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not a joke

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longhair75

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Groce said:
Thats because all the people who would disagree have been driven off.


friend grace,

i would rather that those that would disagree had stayed. i am pleased that you have chosen to remain. i am interested in the polite discourse of our differences rather than the exit of those with whom i may or may not disagree.

now, if i may call your kind attention to the request i made of you regarding information casting doubt upon the validity of the reverend jepson's ordination.......
 
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No Swansong

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Groce said:
Ok not all but many.

I know Aymn left, for which we are saddened, but who else? There never have been very many of us here to begin with. I've been a part of STR since its inception, so has Cola neither of us remember a lot of conservatives, at least in comparison.
 
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Groce

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masuwerte said:
Maybe we could say something nice about Rev. Jepson, about her anti-abortion stance perhaps. It's good that someone with that opinion is in a position to influence young women.
Well at least she pro-life. That is nice. But the point was not pro-life, ordination of women, or any thing else other than the fact that the way that she presents herself here detracts form her position and is unprofessional.
 
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Groce

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jtbdad said:
I know Aymn left, for which we are saddened, but who else? There never have been very many of us here to begin with. I've been a part of STR since its inception, so has Cola neither of us remember a lot of conservatives, at least in comparison.
Paleodoxy is gone too. Many no that was the wrong word, maybe half of them are gone. Either way their voice is no longer here, and its easy to see why.
 
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Polycarp1

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I honor and respect conservatives like Colabomb and jtbdad (and Aaron too) even while disagreeing strenuously with them -- sometimes, I'm afraid, too outspokenly for charitability. I'm back from a three-months self-enforced leave for exactly the same reasons, and I'd hope that Aaron at least will return. My choice was for the same reason: a sense that too-aggressive voices were slapping down views I cherished, in my own congregational forum. What Pam and others have requested is that we try to respect each other and address the issues that divide us with some degree of respect for differing viewpoints.

To answer your questions, Groce, my cite for the validity of her ordination would be the appropriate canon of the Church of England authorizing such ordination. Unless you have yourself been named archbishop, you do not have authority to tell a given church whom they may or may not ordain. You do have every right to decide whose ordinations you believe not to have been valid, and to state your own opinion on this matter -- ideally, showing respect for those who hold a different view. (BTW, "priestess" is about as insulting as you can get; she is a priest of the church, or not. I trust you would not insist that we refer to karen as "Moderatoress" in token of her gender?

My request was not that you suppress your own views, but that you express them with courtesy towards other Anglicans who would disagree with your stance. And I'd expect to be held to the same standard of conduct.
 
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longhair75

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friend grace,

my brother polycarp stated much more eloquently what i was trying to say. i too am saddened by the exit of those few posters. i am also interested in your viewpoint, and welcome you to the discussions here.

the slight tangent that this thread has taken is a result of the point of doubt you stated as to the validity of her ordination. had you not made this assertion, the discussion of her choice of wardrobe would have continued.

these questions are not a personal attack, but rather a polite request for clarification of your point.

if you are not interested in supporting your allegation, i will withdraw my questions with my apology for derailing your thread.
 
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longhair75

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john23237 said:
What does this picture prove? At worse, it would suggest that on a single day, a single female priest did not exhibit the best in taste in the selection of her attire. No man has ever done that? Right!


friend john, what you say is true. i am now wearing cut off jeans, sandals and a grateful dead tee shirt.
 
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higgs2

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Groce said:
18240225_aea8bd8ee8.jpg


I thought this was a joke, or an adult entertainer. But its not. Very inappropriate for a "priest".


http://www.getreligion.org/?p=1754
I don't get it. What is the problem? Seems fine to me.
 
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No Swansong

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higgs2 said:
I don't get it. What is the problem? Seems fine to me.

For me (and I would apply this to any man as well) I believe that if the clerical collar is being worn (as should be in the performance of many ministerial functions) the shirt should be closed. I think it is very tacky to have the collar close the neck but have an open and uncovered chest. (no I did not say cleavage as none is showing) I feel this is (perhaps just because of convention) disrespectful to the collar. I would feel just the same about any man wearing the same.

Additionally the shirt itself seems to be tailored to be form fitting. While I believe this can be tastefully done, it seems inappropriate to me to wear clothing that is intended to accentuate a womans breast and a clerical collar. The collar is an indicator of a representative of the Church and purposely taking attention away from it detracts from the office.

But this is just my own personal opinion coming from a man who believes that priests should wear cassocks. (weather permitting)
 
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HistoryMaker

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[BIBLE]Though I am free and belong to no man, I make myself a slave to everyone, to win as many as possible. To the Jews I became like a Jew, to win the Jews. To those under the law I became like one under the law (though I myself am not under the law), so as to win those under the law. To those not having the law I became like one not having the law (though I am not free from God's law but am under Christ's law), so as to win those not having the law. To the weak I became weak, to win the weak. I have become all things to all men so that by all possible means I might save some. 1 Corinthians 9:19-22[/BIBLE]

Maybe it is a little inappropriate, but consider that she is going to work in a fashion college. Would the people working there feel they could interact more easily with someone who is fashion concious?
 
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No Swansong

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HistoryMaker said:
[bible]Though I am free and belong to no man, I make myself a slave to everyone, to win as many as possible. To the Jews I became like a Jew, to win the Jews. To those under the law I became like one under the law (though I myself am not under the law), so as to win those under the law. To those not having the law I became like one not having the law (though I am not free from God's law but am under Christ's law), so as to win those not having the law. To the weak I became weak, to win the weak. I have become all things to all men so that by all possible means I might save some. 1 Corinthians 9:19-22[/bible]

Maybe it is a little inappropriate, but consider that she is going to work in a fashion college. Would the people working there feel they could interact more easily with someone who is fashion concious?


That may be true but where do you draw the line? I am not arguing slippery slope here I am just asking what determines what is and is not acceptable. I mean if she was at the beach should she wear a collar and a bikini?
 
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Polycarp1

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jtbdad said:
That may be true but where do you draw the line? I am not arguing slippery slope here I am just asking what determines what is and is not acceptable. I mean if she was at the beach should she wear a collar and a bikini?

Well, prior to becoming a bishop, the very conservative Bishop of Albany (NY) took on a small-town parish close to the brink of closure and rebuilt it into one of the stronger parishes in the diocese, a vibrant largely young adult community alive with a glowing Anglican spirit. At the behest of friends in our own parish who knew them, we went to visit there on a regular basis, and had a truly outstanding spiritual experience as sort of adjunct members of the community.

I tell this story because of the annual parish picnic one year, held on the shore of the St. Lawrence River. An adult catechumen was ready for baptism, and as a gesture to Early-Church tradition he and she together decided that it would be by full-immersion in the river at the picnic. And he celebrated that baptism standing waist deep in the water wearing a pair of Bermuda shorts and a stole -- exactly right for the circumstances.

Casual garb worn out of disrespect for tradition is wrong. Casual garb worn because it's the appropriate clothing for the circumstances is the Church reaching out to people where they are.

(As a sidelight, he's also the bishop who has agreed to provide "alternative episcopal oversight" to the conservative Epispocal churches of New Hampshire, by agreement with the Bishop of New Hampshire and the dissident parishes.)
 
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No Swansong

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Polycarp1 said:
Well, prior to becoming a bishop, the very conservative Bishop of Albany (NY) took on a small-town parish close to the brink of closure and rebuilt it into one of the stronger parishes in the diocese, a vibrant largely young adult community alive with a glowing Anglican spirit. At the behest of friends in our own parish who knew them, we went to visit there on a regular basis, and had a truly outstanding spiritual experience as sort of adjunct members of the community.

I tell this story because of the annual parish picnic one year, held on the shore of the St. Lawrence River. An adult catechumen was ready for baptism, and as a gesture to Early-Church tradition he and she together decided that it would be by full-immersion in the river at the picnic. And he celebrated that baptism standing waist deep in the water wearing a pair of Bermuda shorts and a stole -- exactly right for the circumstances.

Casual garb worn out of disrespect for tradition is wrong. Casual garb worn because it's the appropriate clothing for the circumstances is the Church reaching out to people where they are.

(As a sidelight, he's also the bishop who has agreed to provide "alternative episcopal oversight" to the conservative Epispocal churches of New Hampshire, by agreement with the Bishop of New Hampshire and the dissident parishes.)


And I've been to a mass in which the celebrant wore swimming trunks and a miss piggy t shirt along with a stole.
As far as sinful I would say no she is not dressed sinfully, nor was the individual who performed the baptism. (nor the miss piggy wearing Roman Catholic priest)
However I was speaking of appropriateness which is a matter of opinion. My opinion is that none of these were adorned appropriately. (with that said however I would always opt for inappropriately dressed ministry as opposed to no ministry.)
 
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