and some, prophets; and some, evangelists; and some, pastors and teachers; 12For the perfecting of the saints, for the work of the ministry, for the edifying of the body of Christ: 13Till we all come in the unity of the faith, and of the knowledge of the Son of God, unto a perfect man, unto the measure of the stature of the fulness of Christ: 14That we henceforth be no more children, tossed to and fro, and carried about with every wind of doctrine, by the sleight of men, and cunning craftiness, whereby they lie in wait to deceive; 15But speaking the truth in love, may grow up into him in all things, which is the head, even Christ: 16From whom the whole body fitly joined together and compacted by that which every joint supplieth, according to the effectual working in the measure of every part, maketh increase of the body unto the edifying of itself in love.

Alithis · Jul 18, 2016

Si_monfaith said:
Adam did not know what it was to sin before he chose kge/ml. Jesus set us free from kge by dying for us-rom3:20.
But word after word you presuppose kge.
When wud you take the deliverance that Jesus earned?

word after word i adhere to scripture lol .

Si_monfaith · Jul 18, 2016

Alithis said:
word after word i adhere to scripture lol .

Scripture has both law & grace. Adhere refers to which?

Razare · Jul 19, 2016

Would disobedience include preaching false gospels?

Just curious.

Si_monfaith · Jul 21, 2016

Razare said:
Would disobedience include preaching false gospels?

Just curious.

Preaching obedience as a condition to enter heaven is the same as preaching the law. But Christ is the gospel not law.

Si_monfaith · Jul 21, 2016

Alithis said:
word after word i adhere to scripture lol .

Lust is caused by law (roman 7:5).

So claiming to be obedient without first dying to the law in Christ's death (romans7:4), amounts to just a self righteous pretension.

Soyeong · Jul 21, 2016

PapaZoom said:
Specifically which ones?

Do you believe that Jesus practiced what he preached and preached what he practiced? If so, then look at which commands he obeyed to find out which ones we should obey. After all, we are told to follow his example (1 Peter 2:21-22) and to walk in the same way that he walked (1 John 2:3-6).

Soyeong · Jul 21, 2016

Si_monfaith said:
Lust is caused by law (roman 7:5).

So claiming to be obedient without first dying to the law in Christ's death (romans7:4), amounts to just a self righteous pretension.

In Romans 7:12-25, Paul said that God's law is holy, righteous, and good and that it was the good that he sought to do and delighted in doing, but that there was another law working within him to cause him to not do the good that he wanted to do, which is the law of sin and death. So God's law that reveals to us what sin is and the opposite of that is the law of sin and death that stirs up sin and brings about death.

The difference between self-righteousness and God's righteousness is not in obeying different sets of laws, but in who gets the glory. Two people can do the same righteous action of helping the poor, but one bring glory to themselves, while the other brings glory to God.

PapaZoom · Jul 21, 2016

Soyeong said:
Do you believe that Jesus practiced what he preached and preached what he practiced? If so, then look at which commands he obeyed to find out which ones we should obey. After all, we are told to follow his example (1 Peter 2:21-22) and to walk in the same way that he walked (1 John 2:3-6).

That was from way back in Dec 2015. I have lost the context of the conversation.

Soyeong · Jul 21, 2016

PapaZoom said:
That was from way back in Dec 2015. I have lost the context of the conversation.

Sorry, in post #13, you quoted John 14:15 and asked which about which commands we should keep.

PapaZoom · Jul 21, 2016

Soyeong said:
Sorry, in post #13, you quoted John 14:15 and asked which about which commands we should keep.

I understand but that was 6 months ago and I can't remember the exact context. Clearly it wasn't about that verse.

Soyeong · Jul 21, 2016

PapaZoom said:
I understand but that was 6 months ago and I can't remember the exact context. Clearly it wasn't about that verse.

Feel free to go back to the first page to see what was written, or just look at post #7:
http://www.christianforums.com/thre...ience-we-are-not-saved.7923420/#post-68999911

I don't know what other context there is.

Alithis · Jul 22, 2016

ARBITER01 said:
There was a recent problem over in the Spirit-filled section with false teachings, I think it is best to post the rules here..

House Rules:
All posts within this faith community must adhere to the site wide rules found here (Community Rules). In addition, if you are not a member of this faith group, you may not debate issues or teach against it's theology. You may post in fellowship. Active promotion of views contrary to the established teachings of this group will be considered off topic.

In relation to this thread...

5. The Salvation of Man
Man's only hope of redemption is through the shed blood of Jesus Christ the Son of God.

Conditions to Salvation

Salvation is received through repentance toward God and faith toward the Lord Jesus Christ. By the washing of regeneration and renewing of the Holy Spirit, being justified by grace through faith, man becomes an heir of God, according to the hope of eternal life.

These are nonnegotiable tenets of faith that all Assemblies of God churches adhere to. People may not add to or teach against them here.

stop hijacking my thread with off topic posts . no ones doing that .
he raised the topic of obedience .. its fins to state to what we are to be obedient .
he thinks its the law of moses perhaps . it isn't . it is the law of the spirit of life in chrsit jesus .. to keep what he has commanded is do do what he has said .

Si_monfaith · Jul 22, 2016

Soyeong said:
In Romans 7:12-25, Paul said that God's law is holy, righteous, and good and that it was the good that he sought to do and delighted in doing, but that there was another law working within him to cause him to not do the good that he wanted to do, which is the law of sin and death. So God's law that reveals to us what sin is and the opposite of that is the law of sin and death that stirs up sin and brings about death.

The difference between self-righteousness and God's righteousness is not in obeying different sets of laws, but in who gets the glory. Two people can do the same righteous action of helping the poor, but one bring glory to themselves, while the other brings glory to God.

Nudity is considered as immoral now. But in eden it was normal.

So what is the difference? Knowledge of good & evil (kge) calls it immoral while under grace it is normal.

Kge brought curses/ death not nudity.

Alithis · Jul 22, 2016

Si_monfaith said:
Lust is caused by law (roman 7:5).

So claiming to be obedient without first dying to the law in Christ's death (romans7:4), amounts to just a self righteous pretension.

wonderful then that i was buried into HIS death by baptism and raised up to newness of life by the power of the holy Spirit as a new creation in Chrsit jesus .

new creations in christ are not born of flesh or of sinful nature ,they are born of the nature of Jesus ... so they are obedient creatures .. not rebellious ones .

Alithis · Jul 22, 2016

Si_monfaith said:
Nudity is considered as immoral now. But in eden it was normal.

So what is the difference? Knowledge of good & evil (kge) calls it immoral while under grace it is normal.

Kge brought curses/ death not nudity.

i asked before , did i miss the reply ?

are you a naturist ? you seem to gravitate back to that (not very good analogy ) like you have an agenda.

PapaZoom · Jul 22, 2016

Alithis said:
some like to imply that the bible lies ..when it says do a certain thing they say .. o
"oh no you don't have to do that ,because their word is greater than God's word and we must follow their opinion not God
we must ignore the word of God ..
but God is not mocked and he will judge according to his own word and not peoples amended opinions

The OP is a little unclear so bear with me. I agree that if a person persists in disobedience that it's unlikely they are truly saved. If there is no evidence of salvation, likely that's because the person is unregenerate. It's like this: If a person says they are saved they are also saying that they "follow Christ." If you live in disobedience then you aren't following Christ. If you don't follow Christ, it's clear that person is not a Christian (a Christ follower).

Our obedience however does not save us. But obedience should naturally follow for someone who is saved. So how should we behave? Which commands to follow? Those questions lead to a legalistic frame-work. That is a dangerous way to approach it. We should live in a way that reflects the mind of Christ.
Philippians 2:
5 Let this mind be in you, which was also in Christ Jesus:
6 Who, being in the form of God, thought it not robbery to be equal with God:
7 But made himself of no reputation, and took upon him the form of a servant, and was made in the likeness of men:
8 And being found in fashion as a man, he humbled himself, and became obedient unto death, even the death of the cross.
9 Wherefore God also hath highly exalted him, and given him a name which is above every name:
10 That at the name of Jesus every knee should bow, of things in heaven, and things in earth, and things under the earth;
11 And that every tongue should confess that Jesus Christ is Lord, to the glory of God the Father.
12 Wherefore, my beloved, as ye have always obeyed, not as in my presence only, but now much more in my absence, work out your own salvation with fear and trembling.
13 For it is God which worketh in you both to will and to do of his good pleasure.

Alithis · Jul 22, 2016

PapaZoom said:
The OP is a little unclear so bear with me. I agree that if a person persists in disobedience that it's unlikely they are truly saved. If there is no evidence of salvation, likely that's because the person is unregenerate. It's like this: If a person says they are saved they are also saying that they "follow Christ." If you live in disobedience then you aren't following Christ. If you don't follow Christ, it's clear that person is not a Christian (a Christ follower).

Our obedience however does not save us. But obedience should naturally follow for someone who is saved. So how should we behave? Which commands to follow? Those questions lead to a legalistic frame-work. That is a dangerous way to approach it. We should live in a way that reflects the mind of Christ.
Philippians 2:
5 Let this mind be in you, which was also in Christ Jesus:
6 Who, being in the form of God, thought it not robbery to be equal with God:
7 But made himself of no reputation, and took upon him the form of a servant, and was made in the likeness of men:
8 And being found in fashion as a man, he humbled himself, and became obedient unto death, even the death of the cross.
9 Wherefore God also hath highly exalted him, and given him a name which is above every name:
10 That at the name of Jesus every knee should bow, of things in heaven, and things in earth, and things under the earth;
11 And that every tongue should confess that Jesus Christ is Lord, to the glory of God the Father.
12 Wherefore, my beloved, as ye have always obeyed, not as in my presence only, but now much more in my absence, work out your own salvation with fear and trembling.
13 For it is God which worketh in you both to will and to do of his good pleasure.

i don't disagree with the scripture . but i'm not sure why people get the scalpel out and dissect between the gospel and obedience to it .. its christ that saved for sure .. and he tells us HOW to be saved .
if we refuse to do as he says .. we fool ourselves if we think we will be are or are being saved .

Obedience to the word of God is NOT optional -if we persist in disobedience we are not saved

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