New data on response in business to #metoo

[Prodigal Son returns]

Nithavela I thought you were going to answer yes for a minute there... LoL

 

[Nithavela]

Nithavela I thought you were going to answer yes for a minute there... LoL

What I will say is that all allegations should be taken serious and investigated unless there are solid reasons not to (like a history of false allegations by the accuser).

Just like with every other crime.

 

[bèlla]

Before we castigate the fairer sex and send her home let’s keep in mind that most men aren’t high wage earners and cannot afford to support their families on one income. And many don’t want to make the lifestyle changes and sacrifices to accommodate it.

 

[Christ is Lord]

Before we castigate the fairer sex and send her home let’s keep in mind that most men aren’t high wage earners and cannot afford to support their families on one income. And many don’t want to make the lifestyle changes and sacrifices to accommodate it.

I always say it’s really up the the person. If they can afford to have one spouse work while the other is the primary care taker then I see no reason to judge. There is such a thing as a house husband. ;-)

 

[Nithavela]

Before we castigate the fairer sex and send her home let’s keep in mind that most men aren’t high wage earners and cannot afford to support their families on one income. And many don’t want to make the lifestyle changes and sacrifices to accommodate it.

There are some people who argue that women joining the workforce is one of the reason for low wages.

 

[bèlla]

I always say it’s really up the the person. If they can afford to have one spouse work while the other is the primary care taker then I see no reason to judge. There is such a thing as a house husband. ;-)

I would never go that route but I know it works for some. ;-)

 

[bèlla]

There are some people who argue that women joining the workforce is one of the reason for low wages.

It is easier to blame her than realize the powers that be were securing their position and limiting mobility for others. At Satan’s behest of course. It was meant to crush his spirit.

 

[Nithavela]

It is easier to blame her than realize the powers that be were securing their position and limiting mobility for others. At Satan’s behest of course. It was meant to crush his spirit.

It's easy to blame women. It's even easier to blame satan.

 

[bèlla]

It's easy to blame women. It's even easier to blame satan.

We needn’t blame anyone. Just follow the trail and see where it ends. I think these quotes suffice:

The hardest thing to explain is the glaringly evident which everybody has decided not to see.

There’s more than one way to skin a cat. The skinning isn’t important once you’ve broken its spine.

Is he broken yet? Time will tell.

 

[Nithavela]

We needn’t blame anyone. Just follow the trail and see where it ends. I think these quotes suffice:

The hardest thing to explain is the glaringly evident which everybody has decided not to see.

There’s more than one way to skin a cat. The skinning isn’t important once you’ve broken its spine.

Is he broken yet? Time will tell.

In my experience it generally ends in the bank accounts of rich people.

 

[Prodigal Son returns]

But for women it's easiest to blame men. The patriarchy, toxic masculinity, rape culture.

There are some people who argue that women joining the workforce is one of the reason for low wages.

I do. Feminism wasn't even invented by women it was invented by the capitalist elite.
They convinced women that going to work would be for their own benefit.

 

[bèlla]

Wealthy men are the greatest benefactors of the demise of their sex. Women were one of many instruments they’ve used to bring it about.

 

[Nithavela]

I do. Feminism wasn't even invented by women it was invented by the capitalist elite.

Oh no, not the elite!

 

[AlexDTX]

Many women do not want to be mothers and will instead choose a career right out of school. You can't avoid attractive women and you can't keep them out of the workforce. You can, however, control your own thoughts and emotions.

Doesn't change the will of God, and one part of self control is avoiding temptation.

 

[comana]

Doesn't change the will of God, and one part of self control is avoiding temptation.

If a man can’t control his temptation around women then it is on him to find another work place without women or find a way to control his mind.

 

[AlexDTX]

If a man can’t control his temptation around women then it is on him to find another work place without women or find a way to control his mind.

On this, I agree.

 

[Ana the Ist]

I think it depends, and can't be decided by a blanket approach. Allegations just being dismissed is how people get away with doing the wrong thing... over and over and over again.

I don't know what you mean by "just get dismissed". If we're going to consider evidence, then we're investigating allegations.

The thing is, when an allegation is made, it's either dismissed or taken seriously. For far too long they were routinely dismissed. Now they're slightly more likely to be taken seriously, followed up on, investigated, and acted on; and that is a good thing.

Sure but some of these are allegations with zero evidence from years ago.

Nobody wants a lynch mob, but overall, a culture where people (mostly men) routinely doing the wrong thing and getting away with it isn't tolerated any more is a good thing.

It's not that good for those men facing false allegations. I don't think they're common either...but they happen. You can't really blame men for not wanting to risk their livelihood over the possibility that they will be falsely accused.

 

[Paidiske]

Yes, Paidiske, I have explained how it works, and you simply deny it.

No, you haven't. You've claimed it works, but you haven't said how you make it work.

So you have a situation where your work would (normally) put you one-on-one with a woman, with no one else around. What do you do? Whom do you ask to chaperone? Do you have someone willing and available? Or do you avoid that work duty?

In absolutely practical terms, what are the strategies you employ to make this possible?

Because I know I couldn't, so I really do want to know how others manage to make it possible while never disadvantaging someone else.

That is correct. Women were created by God to help men, and to be mothers.

No. Women were created by God to be men's partners, including in work (initially of exercising dominion over the garden, today, for Christians, in mission and ministry). We're not just domestic servants and baby factories.

If a young man wants to raise a godly family, he does not need to have young women around him that could be a temptation away from his wife and children, when his youthful lust is strongest.

That seems really extreme to me, but the answer isn't to refuse to allow young women to work.

A woman can have a career after she raises a family, and when youthful lust is tamed with age.

What about single women? Are they not allowed to support themselves?

Do you honestly believe society is better off with divorce and broken homes - including a divorce rate up to half the Christian homes? Do you really believe the world is better off with mothers in the workforce delegating their child rearing to day care centers? Do you really believe the world is better off for the children who have absentee fathers and mothers, as well as being exposed to child predators at the day care centers? If you do, you are not helping the kingdom of God.

That is only one part of the picture. I believe that the world is better off when an abused spouse has a way out of the marriage. I believe the world is better off when parents have options about how to manage work and having children. (Note: I am a parent who works and I have not ever used a day care centre. They're not the only option).

I also believe that the world is better off that, for example, I'm not doomed to repeat my grandmother's life; married at 16 to an abusive man, mother of eight, never finishing even high school, dependent on the men in her life because she had no capacity to support herself. In contrast, I'm incredibly grateful to have had a good education, the ability to be employed, to choose my marriage partner (and choose to leave if he were ever abusive, although I'm fortunate that hasn't happened), to choose the number of children I want to bear.

I'm not trapped by my circumstances in the way so many women in the past were, and I certainly believe the world is better off for that.

But for women it's easiest to blame men. The patriarchy, toxic masculinity, rape culture.

That's not blaming men. It's blaming the cultural environment which hurts both men and women. Men are hurt by patriarchy, toxic masculinity, and rape culture as well.

You can't really blame men for not wanting to risk their livelihood over the possibility that they will be falsely accused.

No. I only blame them when they then act badly towards women.

 

[JohnAshton]

Paidiske, yes, you are wrong.

I explained it, and you don't like it.

Tough. I bet your bosses are covenanters.

 

[Paidiske]

Tough. I bet your bosses are covenanters.

Given that the last meeting I had with my bishop was in my home with no one else there, I can be pretty confident that that's not the case.