Nothing changes in this forum.

[Speedwell]

Yes there is it's called reality. Reality is and can be proven yes proven that all things have commonality. It can also be proven that all things have DNA which shows what something is and what it is not.

All of which is entirely compatible with evolution.

The real problem is and you said it, people will not accept that the Bible is true . So they will always be looking for an alternative.

Scientists aren't looking for an alternative to the Bible; they are not taking the Bible into account at all, one way or the other.

Because the moment you recognize design you MUST acknowledge a designer. And you may acknowledge that, but take a look at those you have partnered with. They do not and will not no matter what.

Neither will I. Intelligent Design is a Dominionist propaganda hoax based on the logical fallacy of equivocating two different meanings of the word "design." This fallacy is so blatantly obvious that most of us who believe in God are too smart to fall for it.

 

[DogmaHunter]

Once again because the Bible says it didn't.

And once again, there we have it.

Your objection to certain scientific theories, has nothing to do with the science and everything with your a priori religious beliefs.

No point in discussing anything science related, with a mind like that.

 

[rjs330]

But they're digging down and beginning to find what looks like an underground network of branches connecting the trees. They infer that all of the branches stem from a single trunk and there is no reason not to. At the end of the day they may find that there is more than one trunk, but as a working hypothesis there is nothing wrong with the single trunk inference.

They still are only finding separate trees. They are inferring based upon a predisposed theory. They think that what happened so since we find trees that have leaves or trees that have bark, therefore all trees came from one tree. And of course in their minds there is no reason not to believe that. Since they cannot and will not consider common design. Why won't they? Ask that question. Everything they have supposedly found are just facts. They interpret those facts to mean evolution from common ancestor. Why? All those facts just show what is. They interpret that.

They absolutely refuse to acknowledge that it could just as well be common design and you know good and well why not.

All you have to do is read the posts they write. All you have to do is read Romans 1 and you know why.

 

[pitabread]

Yes there are evolutionary approaches, but they are not necessary. Not at all.

And you're basing this on... ?

(Keeping in mind that there are entire biotech companies which base their work on the ToE.)

 

[Speedwell]

They still are only finding separate trees. They are inferring based upon a predisposed theory. They think that what happened so since we find trees that have leaves or trees that have bark, therefore all trees came from one tree. And of course in their minds there is no reason not to believe that. Since they cannot and will not consider common design. Why won't they? Ask that question. Everything they have supposedly found are just facts. They interpret those facts to mean evolution from common ancestor. Why? All those facts just show what is. They interpret that.

They absolutely refuse to acknowledge that it could just as well be common design and you know good and well why not.

All you have to do is read the posts they write. All you have to do is read Romans 1 and you know why.

Of course it could be common design. It could be common design whether life was created many times or just once, whether there were many ancestors or just one common ancestor. The problem is that design, as an hypothesis, is unfalsifiable. That is why it is not "considered." Christians know there is design, even Christians who accept the theory of evolution, but its presence cannot be demonstrated by science.

 

[pitabread]

Yes it does. You just don't want to admit it.

Perhaps the metaphor got lost in your post, but evolution is not about a modern extant species evolving into another modern extant species. Rather, it's about those species sharing a common ancestor.

So I'm not sure if this is just a case of the metaphor being mangled or an incorrect conceptualization of the process.

 

[rjs330]

All of which is entirely compatible with evolution. Scientists aren't looking for an alternative to the Bible; they are not taking the Bible into account at all, one way or the other.

Neither will I. Intelligent Design is a Dominionist propaganda hoax based on the logical fallacy of equivocating two different meanings of the word "design." This fallacy is so blatantly obvious that most of us who believe in God are too smart to fall for it.

No scientists are not looking for an alternative. But you said it yourself. They think of the Bible as a dusty old book. They are not thinking about it at all. However, if they do not consider design as part of the equation there is no other alternative to evolution. So they have effectively ruled out the possibilty. And it's been shown over and over it's a matter of possibilities. What's left? Evolution or ? Creation can't be considered. Well good grief. No wonder evolution is the only answer. ERVs are evolution or? What other possibilities are there in the scientific table. Ermmm.... Nothing. Because comments design cannot even be considered because it leads to a designer. You know this.


Well there you go again with some sort of attack that makes those that believe in the Bible as written as some kind of whacko nut jobs. Intelligent design isn't some sort of hoax. It's a legitimate thought process to point out that design is just as valid as evolution. It's pretty obvious why. God designed creation and he's intelligent. It's not that hard to understand. But again a designer cannot be considered if you are a scientist. Design cannot be considered because there is a designer.

There is not one single shred of the so called evidence that cannot be contributed co design.

 

[rjs330]

And once again, there we have it.

Your objection to certain scientific theories, has nothing to do with the science and everything with your a priori religious beliefs.

No point in discussing anything science related, with a mind like that.

That's baloney and you know it. Just cause I believe the Bible as truth and you don't. Common design is just as valid as evolution. In fact it's more valid because it's the only explanation that is based in reality. Observation of reality tells you this. And ibservatuon of reality supports what the Bible says. Bible first reality second. Evolution is not supported by the Bible and it's not supported by reality.

So there you have it folks. An evolutionist who prefers to have faith in a man made up concept with no real basis is reality.

 

[rjs330]

And you're basing this on... ?

(Keeping in mind that there are entire biotech companies which base their work on the ToE.)

I have yet to have someone give me a medical research program or procedure that has to have evolution as it's basis for it's findings or it cannot be accomplished.

 

[rjs330]

Of course it could be common design. It could be common design whether life was created many times or just once, whether there were many ancestors or just one common ancestor. The problem is that design, as an hypothesis, is unfalsifiable. That is why it is not "considered." Christians know there is design, even Christians who accept the theory of evolution, but its presence cannot be demonstrated by science.

Sure it can. Science does it all the time. If a thing has function and purpose it is designed.

 

[Jimmy D]

No scientists are not looking for an alternative. But you said it yourself. They think of the Bible as a dusty old book. They are not thinking about it at all. However, if they do not consider design as part of the equation there is no other alternative to evolution. So they have effectively ruled out the possibilty.

What about these Creationist "scientists" we keep hearing about? Are they so useless they can't think about these alternatives you're proposing? Discovery Institute, A.I.G etc are multi-million dollar organizations that claim to be doing just what you suggest, are they not? Yet all they can come up with is diddly squat, no published papers, no positive evidence for "design".... zip.

Why should biologists, who know full well that common ancestry is a fact, do their work for them when the "debate" has been settled for over a hundred years?

What's left? Evolution or ? Creation can't be considered. Well good grief. No wonder evolution is the only answer. ERVs are evolution or? What other possibilities are there in the scientific table. Ermmm.... Nothing. Because comments design cannot even be considered because it leads to a designer. You know this.

No, it's not considered because it's unfalsifiable nonsense.

I repeat, "debate" has been settled for over a hundred years. Get over it.

Well there you go again with some sort of attack that makes those that believe in the Bible as written as some kind of whacko nut jobs.

A child-like and naive understanding of the bible has no bearing on observations of the world around us.

Intelligent design isn't some sort of hoax. It's a legitimate thought process to point out that design is just as valid as evolution.

Better send those heroic scientific mavericks over at the Discovery institute a donation and ask them to stop sitting on their hands and do a bit of work then.

But again a designer cannot be considered if you are a scientist. Design cannot be considered because there is a designer.

Yes, no mainstream scientists are Christian are they?

There is not one single shred of the so called evidence that cannot be contributed co design.

There is not one single shred of the so called evidence that cannot be contributed to the "Ghost That never Lies". (Cheers Dogmahunter).

 

[Jimmy D]

That's baloney and you know it. Just cause I believe the Bible as truth and you don't. Common design is just as valid as evolution.

Evolution appears to explain the diversity of species.

How does design do that?

What are the processes involved?

How can we differentiate between mere adaption and divine intervention?

What evidence have we got for special creation of the original kinds?

How is this reflected in the fossil record?

What predictions does "common design" make"?

How can "common design" help us in the field of medicine,agriculture, technology?

 

[Jimmy D]

I have yet to have someone give me a medical research program or procedure that has to have evolution as it's basis for it's findings or it cannot be accomplished.

God forbid you should actually go a look for yourself.


The Evolution and Medicine Review

 

[DogmaHunter]

That's baloney and you know it.

No, it is literally what you said: "because the bible says it didn't"

That's your whole reasoning in a nutshell. That's your first criteria to see if something is ever worth considering or not: does it agree with what the bible says?

That's your starting point. Any science that contradicts the bible (or rather: how you personally interpret the bible), will be handwaved away by you.

Just cause I believe the Bible as truth and you don't.

Indeed, you believe the bible "as truth". So whenever science disagrees with those beliefs, you assume by default that the science must be wrong. Since you already "know" what "the truth" is - it's in your bible. So if science disagrees, then that science by very circular definition can not be the truth. See?

Common design is just as valid as evolution

I understand that your a priori beliefs require you to believe that statement, but it is off course extremely wrong.

In fact it's more valid because it's the only explanation that is based in reality

No. It's an explanation that is based on your understanding of the bible.
Nobody ever concludes "common design" from the evidence... Everybody who claims design/creation, every single time, will do so on the basis of an a priori religious belief that DEMANDS such beliefs.

Bible first reality second.

And again, we have a confirmation of your a priori religious bias.
Indeed, exactly like I said: "bible first, reality second".
So if science disagrees with the bible, you'll go with the bible. Every single time.
Not because of any valid objections to the actual science, mind you.... Rather, JUST because you have already decided on the bible.

So your views on evolution have nothing to do with the science, and everything with your religious beliefs.

Evolution is not supported by the Bible and it's not supported by reality.

I agree it's not supported by the bible.

So there you have it folks. An evolutionist who prefers to have faith in a man made up concept with no real basis is reality.

lol

 

[DogmaHunter]

Really all they have is a bunch if different trees. And since they are all trees the inference is they all came from a common tree. That's all they have. Similarities and commonalitiesz facts that they interpret to mean there is a common tree trunk.

The common tree trunk, factually exists.

Every phylogenetic tree mapped out based on comparative genetics, shows you this trunk.

 

[DogmaHunter]

Y The real problem is and you said it, people will not accept that the Bible is true

In reality, you folks are the only ones who are bringing the bible into this discussion.

Because the moment you recognize design you MUST acknowledge a designer.

Conversly, the moment you have an a priori belief that a designer exists, you need to impose design on reality.

See? This is the difference.

Science starts from the data.
You start from the belief in a designer/creator.

When science finds data that contradicts theories, then science replaces and/or corrects those theories.

When science finds data that contradicts your bible.... you then handwave the data away.

That's the difference between you and a scientist.

 

[Ophiolite]

@rjs330 Still waiting for a reply to my post #301. It's a limited time offer.

 

[Chisel]

I did not say anything about laws.

I'm just saying evolution is a religion.

Just like fake space is. There is no evidence.
It's all CGI and Hollywood studio.

NASA won the AUGMENTED REALITY award.
A technique to manipulate 3D coloured holograms live.
Just like they do on the ISS kiddies tv program, which is filmed in Hollywood.

And it's been proven over and over that every word in the Bible is fact.

Why don't they show it on TV?
Because satan his minions own your media, banks, they basically own the world. Lucifer is God in the public school system.

Ted Gunderson former FBI boss once blew the whistle on a satanic shadow government. Why have you never heard of this? Because they censor it.

Full text of "FBI Whistleblower Ted Gunderson Exposes Mind Control, Satanism, Pedophilia, CIA FINDERS and Drugs - COLLECTION"



9/11 was an inside job. Have you ever seen what a small bird does to a fibreglass plane?

It's impossible for a plane to fly through the wtc.

Newton’s Third Law of Motion: “For every action there is an equal and opposite reaction.” An aluminum plane hitting a thick steel beam will have the same effect as steel beam being swung at the same speed and hitting the plane. It makes no difference which one is moving as to the effect on the plane and the beam. In both cases the thick steel beam will do damage to the plane and the beam will emerge relatively undamaged. The faster the speed at the point of impact, the more damage that will be done to the plane. Try punching a steel girder. No matter how fast your hand is traveling, you will not be able to break through it; you will eventually break your hand. It matters not if the girder is swung at your hand or you swing your hand at the girder; assuming the impact is at the same speed, the injury to your hand would be the same.

Fighter jet crashes into concrete wall.

The planes were holograms and the towers were laced with thermite.

Here educate yourself.

THE PROOF THAT NO REAL PLANES WERE USED ON 9/11

America knew about the attack on pearl harbour in advance. America invaded an innocent Vietnam and then leaked the plans to Vietnam to make sure the war was as bloody and long as possible.

On top of that the army smuggled opium in the caskets of dead soldiers back to US soil to distribute on the market.

Do you know in order to claim your insurance from obamacare you literally have to get run over by a tractor in downtown NY?

There is much. Much more.
The shadow government rules every government.
USA, Germany, China, Korea, Russia,..
So in that sight. Yes, it is a massive conspiracy.

But instead of looking for things that don't make sense.
And asking questions, you blindly believe what the mainstream media and your schools teach you.

Do you know that there was a giant hospital at auschwitz?
A brothel, post office where inmates could freely write with the outside? Swimming pool, giant kitchen,theatre, cinema,school, you name it. It was a labor camp!

The Jewish Holocaust Hoax Exposed

HOLOCAUST OR HOLOHOAX? YOU BE THE JUDGE! – The Official Website Of Andrew Carrington Hitchcock

International Red Cross Report Confirms the Holocaust of Six Million Jews is a Hoax

Here is how many people died in Auschwitz : 52.389
Because of STARVATION and DISEASE

Jesus is coming.
You can still be saved.

 

[DogmaHunter]

I did not say anything about laws.

I'm just saying evolution is a religion.

Just like fake space is. There is no evidence.
It's all CGI and Hollywood studio.

NASA won the AUGMENTED REALITY award.
A technique to manipulate 3D coloured holograms live.
Just like they do on the ISS kiddies tv program, which is filmed in Hollywood.

And it's been proven over and over that every word in the Bible is fact.

Why don't they show it on TV?
Because satan his minions own your media, banks, they basically own the world. Lucifer is God in the public school system.

Ted Gunderson former FBI boss once blew the whistle on a satanic shadow government. Why have you never heard of this? Because they censor it.

Full text of "FBI Whistleblower Ted Gunderson Exposes Mind Control, Satanism, Pedophilia, CIA FINDERS and Drugs - COLLECTION"



9/11 was an inside job. Have you ever seen what a small bird does to a fibreglass plane?

It's impossible for a plane to fly through the wtc.

Newton’s Third Law of Motion: “For every action there is an equal and opposite reaction.” An aluminum plane hitting a thick steel beam will have the same effect as steel beam being swung at the same speed and hitting the plane. It makes no difference which one is moving as to the effect on the plane and the beam. In both cases the thick steel beam will do damage to the plane and the beam will emerge relatively undamaged. The faster the speed at the point of impact, the more damage that will be done to the plane. Try punching a steel girder. No matter how fast your hand is traveling, you will not be able to break through it; you will eventually break your hand. It matters not if the girder is swung at your hand or you swing your hand at the girder; assuming the impact is at the same speed, the injury to your hand would be the same.

Fighter jet crashes into concrete wall.

The planes were holograms and the towers were laced with thermite.

Here educate yourself.

THE PROOF THAT NO REAL PLANES WERE USED ON 9/11

America knew about the attack on pearl harbour in advance. America invaded an innocent Vietnam and then leaked the plans to Vietnam to make sure the war was as bloody and long as possible.

On top of that the army smuggled opium in the caskets of dead soldiers back to US soil to distribute on the market.

Do you know in order to claim your insurance from obamacare you literally have to get run over by a tractor in downtown NY?

There is much. Much more.
The shadow government rules every government.
USA, Germany, China, Korea, Russia,..
So in that sight. Yes, it is a massive conspiracy.

But instead of looking for things that don't make sense.
And asking questions, you blindly believe what the mainstream media and your schools teach you.

Do you know that there was a giant hospital at auschwitz?
A brothel, post office where inmates could freely write with the outside? Swimming pool, giant kitchen,theatre, cinema,school, you name it. It was a labor camp!

The Jewish Holocaust Hoax Exposed

HOLOCAUST OR HOLOHOAX? YOU BE THE JUDGE! – The Official Website Of Andrew Carrington Hitchcock

International Red Cross Report Confirms the Holocaust of Six Million Jews is a Hoax

Here is how many people died in Auschwitz : 52.389
Because of STARVATION and DISEASE

Jesus is coming.
You can still be saved.

LOL!!!!

 

[Jjmcubbin]

I did not say anything about laws.

I'm just saying evolution is a religion.

Just like fake space is. There is no evidence.
It's all CGI and Hollywood studio.

NASA won the AUGMENTED REALITY award.
A technique to manipulate 3D coloured holograms live.
Just like they do on the ISS kiddies tv program, which is filmed in Hollywood.

And it's been proven over and over that every word in the Bible is fact.

Why don't they show it on TV?
Because satan his minions own your media, banks, they basically own the world. Lucifer is God in the public school system.

Ted Gunderson former FBI boss once blew the whistle on a satanic shadow government. Why have you never heard of this? Because they censor it.

Full text of "FBI Whistleblower Ted Gunderson Exposes Mind Control, Satanism, Pedophilia, CIA FINDERS and Drugs - COLLECTION"



9/11 was an inside job. Have you ever seen what a small bird does to a fibreglass plane?

It's impossible for a plane to fly through the wtc.

Newton’s Third Law of Motion: “For every action there is an equal and opposite reaction.” An aluminum plane hitting a thick steel beam will have the same effect as steel beam being swung at the same speed and hitting the plane. It makes no difference which one is moving as to the effect on the plane and the beam. In both cases the thick steel beam will do damage to the plane and the beam will emerge relatively undamaged. The faster the speed at the point of impact, the more damage that will be done to the plane. Try punching a steel girder. No matter how fast your hand is traveling, you will not be able to break through it; you will eventually break your hand. It matters not if the girder is swung at your hand or you swing your hand at the girder; assuming the impact is at the same speed, the injury to your hand would be the same.

Fighter jet crashes into concrete wall.

The planes were holograms and the towers were laced with thermite.

Here educate yourself.

THE PROOF THAT NO REAL PLANES WERE USED ON 9/11

America knew about the attack on pearl harbour in advance. America invaded an innocent Vietnam and then leaked the plans to Vietnam to make sure the war was as bloody and long as possible.

On top of that the army smuggled opium in the caskets of dead soldiers back to US soil to distribute on the market.

Do you know in order to claim your insurance from obamacare you literally have to get run over by a tractor in downtown NY?

There is much. Much more.
The shadow government rules every government.
USA, Germany, China, Korea, Russia,..
So in that sight. Yes, it is a massive conspiracy.

But instead of looking for things that don't make sense.
And asking questions, you blindly believe what the mainstream media and your schools teach you.

Do you know that there was a giant hospital at auschwitz?
A brothel, post office where inmates could freely write with the outside? Swimming pool, giant kitchen,theatre, cinema,school, you name it. It was a labor camp!

The Jewish Holocaust Hoax Exposed

HOLOCAUST OR HOLOHOAX? YOU BE THE JUDGE! – The Official Website Of Andrew Carrington Hitchcock

International Red Cross Report Confirms the Holocaust of Six Million Jews is a Hoax

Here is how many people died in Auschwitz : 52.389
Because of STARVATION and DISEASE

Jesus is coming.
You can still be saved.

I can't tell of this is sarcasm or not.