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In the case of those on Earth - Rom 8:14 is keyI am still working on defining Sons of God which I believe is the key.
Because the same word is translated "giants" in the OT by many translations when speaking of events after the flood. They are large as compared "to us". Notice that when Israel first goes into Canaan they immediately complain about "giants". But when Abraham goes there - not one single complaint from him about there being giants in Canaan.How would Adam (whom God formed from the ground) and Eve (who was made from his side) be considered Nephilim?
Indeed because "In those days" refers to "The days before the flood"Only since after men began to multiply long after them and then points out
Gen 6:4 There were giants in the earth in **those days**;
and also after that,
**when** the sons of God came in unto the **daughters of** men,
and **they bare children** to them,
**the same became** mighty men which were of old, men of renown.
They are humans.Are the Nephilim human or sub-human? Will they rise again on the last day?
Are the Nephilim human or sub-human?
6 And the angels who did not keep their 3proper domain, but left their own abode, He has reserved in everlasting chains under darkness for the judgment of the great day;Thanks
Jude 6–8 also has to be considered.
What makes Lamech "Nephilim" in that verse?They are humans.
: And Lamech said unto his wives, Adah and Zillah, Hear my voice; ye wives of Lamech, hearken unto my speech: for I have slain a man to my wounding, and a young man to my hurt. If Cain shall be avenged sevenfold, truly Lamech seventy and sevenfold.
here is described everything required to be Nephilim. Lamech being the first.
Maybe consider Lamech of Cain's line as the first Nephilim. The dawn of a worldwide culture of warrior males who fight and kill for the right to breed and breeding success is status. Also, genetics would naturally favor the biggest and strongest males.In the case of those on Earth - Rom 8:14 is key
But if you look beyond Earth - to texts like Job 1 and Job 2 - they could most certainly include sinless beings from some place else - possibly holy angels.
However in Gen 6 it is clear that Nepehilim do not originate after the sons of God (Seth's people) marry with the daughters of men (Cain's people), but rather before that.
And if you look at Matt 22 - Jesus said that by design (of their creation) angels as beings, as a species - do not even form family units with each other - much less having the attributes that would allow them to form cross-species family units.
Cain wasn't killing a breeding rival but a religious rivalWhat makes Lamech "Nephilim" in that verse?
Cain rose up and killed Able. If all it takes the act of murdering another human - that would make Cain Nephilim in your model.
Where is the "breeding rival" in anything that exists in Gen 6?? Even Lamech does not say "I killed a man because of concerns about breeding"Cain wasn't killing a breeding rival but a religious rival
I don't see anything in the entire book of Genesis that says Nephilim are a "culture of warrior males who fight and kill for the right to breed"Maybe consider Lamech of Cain's line as the first Nephilim. The dawn of a worldwide culture of warrior males who fight and kill for the right to breed
Lamech is the first polygamist. If some men have many some have none. Polygamy creates highly competitive males. Also a culture centered on successful spreading of genes. For males it's to impregnae as many women as possible. For females it's to unite with the most powerful male and ay with him.I don't see anything in the entire book of Genesis that says Nephilim are a "culture of warrior males who fight and kill for the right to breed"
Then Lamech said to his wives: “Adah and Zillah, hear my voice; Wives of Lamech, listen to my speech! For I have killed a man for wounding me, Even a young man for hurting me.
Does not say - "I killed him for the right to breed".
There are many examples in the Bible of someone with multiple wives who did not have to kill someone for the right to breed.
The Nephilim emerge as great from a polygamous culture.Where is the "breeding rival" in anything that exists in Gen 6?? Even Lamech does not say "I killed a man because of concerns about breeding"
Bob, thanks for considering the possibility.I don't see anything in the entire book of Genesis that says Nephilim are a "culture of warrior males who fight and kill for the right to breed"
Then Lamech said to his wives: “Adah and Zillah, hear my voice; Wives of Lamech, listen to my speech! For I have killed a man for wounding me, Even a young man for hurting me.
Does not say - "I killed him for the right to breed"
There are many examples in the Bible of someone with multiple wives who did not have to kill someone for the right to breed.
I do agree with you I had posted verses earlier showing as muchBecause the same word is translated "giants" in the OT by many translations when speaking of events after the flood.
Again I agree it states so muchThey are large as compared "to us".
Yeah, there was only three children of Anak there, Ahiman, Sheshai, and Talmai (Numbers 13:22) and their complaints about the giants being there was considered an evil report (Numbers 13:32) Then read the following chapter it pretty much centered around their grumbling about them and the LORD saying, "I will smite them with the pestilence, and disinherit them"Notice that when Israel first goes into Canaan they immediately complain about "giants". But when Abraham goes there - not one single complaint from him about there being giants in Canaan.
Indeed because "In those days" refers to "The days before the flood"
The text simply points out that the Nephilim that were already there - in those days before the flood --
continued to be there even after the mixed marriages of Gen 6.
So Adam and Eve qualify as living "in those days" that is those days "before the flood"
@BobRyan makes a compelling argument that they were, I am still working on defining Sons of God which I believe is the key.
@BobRyan makes a compelling argument that they were, I am still working on defining Sons of God which I believe is the key.
What makes Lamech "Nephilim" in that verse?
Cain rose up and killed Able. If all it takes the act of murdering another human - that would make Cain Nephilim in your model.
Angels were not given the ability to pro-create ... they neither marry ... nor are taken in marriage.Are the Nephilim human or sub-human? Will they rise again on the last day?
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