Noahs ark

[artybloke]

But .... but....but....Jesus believed it happened. Was he wrong?

Jesus lived in the first century AD. Even if it could be proved that he "believed it happened" (rather than merely used it as an illustration in another argument, rather as one might talk of someone having the strength of Hercules,) there is no way he could have known whether it happened or not.

Unless, of course, Jesus wasn't really human but merely a god in disguise. Then he would know everything. Of course, if you say that, the incarnation is null and void, salvation means nothing, and you might as well go and join the nearest Arian church.

 

[Your Neighbor]

Jesus referred to Noah as a real person. Believe Jesus.

1. Matthew 24:37
   But as the days of Noah were, so shall also the coming of the Son of man be.
   Matthew 24:36-38 (in Context) Matthew 24 (Whole Chapter)
2. Luke 17:27
   They did eat, they drank, they married wives, they were given in marriage, until the day that Noah entered into the ark, and the flood came, and destroyed them all.
   Luke 17:26-28 (in Context) Luke 17 (Whole Chapter)

 

[karen freeinchristman]

No, I'm saying, it doesn't matter to me if it is or not. The meaning of the story is deeper than "How many animals can you fit into a wooden structure?".

Fairies stories, myths, legends, fiction, poetry, parables, are not lies. They tell the truth, but they tell it through the imagination. The story of the Ark is an imaginative story with lots of profound truth contained in it. To turn it into a historical, scientifically viable account of reality is not only absurd but a gross injustice to the writers.
..........
If the Devil were thinking up a way of making Christianity look foolish and unbelievable, he couldn't do better than the literalist interpretators of Genesis.

The world being young, their food would be still very nutritious in comparison to what we have today with the result that overall the intelligence of the general population would be greater than it is today

Never before have I heard of this idea.

a) There is sufficient evidence that Jesus existed to make it at least plausible.

b) Whether Jesus is or is not the Son of God is not a matter that can be decided using scientific means, but only by faith. It's not a "historical" event that can have evidence; it's a theological and philosophical event, a spiritual truth. It's not something you can test in a test-tube.

c) The story of Noah, however, is either a story or it is historical fact. If it is a story, it doesn't matter if it's factual or not, it's still true. If it is "fact" then it ought to have left physical evidence that supports it. It doesn't; in fact, there is quite positive evidence that no worldwide flood occured at any time in the history of this planet (and certainly not 4000 years ago.) As there is evidence of several extinction events, volcanic activity going back 3 billion years etc etc, you'd think there was something. But nada, zilch, nothing.

d) If Jesus isn't the Son of God, then there goes Christianity. If Noah never existed, but is in fact a mythical/legendary figure based on a rewriting of parts of the Epic of Gilgamesh (as seems to fit the facts), then it doesn't affect anything in Christianity.

f) There is no science in "(Wrong)Answers in Genesis." Try www.talkorigins.org.

Jesus lived in the first century AD. Even if it could be proved that he "believed it happened" (rather than merely used it as an illustration in another argument, rather as one might talk of someone having the strength of Hercules,) there is no way he could have known whether it happened or not.

Unless, of course, Jesus wasn't really human but merely a god in disguise. Then he would know everything. Of course, if you say that, the incarnation is null and void, salvation means nothing, and you might as well go and join the nearest Arian church.

 

[ContentInHim]

It must be difficult to keep your faith if you don't believe scripture which has been prepared for us.

 

[karen freeinchristman]

It must be difficult to keep your faith if you don't believe scripture which has been prepared for us.

The belief lies in the truths revealed to the Israelites through their oral story-telling over centuries and centuries of living lives devoted to listening to God's will for them and for their people. I would think it would be even more difficult to try to believe in some kind of literal historical meaning to those stories - many do not add up.

I'm at work right now, and so I don't have to hand a great resource that I have at home - I will post more about this later.

 

[IamAdopted]

This is what I see. Man cannot explain God. So therefore it must be myth or hearsay. Bringing it down to naturalism. When in fact it is a fact of Noah and the Flood. Just as Jonah and the fish ect. God can make something out of nothing for He alone is creator. Just because it does not make sense does not mean it did not happen. You can either turn to science which brings in natualism with is bringing all creation into mans way of thinking to explain how it must have happened because it could not of happened any other way because they forget that God can create man out of dust so therefore He can cause the expanse in between the heavens and the earth. For this just does not make sense to the natural man.

 

[ContentInHim]

The belief lies in the truths revealed to the Israelites through their oral story-telling over centuries and centuries of living lives devoted to listening to God's will for them and for their people. I would think it would be even more difficult to try to believe in some kind of literal historical meaning to those stories - many do not add up.

I'm at work right now, and so I don't have to hand a great resource that I have at home - I will post more about this later.

Resources, such as post-modern "christian" scholars no longer interest me. Their "scholarship" has a distinctly unbelieving bent. Thank you, though.

 

[karen freeinchristman]

This is what I see. Man cannot explain God. So therefore it must be myth or hearsay. Bringing it down to naturalism. When in fact it is a fact of Noah and the Flood. Just as Jonah and the fish ect. God can make something out of nothing for He alone is creator. Just because it does not make sense does not mean it did not happen. You can either turn to science which brings in natualism with is bringing all creation into mans way of thinking to explain how it must have happened because it could not of happened any other way because they forget that God can create man out of dust so therefore He can cause the expanse in between the heavens and the earth. For this just does not make sense to the natural man.

I don't see this as having anything to do with science. It is looking at the Bible by way of narrative criticism. Looking at the Bible this way does not discredit it. Consider Shakespeare. There are many truths revealed through the literature of Shakespeare. In the same way, the Bible reveals truths through its stories, whether they actually occured historically or not. In the case of the bible, the truth is about our relationship with God and the sending of his Son.

 

[karen freeinchristman]

Resources, such as post-modern "christian" scholars no longer interest me. Their "scholarship" has a distinctly unbelieving bent. Thank you, though.

OK, you don't have to read it then, when I post it.

 

[Your Neighbor]

This is what I see. Man cannot explain God. So therefore it must be myth or hearsay.

Jesus said it happened.
Noah entered into the ark, and the flood came, and destroyed them all

Do you believe Jesus?

 

[IamAdopted]

I don't see this as having anything to do with science. It is looking at the Bible by way of narrative criticism. Looking at the Bible this way does not discredit it. Consider Shakespeare. There are many truths revealed through the literature of Shakespeare. In the same way, the Bible reveals truths through its stories, whether they actually occured historically or not. In the case of the bible, the truth is about our relationship with God and the sending of his Son.

The bible is truth. Not God telling us some bedtime storie to entertain us. The truth is from the beginning to the end. My God and Father is not a God of fairy tales. Sorry. My God is absolute. IT is man that brings us Fairy tales and myths.

 

[IamAdopted]

Jesus said it happened.
Noah entered into the ark, and the flood came, and destroyed them all

Do you believe Jesus?

YOu need to read all my post.

 

[LoG]

Never before have I heard of this idea.

That nutrition has a direct bearing on intelligence or that the Earth at that time was more fertile?

 

[karen freeinchristman]

That nutrition has a direct bearing on intelligence or that the Earth at that time was more fertile?

That vegetables were more nutritionally valuable than they are now.

 

[karen freeinchristman]

The bible is truth. Not God telling us some bedtime storie to entertain us. The truth is from the beginning to the end. My God and Father is not a God of fairy tales. Sorry. My God is absolute. IT is man that brings us Fairy tales and myths.

I agree with you that the bible is truth. You don't have to be sorry. I understand.

 

[WarriorAngel]

Noah is part of the line to Christ.

The OT is both a foreshadow of Christ...and His ancestry to human form.

 

[mushowani]

if God was capable of creating and furnishing the universe... do you think it would be a difficult thing for him to command animals to pay heed to the call of man. If God could bring all the animals into existance, can it be difficult for Him to command them into doing something as simple as going up the [bless and do not curse][bless and do not curse][bless and do not curse][bless and do not curse] into the ark. If man can coz animals to behave in a way, why is it that man doubts it when it come from God.I believe there was no science involved,...it was just the super natural power of God at work through Noah. If you dont believe, how then can you explain the miraculous works being done by God such as healings

 

[OrthodoxyUSA]

*OrthodoxyUSA unsubscribes*

Forgive me...

 

[artybloke]

So therefore it must be myth or hearsay

Myth is not the same as hearsay. It is a fictional and imaginative and very deep form of literature intended to convey deep spiritual truths through story.

Once again:

Myths are true. Just not historical.

 

[EnemyPartyII]

if God was capable of creating and furnishing the universe... do you think it would be a difficult thing for him to command animals to pay heed to the call of man. If God could bring all the animals into existance, can it be difficult for Him to command them into doing something as simple as going up the [bless and do not curse][bless and do not curse][bless and do not curse][bless and do not curse] into the ark. If man can coz animals to behave in a way, why is it that man doubts it when it come from God.I believe there was no science involved,...it was just the super natural power of God at work through Noah. If you dont believe, how then can you explain the miraculous works being done by God such as healings

If God created the universe... why go to all the trouble of having Noah Build a Ark? Why go to all the trouble of having a flood at all? God could simply blink all the unvirtuous out of existence, and not need to bother with the whole Flood/Ark thing.

The Biblical account is based on retold stories of a real flood, sure. Probably the Black sea inundation. However, a Global Flood never happened. First, there is no physical evidence it ever happened, and we would expect there to be. Second, where did all the water go?

Next, the Ark... now sure, someone may have survived a flood on a boat with some animals and his family... but actually building a boat to literally take a representative of EVERY animal species on Earth is just WAY to impractical, and way beyond the technological abilities of the humans at the time.

So, Noah's Ark and Flood... its a nice story, but it never happened. Maybe based on an element of truth and fact somewhere, but to insist that the Biblical account is literally true and completely accurate, is very misguided.